Suggestions needed for first time GTi mods

[Chipped]

Come check it out...im at the cnr of Beechbrother and Walter...not far from yourself

he,he I have seen you then...quite often near Charlies.

[Chipped]

not necessarily correct Chipped, that 42kW will only last you the first 5-10mins of driving then heatsoak will set in and you'll be down to about ~125-130kW at the flywheel (100-105kW at the wheels) from then on until your car has cooled right down again. thats a big difference from the ~150kW at the fly on your first few minutes of driving.

for the price of FMIC's and downpipes they should not be discarded. an FMIC may only give you an extra 5-7kW at the wheels from a cold start, but it will keep the power at that level consistently even when the car heats up. so really, an FMIC is giving you about 25-30kW at the flywheel on top of the chip on a hot engine.

There have been FMIC core's available on this site for ~$300 (about $950 installed), now thats value!

downpipes have been proven to give you about 7kW extra and hold off heatsoak for a lot longer as well.

but in my eyes these mods should be done AFTER the chip for maximum output!

Cheers,
Rhys

Cheers Rhys, I was wondering why all my speeding fines were clocked first thing in the morning just after leaving home
Just ordered my APR Downpipe and Catcon through quattro...FMIC a bit $$ at the mo....maybe later next year. Added bonus I had no idea the Downpipe can hold off heatsoak also...awesome.

[mozzzy_2000]

Hey chipped what did they quote you installed on that?
I'm getting mine serviced and chipped tomorrow!
I've got a bit a cash to throw at the car so I was kinda think of getting a downpipe done too but probably at a later date. I wonder if I could still order one with the discount and have it installed later?

[Sharkie]

downpipes have been proven to give you about 7kW extra and hold off heatsoak for a lot longer as well.

I don't think the DPs are heat soak resistant, on the day it was more a case of runs close together without testing for heatsoak as we tested with yours Rhys.

On Rhys' car at the Brisbane Polo Dyno day, from a run of 123kw atw it dropped to 100kw atw after deliberately bringing on heatsoak conditions.

An FMIC is very resistant to the heat effect and when an otherwise chipped GTI will be doing 100kw atw will still be delivering 125+kw atw.

As Rhys said, whilst peak power increase is only about 5-7kw atw, its the 25+kw atw difference after 30mins of driving that makes it such a worthwhile modification.

[Chipped]

Hey chipped what did they quote you installed on that?
I'm getting mine serviced and chipped tomorrow!
I've got a bit a cash to throw at the car so I was kinda think of getting a downpipe done too but probably at a later date. I wonder if I could still order one with the discount and have it installed later?

Mate the DP is not an imported part - it not reduced 10% according to APR - only the Cat back exhaust is 10% off.
About $325-$250 Brian quoted me to install the DP, I'm booked for 1st week of Jan

[VW GTI]

I don't think the DPs are heat soak resistant, on the day it was more a case of runs close together without testing for heatsoak as we tested with yours Rhys.

On Rhys' car at the Brisbane Polo Dyno day, from a run of 123kw atw it dropped to 100kw atw after deliberately bringing on heatsoak conditions.

Explain Dave's drop in kw and how mine didn't drop (well it did, but only .8 of a kw).

Getting the hot air out quicker, flowing nicely, surely it would help?

[mozzzy_2000]

Hey chipped something is not right about what they've said to you. Check this out:
APR Australia Christmas Sale 2008

APR Christmas Sale 1st December until Wednesday 24th December

All Software – 10% off normal price, or pay normal price & get all extra programs loaded free of charge!*

All Exhausts – 10% off

All Turbo kits – 10% off

Intercooler kits – 10% off

APR Motorsport products – 15% off


* Includes all available programs for your computer (if available).
Stock, 95 ron, 98 ron, 104 race gas, Valet, security, Anti Theft.

Only certain combinations available for some cars – check with your local APR dealer for details.

Sale applies to imported APR products only, does not cover Haldex, Brembo or locally produced

And this:
Full System $2395

Downpipe & high flow catalyst $1199

So are they saying you don't get the 10% off the $1199, just the high flow catalyst and the downpipe is treated separately? Thats a bit misleading don't you think?

In regards to these dyno days; whats the story? Is it a competition or are you guys just trying to examine if everything is working alright? Also I have been told by many people that dynos should be taken very loosely as every dyno seems to bring up different figures. You can put the same car on one and then another and get completely different results. To get consistent results you would have to always use the same one everytime. Is that what you guys do?

[VW GTI]

Hey chipped something is not right about what they've said to you. Check this out:
APR Australia Christmas Sale 2008

APR Christmas Sale 1st December until Wednesday 24th December

All Software – 10% off normal price, or pay normal price & get all extra programs loaded free of charge!*

All Exhausts – 10% off

All Turbo kits – 10% off

Intercooler kits – 10% off

APR Motorsport products – 15% off


* Includes all available programs for your computer (if available).
Stock, 95 ron, 98 ron, 104 race gas, Valet, security, Anti Theft.

Only certain combinations available for some cars – check with your local APR dealer for details.

Sale applies to imported APR products only, does not cover Haldex, Brembo or locally produced

And this:
Full System $2395

Downpipe & high flow catalyst $1199

So are they saying you don't get the 10% off the $1199, just the high flow catalyst and the downpipe is treated separately? Thats a bit misleading don't you think?

In regards to these dyno days; whats the story? Is it a competition or are you guys just trying to examine if everything is working alright? Also I have been told by many people that dynos should be taken very loosely as every dyno seems to bring up different figures. You can put the same car on one and then another and get completely different results. To get consistent results you would have to always use the same one everytime. Is that what you guys do?

The downpipe is made locally, so no, it clearly says not only locally produced products.

The Brisbane dyno day was different to all others. There were only 6 cars, all Polo GTIs and the dyno operator was showing how much different results can be (especially when rushing 30 cars through in a day). There were 2 tuned cars (1 was run in stock mode as well) then the other 3 had FMIC, downpipe, FMIC & exhaust and custom FMIC & exhaust.

All the results were exactly as expected (2 tuned cars were almost identical, custom FMIC alone was a bit higher with no dropoff in repeat runs... downpipe was above that... then the custom job, then the full APR.

[RhysQ]

I don't think the DPs are heat soak resistant, on the day it was more a case of runs close together without testing for heatsoak as we tested with yours Rhys.

i never said they were heatsoak resistant. i said they hold off heatsoak a lot longer, in comparison to just a chipped car (i.e. mine).

as sam said, the air flow is significantly increased so the flow becomes cooler and takes longer to heatsoak the system. with a DP, i reckon it would be easier to cool things down again as well.

[RhysQ]

In regards to these dyno days; whats the story? Is it a competition or are you guys just trying to examine if everything is working alright?

no competition mate, just a meet and greet but mainly its a bit of peace of mind thing knowing that your money on mods has been well spent, giving you the projected/expected power output.

[mozzzy_2000]

Very interesting! Do they have these dyno days here in West Oz?

[RhysQ]

Very interesting! Do they have these dyno days here in West Oz?

you can always look for a place that has a dyno and organise an event yourself.

[Sharkie]

DP has definite benefits in getting the air out quicker and making slightly less prone to heatsoak than stock exhausted cars.

On the day however only Rhys' car was used to really test the effects of heatsoak. 123 - 102kw atw. All the others (including the FMIC cars) had runs closer together, so heat soak was less of an issue. As such Dave's car only dropped from 123 - 119kw atw. Sam's car dropped only 1.2kw between the runs.

I have all the APR data logs here with me, any of you want your data, send me a PM and I'll email it through to you.

All the FMIC cars picked up power with every run.

[mozzzy_2000]

With this heat soak scenario how was it replicated on a dyno? Is it a matter of thrashing the car through the gears or does it generally always occur with normal casual driving?
Personally I've only ever noticed a drop in power after a really long drive or if its a swelteringly hot. I've never noticed a power drop after 5-10 minutes. Perhaps its more dramatic after chipping the car to the higher spec?

[VW GTI]

With this heat soak scenario how was it replicated on a dyno? Is it a matter of thrashing the car through the gears or does it generally always occur with normal casual driving?
Personally I've only ever noticed a drop in power after a really long drive or if its a swelteringly hot. I've never noticed a power drop after 5-10 minutes. Perhaps its more dramatic after chipping the car to the higher spec?

Heatsoak is magnified on a dyno as the air isn't rushing past you when you're going 160km/h like it would on the 'road'. It would happen gradually, so you wouldn't notice it severely, but it does happen.