Intercooler options

[ryan_GTI]

Johan you baller! Can't wait to see that shiny cooler behind the bumpers...

[shaneth]

Looks nice.

Yes would be interested in price as well.

[VW GTI]

Looks nice.

[Sharkie]

Some pics.










I'll try and get hold of the manufacturer to see if he has more (can get more) and at what price he'd willing to sell to us lot. Now that I have confirmation that it is a perfect fit it seems like a good option.....

[Bubu]

Also remember that these are large size turbo's, but with a pressure drop like that the turbo is working much harder than it need's to be.
So a Polo's little turbo would be working over time.

For eg. to make say 10psi at the intake manifold, the turbo has to actually make 15+psi! That's alot of wasted energy.

I disagree because there are two things in play here, the flow of a turbo and the boost of a turbo. The Polo's turbo is a lot smaller but it still can boost as much as many other larger turbos (including the XR6T). The difference between the Polo and XR6 turbo's is that the XR6 can flow a lot more air than a Polo.

Lets look at the 'pipe' example that is often used to explain the relationship between Amps and Volts.
The boost can be related to how fast water travels through a given pipe. Flow which is often measures in cfm is how much water is flowing through a pipe. If you have a small pipe/hose with lots of pressure (boost) you could fill a bucket just as fast as a bigger pipe/hose with almost no pressure. In the end they can both flow the same amount of water only one will do it by pushing water through very fast and the other will do it by pushing water through slower but with more volume.

Going back to the turbos if the Polo turbo is puming at the same pressure (boost) as the XR6T then the only difference is the flow. The small turbo on the Polo will not flow as much air as the XR6T therefore it will not experience the same pressure drop in that particular intercooler. The XR6T is trying to flow a lot more air through that FMIC that the Polo can. The turbo on the Polo will probably work less harder through the XR6T FMIC than it does on the factory SMIC.

[Oneofthegreats]

As for the XR6T unit, I have heard that some guys put out at much as 350kw (at flywheel) using the standard FMIC. Thats 100kw more than standard. That is one of the reasons I started to consider this as a possible upgrade option.

Don't get me wrong, the XR6T intercooler's do work & my friends dad's XR6T made 316rwkw's with a APS power upgrade & using the stock intercooler.

Also remember that these are large size turbo's, but with a pressure drop like that the turbo is working much harder than it need's to be.
So a Polo's little turbo would be working over time.

For eg. to make say 10psi at the intake manifold, the turbo has to actually make 15+psi! That's alot of wasted energy.


You could try a early model Supra intercooler. These have the inlet & outlet on the same side & are also pretty efficient. Not the best looking though.

[VW GTI]

FMICs provide benefits that extend beyond kw alone, such as assisting other components and ensuring they operate properly, which ultimately protects the longevity of those components.

This is the only reason I'm thinking of getting one. I'm happy with the power the chip and downpipe has given (did a 6.7 0-100 on the highway last night, could have easily gone quicker with no wheelspin on the new tarmac).

I'm saving up for it purely to make everything run smoother for longer.

[GT3]

Paying under $2k for 40kw is cheap but paying over $2k for a product (FMIC) that probably gives you less than half the gain of a chip!! The chip is the best 'bank for buck' mod for a VW IMO.

That's fair enough, I just presented another way of looking at these things. There's nothing stopping people from going custom ECU tuning either (it's cheaper) - but the majority of ppl in Oz don't bc they realise that what they are paying for is years of R&D and trouble-free motoring. This is why some ppl pay the premium for the APR FMIC option, bc they're also purchasing the R&D and engineering that went into ensuring it performs 100%.

I don't think you can simply reduce the worth of a mod down to kw atw and bang-for-buck. FMICs provide benefits that extend beyond kw alone, such as assisting other components and ensuring they operate properly, which ultimately protects the longevity of those components.

[Sharkie]

Also, if you get a suitable FMIC, custom fitting by a reputable shop will cost between $500 & $700 for quality stainless piping mandrel bent and nicely welded and quaility silicone joiners.

So for the best deal look for a cooler between $250-$350...... to get to about $1100 all up.... (Not easy I know, took me months to find the right one.)

[SoVeReIgN]

$$$ sharkie?

[Sharkie]

Essentially you need a FMIC about 50cm in length, 30cm in height and 10cm in width to be able to fit comfortably behind the bar without any cutting. This is about 2.5x bigger than standard.

The one I found is 47x30x9 and in a side by side comparison with APR's ( about 49x30x8 ) looks to be of similar quaility. The tanks are cast and polished and on the inside nice and smooth. The manufacturer promised excellent flow with figures similar to APR's.

I'll post pictures on Mon morning when I get to my USB cable for the phone at work. I'll also start tracking down the manufacturer as its been more than 6 months since I bought it. Had too many other things to do 1st so it had to wait before fitment.

[Bubu]

I'd stay right away from the XR6T & F6 intercooler's as they have been known to measure a pressure drop of upto & over 5-6psi across the core!

That's 5-6psi more work the turbo has to do to just to reach the same result!

I don't know exactly how much room there is in the front of a Polo, but I reckon I'd be looking at something out of a Mitsubishi EVO3 for eg. or a GSR. Big tanks, good size piping & these can also easily handle 400+hp & are very efficient.

The intercooler plumbing would have to be relocated, if I was to fit a EVO FMIC. The IN hose to the FMIC is on the same side of the car as the OUT hose.

As for the XR6T unit, I have heard that some guys put out at much as 350kw (at flywheel) using the standard FMIC. Thats 100kw more than standard. That is one of the reasons I started to consider this as a possible upgrade option.

GT3 you make a good point. I didnt "batter an eye lid" when I paid $1,575 for the APR chip, but the cost to gain is huge. Paying under $2k for 40kw is cheap but paying over $2k for a product (FMIC) that probably gives you less than half the gain of a chip!! The chip is the best 'bank for buck' mod for a VW IMO.

Mitch_gti first posted links to the thread below which were seen on seatcupra.net (have a look at the photos at the bottom of the page for those who have not seen it)

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=72735&page=8

That just goes to show what may be achieveable if you look around.

[GT3]

I went through the same motions - how can I get a decent FMIC for my Polo GTI without spending a lot? Searched high and low, but there weren't any (unless you know highly capable custom fitters). Like many upgrade options that plague the Polo GTI, there just isn't sufficient economy of scale to interest the major tuners who reside in the USA and Europe, ie Polo GTI wasn't released in the USA and isn't cost-competitve in Europe, hence the lack of product development for it.

So that's the state of play, FMICs for the Pog ain't cheap, and I'd imagine Guy wouldn't have the volume to enable him to drop the prices for APR FMICs. Despite what people may think, he wouldn't make a lot on the FMICs.

It's all relative really. Many on here wouldn't batter an eye lid when it comes to shelling out almost 2k for ECU software, but when it comes to spending similar amounts for a high-grade FMIC and associated hardware, they consider that outrageous - and yet will happily rationalise spending thousands on wheels for aesthetics and similar amounts on audio systems

[Oneofthegreats]

I normally don't come into the Polo section & just come across this thread about intercooler's & thought I'd chime in.

I'd stay right away from the XR6T & F6 intercooler's as they have been known to measure a pressure drop of upto & over 5-6psi across the core!

That's 5-6psi more work the turbo has to do to just to reach the same result!

I don't know exactly how much room there is in the front of a Polo, but I reckon I'd be looking at something out of a Mitsubishi EVO3 for eg. or a GSR. Big tanks, good size piping & these can also easily handle 400+hp & are very efficient.

[Bubu]

I havent gone as far as measuring the XR6 unit to compare to the APR unit. If anyone can provide some dimensions on the XR6 or APR coolers that would be greatly appriciated. I am particularly interested in the width (thickness).

I dont know if the XR6 FMIC has been done on a Polo. I was just fishing for some ideas.

Note: The XR6 F6 Typhoon has a 15% larger FMIC compared to a regular XR6. Thats according to a friend of mine who is into the XR's.