Golf R vs APR stage 1 Quattro A3 2.0t

[khonfahm]

Hi guys,

Just curious... On car sales these days, you can pick up a 2006-2008 quattro A3 with about 60k km's for approximately $25-30k, with leather and a sunroof! (Bargain in my opinion)

If you take it to APR and get a stage 1 ECU, they claim power figures of 188kw and 411Nm of torque.

A stock golf R produces 188 KW and 330 Nm of Torque.

I understand that the Golf R is much newer and a lot more sophisticated with its newer chasis and suspension components.

But I guess what I am trying to say is.. if you can pick one up for about $25k, and spend $2k on the chip...
How do you think the quattro a3 with apr stage 1 will compare to a golf r in terms of performance?

I'm guessing 0-100 they will be on par?

[kamold]

Hi guys,

Just curious... On car sales these days, you can pick up a 2006-2008 quattro A3 with about 60k km's for approximately $25-30k, with leather and a sunroof! (Bargain in my opinion)

If you take it to APR and get a stage 1 ECU, they claim power figures of 188kw and 411Nm of torque.

A stock golf R produces 188 KW and 330 Nm of Torque.

I understand that the Golf R is much newer and a lot more sophisticated with its newer chasis and suspension components.

But I guess what I am trying to say is.. if you can pick one up for about $25k, and spend $2k on the chip...
How do you think the quattro a3 with apr stage 1 will compare to a golf r in terms of performance?

I'm guessing 0-100 they will be on par?

I used to have a 2009 A3 TFSI Quattro S-Tronic with APR stage 1. Really miss it
Golf R stock is supposed to be somewhere between 5.7 to 5.9sec to 100km/h. My unscientific 0-100 runs with Dynolicious in the A3 were around 5.5secs, maybe lower.

So you are definately right about it being a bargain for similiar (on paper) performance.
Obviously the R has a lot more tuning potential, better suspension etc etc etc however its a bit of an apples to oranges comparison as there are so many factors to weigh up.

You could get an A3 and upgrade suspension, brakes, Haldex, exhaust, intake, headlights, tail lights, take a holiday and still not come anywhere near the cost of the R. Depends if you are after the fun of upgrading or the ease of stepping into a dedicated 'performance' car that is new...

My 2c.

[khonfahm]

Thanks Kamold.

I guess upgrading sounds really fun, and it is much cheaper! I guess this would really be my ideal car for under $30k.

To be honest, the Golf GTI sounds really good too.. but the quattro A3 is pretty much the same price?!

[Tobes_WIR35]

Yes, the Audi's seem to have a much lower value retention than VW. Not sure why though....

[SilvrFoxX]

Yes, the Audi's seem to have a much lower value retention than VW. Not sure why though....

Because they are basically over priced VWs, this is not a bad thing they just relevel the pricepoint to what they should cost

[kamold]

My (admittedly limited) experience with now three VAG cars is that the Audi was better finished all round. When you start to pull apart trim pieces etc to see where things have been hidden you tend to notice the attention to detail.

I am happy with the MkV and Octavia don't get me wrong, but you can see where they are having to meet a price point more so than in the A3. The underpinnings, drivetrain etc and technology are shared, but there is a reason that we now get Golfs from The Motherland rather than South Africa. It matters where a car is built.

[adamtassell]

My previous DSG gti was stage 2 (dp and tune) and would be very similar in straight line performance to my current S3. I know it is not very scientific (as opposed to a quarter mile time) but my friend has a fairly heavily modded ralliart colt and my stock S3 and my modified golf both run it pretty even. If anything the golf was a bit faster.

I agree that the audi is better finished than the golf- but not so much that it really matters. I also think the audi is better finished then our lexus, previous BMW, and my friend C class.

[Finance_Analyst]

for whatever reason, I tend to hear more problems with Audis than VWs. Maybe it is because the lower end Audis are not German built?

[khonfahm]

What I find quite interesting is that you can find a quattro a3 for about $22k , if you look at the 05 years, and 80000 km's..

Where as if you are looking at a golf GTI with those km's... you are paying the same price if not more!!

The A3 doesn't seem to hold their value at all!! Which i think is amazing from a buyers perspective!!

Finance_analyst: I thought the A3 2.0T quattro isn't very 'low end'?? Am I missing something here?

[CNBLU]

Ive been in a stock Golf R and can tell you my A3 feels abit quicker. Granted with a tune the Golf R is in another world, but for the price you pay you can have a pretty quick A3 with all the features of a luxury car without having to spend 60k.

[Finance_Analyst]

What I find quite interesting is that you can find a quattro a3 for about $22k , if you look at the 05 years, and 80000 km's..

Where as if you are looking at a golf GTI with those km's... you are paying the same price if not more!!

The A3 doesn't seem to hold their value at all!! Which i think is amazing from a buyers perspective!!

Finance_analyst: I thought the A3 2.0T quattro isn't very 'low end'?? Am I missing something here?

I guess look at it from the perspective that all A3s (and perhaps even S3s), A4s (not sure about the 3.2) are not built in Germany. Audis 'top end' are A8, R8, RS models etc. So relatively speaking, the A3 2.0T is a lower end model for Audi, but the GTI is above average for VW. My point is more that, anecdotally speaking, I have heard Audis have had more issues than VWs for one reason or another. Not sure if this is to do with where it is made. But my sample could be way off the mark.

[brimway]

Given that a national car rental company run a huge (not exaggerating) fleet of Audis. A1, A3 ,A4 ,A5 and A6 of all specs. My concern would be that all of the petrol examples have only ever drank ULP91.

Not sure if this would have any long term negative impact, but they turn them over at very low Ks and/or very early in their life. So the risk is there for potential buyers of used late model Audis.

[adamtassell]

Ive been in a stock Golf R and can tell you my A3 feels abit quicker. Granted with a tune the Golf R is in another world, but for the price you pay you can have a pretty quick A3 with all the features of a luxury car without having to spend 60k.

I think (again- from owning, but never running down a quarter mile) that the S3 (and obviously golf r) both feel slower than the tuned GTI. The smaller turbo comes on very strong. But, ultimately the K03 runs out of steam in the higher revs and the K04 powered cars will actually be faster- if less responsive initially. There was a video floating around the forum of a stage one gti vs a stock r. The gti gets the jump (rolling race) and looks like it has won, but the r reels it back in and wins eventually. If you were to drive them both I bet the Gti/a3 would feel faster because of that initial response even though it is ultimately slower.

[SilvrFoxX]

Might I suggest that the AWD creates the feeling of tardiness though in reality it is quite rapid. The GTI being FWD and lighter providing different feedback with the aforementioned turbo and lighter engine gives the impression of being quicker..?

[Rob_R]

Might I suggest that the AWD creates the feeling of tardiness though in reality it is quite rapid. The GTI being FWD and lighter providing different feedback with the aforementioned turbo and lighter engine gives the impression of being quicker..?

It's the young bull vs old bull story. Young bull jumps out of the gates all eager and fast but it's all over too quickly. Old bull steady off the mark, builds up speed, cums on strong....'cough' comes on strong down the straight leaving all amply satisfied.