1.2TSI P Plate exemption in QLD?

[Sharkie]

I'm looking at getting a car that my daughter can learn to drive on. Does anybody know if the 1.2TSI has P Plate exemption in QLD?

I'll do the research with QLD Transport, but its either a 1.2TSI or a Fiesta at this time ......

Expecting 1.2TSI Red, manual Sports pack.

Also does the MY12s have BT and MDI now as standard?

[HaydEn]

If it's just for her to learn in she can drive anything.

But I think they are even on the rta's list of moderate performance vehicle. Meaning that she can drive it. However, Depending on whether qld and nsw see eye to eye.

[Hail22]

Learning is anything as she will be with a person holding a full black/gold licence.

P Plates i know for a fact from previous posters in the past saying an application for exemption must be made, they have been sort of cracking down on people saying "oh its the only car we could afford or my dad/mum owned this car and are only willing to give this to me instead of financial aid"

My advice go for the fiesta, parts easily available if she or someone hits the vehicle or if a component breaks/fails as opposed to VW (90% of the Polo parts are held off shore and can take up to 3 weeks to source them) thus she will be without a vehicle unless your all patient waiting for VW to scroll through a parts order while eating a greasy doughnut

Also less red tape to do with regards with various motor bodies/authorities.

Goodluck in your research.

[The_Hawk]

A quick check of the QLD roads website: Home (Department of Transport and Main Roads)

Turns up this:
High-powered (performance) vehicle restriction (Department of Transport and Main Roads)


Where it says:

You may apply for a certificate of exemption if the vehicle you wish to drive meets all of the following:

has a turbocharged or supercharged engine that is not diesel powered
has a power-to-weight ratio of not more than 125kW/t
does not have any other features of a high-powered vehicle as outlined above.


There is also this link:
Department of Transport and Main Roads Probationary Approved Cars

Where you can search for vehicles to see their current status.

Sadly the Polo 77TSI is in the "application required" pile...

As for the process and how likely it is to get through... well that's a whole different story a local might have to answer for you.

[Ben J]

Just get a non turbo one?

Sent from my HTC Wildfire using Tapatalk

[PUZ213]

pretty sure because it's legal in QLD, being <1.6L and power of the car isn't making much at the motor

[readerr0r]

EDIT: Looks like The_Hawk has linked it all up already, that'll teach me to refresh my old tabs before I post




Just check the QLD Trans website?
High-powered (performance) vehicle restriction (Department of Transport and Main Roads)

They've even integrated the rules into the redbook site.
Department of Transport and Main Roads Probationary Approved Cars

According the redbook, the 77tsi (and GTI) requires a Certificate of Exemption for Driving a High-Powered Vehicle, you can download an info sheet for that here...
Transport and Main Roads Corporate Forms FS4478 - Certificate of Exemption for Driving a High-Powered Vehicle Information Sheet

[The_Hawk]

Looking across the results, it seems things broadly fall into one of three categories, either Banned (like the Golf R), Diesel (and approved) or "requires application" for everything else.

With emissions standards and fuel usage high on the agenda for most companies, small engine, forced induction is becoming very common, QLD Roads seem to have made a rational decision and listed the "Less Than 125kW/T", shame they haven't applied it anywhere. Even if it's a case of they don't bother to review any car until someone applies for it... well surely someone has applied for a Golf or a Polo at some stage.

[Hail22]

Looking across the results, it seems things broadly fall into one of three categories, either Banned (like the Golf R), Diesel (and approved) or "requires application" for everything else.

With emissions standards and fuel usage high on the agenda for most companies, small engine, forced induction is becoming very common, QLD Roads seem to have made a rational decision and listed the "Less Than 125kW/T", shame they haven't applied it anywhere. Even if it's a case of they don't bother to review any car until someone applies for it... well surely someone has applied for a Golf or a Polo at some stage.

There was a member on here who is a P plater and waited 3 months for his application to go through, i believe he was denied once then the second time he botched his excuse later on.

This was in NSW however the RTA accepts any kaka excuse these days...

[koji]

The 77TSI is (as already stated) classed as a high performance car in QLD however, I have a 77TSI Golf and am on my P's and have never had any issues in regards to being pulled over for driving it - even at RBT's etc. Maybe I've just been lucky but it seems as though they aren't too informed on what VW's are permitted for P-Plate drivers.

On another note, still ridiculous how we can't legally drive a 77TSI yet we can drive a R32...I'll leave it there haha.

[Hail22]

The 77TSI is (as already stated) classed as a high performance car in QLD however, I have a 77TSI Golf and am on my P's and have never had any issues in regards to being pulled over for driving it - even at RBT's etc. Maybe I've just been lucky but it seems as though they aren't too informed on what VW's are permitted for P-Plate drivers.

On another note, still ridiculous how we can't legally drive a 77TSI yet we can drive a R32...I'll leave it there haha.

Power to Weight ratio, a 77TSI Golf would be a lot slower/less reactive compared to a Polo TSI.

That would explain why cops don't bother they have an eyeview which takes your rego immediately sends to the motor authority and gets a reply whether its stolen, high performance, has outstanding defects etc.

So they know who you are and they must have the 77TSI Golf listed as low/moderate.

[The_Hawk]

I have been attempting to read up on the NSW conditions and am either failing or there is near zero information.

From what I can see it's much the same as QLD, no V8, no Forced Induction (except diesel), No engine Mods and some restricted "high power" V6's are out too.

BUT, what is a bit of BS is that where QLD have the guidelines on what *may* be allowed inclduing the <125kW/T guideline, NSW have nothing but an application form. I recall once upon a time there was an exempted vehicle list and a line that said something about small engine turbo's for economy, but can't see any of that now.

Here is a quote from over 12 months ago now which may explain why I can't find the old lists:

The RTA defends its blanket bans on certain types of vehicles, saying they are easier for police to interpret.

It also says many lower-powered turbocharged engines - including some from Mercedes-Benz, Volvo and Volkswagen - are actually exempt. However, to drive an exempt vehicle, drivers must pay $26 and await approval.

I can understand the removal of confusion, but then how useful any restriction is is another question entirely. There was a position paper from the WA Premier or head road guy... (I don't recall and can't find the link right now) which basically said it wasn't about how fast you could get to speed that caused accidents... it's was the sudden stop when you a tree and even the crappiest 80's car can still reach over 100km/h and even then most accidents were at 70km/h anyway. In their case there is no restrictions on P plate vehicles (the paper being the reasoning/explanation). (also one interesting thing I found in WA if you don't get any demerit points while on your P's you get your 1st year licence for FREE!, nice little carrot there )

It's also interesting that in SA there is a defined list of exempted vehicles which seems to cover most of the VW range INCLUDING the 9N3 Polo GTI and the 4th Gen Golf GTI as well as all the current gen Golf's (except the R and GTI).

[Diesel_vert]

I'm looking at getting a car that my daughter can learn to drive on. Does anybody know if the 1.2TSI has P Plate exemption in QLD?

Polo 1.2 77TSI, manual

Power : 77 kW
Weight : 1048 kg
Power-to-weight ratio : 73 kW / tonne


In QLD, you may apply for an exemption under one of the following conditions:

- Vehicle has a moderately powered turbocharged or supercharged engine YES
- Personal circumstances and severe hardship

For vehicles with a moderately powered turbocharged or supercharged engine, you may apply for a certificate of exemption if the vehicle you wish to drive meets all of the following:

- Has a turbocharged or supercharged engine that is not diesel powered YES
- Has a power-to-weight ratio of not more than 125kW/t YES
- Does not have any other features of a "high-powered vehicle" as outlined below YES

A "high-powered vehicle" include those with:

- Eight or more cylinders NO
- An engine that has a power output of more than 210kW as per the manufacturer's specifications NO
- A rotary engine that has an engine capacity of more than 1146cc as per the manufacturer's specifications NO
- A modified engine that must be approved under section 13 of the Transport Operations Regulation 2010. NO

The application form looks pretty straightforward. I can't see any reason why the authorities wouldn't exempt it. Just be sure to attach a brochure pointing out the power and weight figures with a big red texta or something (need supporting documents).

I have been attempting to read up on the NSW conditions and am either failing or there is near zero information.

Nope, just failing.

Unlike QLD, the classification of a moderately performance turbo/supercharged vehicle is determined at the discretion of the Roads and Maritime Services (formerly known as the RTA). Examples of such vehicles are given on the following link:

P1 and P2 vehicle and passenger conditions


If a vehicle is not mentioned there, refer to the complete list here:

A guide to moderate performance vehicles


If a vehicle is not on that list, then you can send them an email to exemption_enquiry@rta.nsw.gov.au (quite obvious that the list hasn't been updated since 2009).

There was a member on here who is a P plater and waited 3 months for his application to go through, i believe he was denied once then the second time he botched his excuse later on.

He or she was applying for an exemption on a GTI while still on his or her P plates.

Not that it's impossible, but you need to have all the details "worked out" before attempting that sort of thing, if you know what I mean.

[The_Hawk]

Nope, just failing.
If a vehicle is not mentioned there, refer to the complete list here:
A guide to moderate performance vehicles

Yep, that's what I remember reading... and I stand corrected, I'm sure I read that page and didn't even see this list (which is what you had linked to and includes both the 77TSI Polo and the 118TSI Golf):

Examples of moderate performance turbo/supercharged vehicles that are eligible for exemption include:

Alfa Romeo 1368cc Giulietta
Audi 1197cc and 1390cc (90kW) A1
Audi 1390cc A3
Audi 1798cc A3 and A4
Audi 1984cc Q5
Citroen 1598cc C4 1.6L
Fiat 1368cc, Punto and Rimto
Holden 1400cc Cruze
Mercedes-Benz 1796cc CLK200K, E200K, C200, CLC200, C230 and SLK 200K
Peugeot 1598cc 308 Series 1.6T XSE
Saab 1988cc 9-3 Linear, and Vector
Skoda 1798cc Superb 1.8 TFSI and Octavia 1.8 TFSI
Skoda 1197cc Fabia and Yeti
Volkswagen 1390cc Golf 90TSI and Golf 118TSI
Volkswagen 1984cc Tiguan 125TSI and Passat 147TSI
Volkswagen 1197cc Polo 77TSI

Still need to apply, but it looks like anything on the list is a much simpler process.

[Hail22]

I think an application defeats the purpose, for a learner vehicle/first car its usually good to start with a vehicle that has had war history as its the first step in ones licence.

Usually P2/Green plates is the safest category to buy into a new first vehicle as you have had experience behind the wheel for well over a year.

Personal preference to all however

probably go for a used Fiesta, then bridge to a 2013 Polo (facelift variant).