Golf GTI -v- Toyota FT86

[jessv3]

Not intending to sound smart and hope I am not going to offend you here but have you actually done any research on the 86? The engine is new, it has little in common with an N/A Subaru Imprezza or Liberty... other than that it is a boxer

86 - 1/4 mile - 14.7.. what does a GTI do? 14.5? I have read as slow as 15.1.. I'm not saying the GTI is slower, it would be faster but not by a lot.

Wakefield times.. Stock 86 GTS does a 1:13 (1:16 in the wet)... don't know what a GTI does but bet it's not much faster.

I'm not trying to get into a debate here.. it just seems a lot of people seem to claim performance is the cars weak point... but how many other cars in the same price range are as quick? They start at 29k for the base model.. you are talking Golf TSI money..

Just out of curiosity, how much research have you done on the 86 engine? You do realise it has 205nm of torque at 6400rpm right? The GTI has 280nm as low as 1700rpm and held through to 5200rpm, so the 86 may be comparable to a GTI on drag strip but it will never be comparable in terms of driveability. All that extra low down torque just makes the entire driving experience so much more enjoyable, no need to constantly shift back and work the engine hard.

KW is not everything, lack of torque can entirely change your perspective on things. My drive is an MKV GTI and my partners drive is an 06 DC5 Integra Type-S which is very comparable to an 86, i.e a 2ltr non turbo, low torque high powered engine. Let me just say, although the DC5 keeps up with the GTI when you are playing traffic lights grand prix it falls behind in every other scenario. I.e going through a round about, if you quickly need to nail it and you are in the wrong gear the DC5 just slowly bogs down, however the GTI charges hard even if you are in 5th doing 40kph. And of course any sort of incline totally kills the Honda which is all apart of the driving experience. My GF may have nfi idea what torque is, but any time she has the choice between driving my GTI or her DC5 she always picks the GTI.

[Transporter]

Maybe because they are both cars that appeal to drivers who really enjoy a good drive - one carries more passengers more easily while the other simply is a better drive. So what do you want - the cargo hauler or the best drive? (plus probably better resale, cheaper servicing and Jap reliability)

I'm not going to argue what is a better drive but I want to enjoy that drive under many conditions, not just on the race track and on the flat roads with no traffic, with me only in the car and turning the aircon off while driving up the hill when the traffic infront of me slows down.

As I said, the time will tell.

[SilvrFoxX]

Hey come on, you reached hero status a while back, stop being so humble

If I wasn't the threads would be dull... and everyone would belive the hype.. damn they do

[Candyman]

Well, owners of the 86 could always drop that $10k turbo upgrade in it available here in Sydney

I can still remember the anguished look on the face of the 86 driver in my rear view mirror up the gorge

[WhiteJames]

Motor Trend Best Driver's Car 2012

Hindsight is a wonderful thing ... returning to the present day ... Motor Trend have concluded their 'Best Driver's Car 2012' judging 9 entrants. The new Porsche 911 Carrrera S won. The Subaru came in at 4th, making it, according to MT, a better driver's car than the McClaren, Lamborghini Aventador, and high horspower Camaro & Mustang. On Laguna Seca Track, Race-Car Driver Randy Pobst rated the Subaru BRZ 2nd best as a driver's car. Yes, the BRZ (and FT86) could use a supercharger & better brakes for the track, but it managed to punch above its weight in esteemed company. See links to article and youtube.com video:

2012 Motor Trend Best Driver's Car - Motor Trend

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=QBfugbEIlk4

Cheers.
WJ

[Candyman]

This keeps getting better and better

[Transporter]

Yeah, good old Motor magazine... but, I know which car I would choose.

But to be fair, it's not nice to bag the car that can't defend itself here, plus every car has its buyer. So, we shouldn't try to take the joy away from them.

[SilvrFoxX]

Yeah, good old Motor magazine... but, I know which car I would choose.

But to be fair, it's not nice to bag the car that can't defend itself here, plus every car has its buyer. So, we shouldn't try to take the joy away from them.

Killjoy

[elephino]

Yes I appreciate the challenge.. but after all said and done.. you think the paperwork scoring for this criteria spat out the CRZ against all others.. and next year the COTY with be the FT86... I am not sure that Wheels carries much prestige anymore regardless of thier formula.

Considering the quite ordinary field last year? Yes. This year's is going to be a lot harder to end up with the winner, and I don't believe the 86/BRZ is going to be as easy a win as you're suggesting (not saying it can't win, but I'm less certain than you).

[Sharkie]

This is a pretty pointless thread IMO.

In choosing between these, if I only had $40k to spend and I needed a daily driver that is fast and comfortable with the very occasional track use, the GTI is the best possible bet. The lack of torque (and especially at low rpm) will make the 86 twins a massive PITA to drive daily especially if your previous car was a turbo VW ..... As a bonus a stock manual GTI will be slightly quicker around the track anyway and if you spent what is now becoming insignificantly cheap really, extra to get a chip, you'd be 2-3 seconds a lap quicker ....

And if I had $47K and absolutely must have a 2+2 coupe, the Scirroco R is the best bet .... much quicker everywhere .... 3 seconds per lap over a 86GTS in stock form, never mind after spending the +-$1200 extra for a chip ...

If the GTS came with forced induction of some kind and had an extra +- 30kw/100NM, my position may possibly change ....

[VWindahouse]

I agree.

Guys the 86 is a brand new vehicle segment in itself (mainly do to its price). Therefore it is pointless comparing it to anything else. There are at least two other threads like this on this forum the main one being in the general discussion thread where they have been compared to almost every car under $50K over and over.

If you want one so bad simply buy one and then go and join a Subaru or Toyota forum. And maybe one day I'll have the pleasure of embarrassing you around Lakeside or QR like I do to cars that cost twice as much as the 86. The only thing that matters is you love the car you choose to purchase!

[SilvrFoxX]

Considering the quite ordinary field last year? Yes. This year's is going to be a lot harder to end up with the winner, and I don't believe the 86/BRZ is going to be as easy a win as you're suggesting (not saying it can't win, but I'm less certain than you).

Given the articles they have written on the subject they would look silly otherwise.. hang on .. silliness from Wheels well past that concern

[WhiteJames]

Having driven the Sirocco R and twins, must say that the Sirocco R is not that far behind the twins for driver engagement ... definitely go for the manual to limit turbo lag. Sirocco did score one 1st place in Motor Mag BFYB and placed consistently high. The Megane RS265 would be more fun is the slower stuff with proper LSD.

Valid point on purchasing one of the twins. In the past I had to wait 6 mths for both MKV and MK6 Golf GTI's. Not prepared to wait anyone, esp. locking into a binding contract being at the mercy of the dealer. Regardless of purchasing a Volkswagen, or one of the twins, I am now inclined to wait until the dealer has stock or at the very least, something on the boat closer to our shores. In this respect, the Toyota FT86 could the pick based on greater availability.

Speaking of waiting times, the Mark 7 Golf is not very far away indeed. I expect to see the MK7 Golf GTI and Golf R released much sooner in the Mark 7 version. Here someting I gleaned from another site that supports that assertion:

Caught Testing: 2014 Volkswagen Golf R - Article - RoadandTrack.com

Cheers.
WJ

[LeftFootBrake]

Hi All. I've just stumbled onto this thread and thought I might have something to contribute. I have no barrow to push. I'm not trying to pick a fight. But I do have:

~2,000km experience in a Golf GTI DSG MkV (on Tassie roads).
~3,500km experience in a Toyota 86 GTS AT (on NSW roads).
Oh...and one my fave short-drives ever in an R32 MkV (Mt Keira).

I have included my 86 ownership thoughts in a thread elsewhere. I understand it's a long read, but I do get around to making a few coarse comparisons between the 86 and the GTI, in case you have the patience.

Otherwise, please feel free to ask me any questions here.

[Candyman]

You will find the comparison has been well and truly exhausted