66TSI vs 77TSI fuel economy

[expatNoob]

Hi all-
Currently looking for a nice, used small car in today's ridiculous market. After fainting over the ridiculous prices that the Yaris, Jazz, Mazda 2, etc. are commanding on the used car market (and FFS, no cruise control???), I've turned my attention to the Polo. They don't have this model where I'm from (see screenname), so I'm not super familiar with this line. Parents at home have a 2000 TDI manual Beetle (aka "The Indestructible Long Haul Ranger") and had a 2002 Passat AWD V6 wagon (aka "The Useless POS Tank That Ate Tires"), so my experience with VW has been somewhat mixed.

I'm leaning toward manual mostly because I like driving stick and they're going for slightly cheaper than the autos. Currently about to take a look at a 2014 77TSI manual but am wondering if it's worth waiting for a 66TSI to show up since getting 4.8L/100 km as opposed to 5.5L is looking more and more attractive with today's petrol prices.

I would primarily be doing mixed driving with the occasional long haul trip thrown in.

Is there really that big of a difference in fuel economy between the two, or am I splitting hairs?

Thanks!

[Guest001]

Splitting hairs because you wont get that consumption in everyday driving.
We had a 77 and it was quite economical and if you are worried about .7 of a litre per 100km perhaps you should be looking at pushbikes LOL

Also 77 has a bit more grunt than the 66

[expatNoob]

Splitting hairs because you wont get that consumption in everyday driving.
We had a 77 and it was quite economical and if you are worried about .7 of a litre per 100km perhaps you should be looking at pushbikes LOL

Already have one of those, doesn't get me far enough.


I think my biggest concern is the timing chain. Have read a number of posts stating they crapped out before 100k. Asked owner about it and he didn't know of any issues, nor did the VW dealer or other specialist in the area. I'll have a third party inspect it, but how well can you tell just by looking at the chain that it's on the fritz?

[Sharkie]

66TSI has the newer engine without the timing chain issues. That alone is worth it.

It also has a RVC and Apple Carplay/Android Auto radio as standard.

And if you are so inclined, the 66TSI can very quickly become a 100TSI. About $950 for an ECU tune to increase performance significantly.

We have a 66TSI in the family and its an honest little hatch that drives very nicely. I'd recommend it.

[expatNoob]

66TSI has the newer engine without the timing chain issues. That alone is worth it.

It also has a RVC and Apple Carplay/Android Auto radio as standard.

And if you are so inclined, the 66TSI can very quickly become a 100TSI. About $950 for an ECU tune to increase performance significantly.

We have a 66TSI in the family and its an honest little hatch that drives very nicely. I'd recommend it.

I'm not too concerned about the car play or nav screen - most of the time I just shut it off when I'm in the car, too annoying to look at.

I heard they had resolved the timing chain issues by MY13 - is that accurate? Any input, @Hillbilly?

[Sharkie]

I'm not too concerned about the car play or nav screen - most of the time I just shut it off when I'm in the car, too annoying to look at.

I heard they had resolved the timing chain issues by MY13 - is that accurate? Any input, @Hillbilly?

No, the engines are completely different with MY15 the 1st year of the new engines. Pre MY215 it was the EA111 which has the timing chain issues (any fixes are just stopgaps) and since MY15 it was the EA211 without the timing chain issues. Look for 1 that has an engine code of CJZC (66TSI) or CJZD (81TSI).

Buy any earlier at your peril.

And BTW, CarPlay or Android Auto (in Brisbane) will save you from too many fines as it (with Waze) reports mobile speed camera locations near you. Unless you don't speed, in which case, by all means don't use it LOL.

[expatNoob]

No, the engines are completely different with MY15 the 1st year of the new engines. Pre MY215 it was the EA111 which has the timing chain issues (any fixes are just stopgaps) and since MY15 it was the EA211 without the timing chain issues. Look for 1 that has an engine code of CJZC (66TSI) or CJZD (81TSI).

Buy any earlier at your peril.

And BTW, CarPlay or Android Auto (in Brisbane) will save you from too many fines as it (with Waze) reports mobile speed camera locations near you. Unless you don't speed, in which case, by all means don't use it LOL.

Mine says it's a CBZE, so I think I'm screwed. Unfortunately the post 2015 cars are above my price range (as is everything else in the market nowadays). My other pick was a 2008 TDI 1.9 manual Golf with 143k, but I'd be paranoid that I'd need to drive it a minimum of 30 minutes every time or I'd be ruining the engine.

[Sharkie]

Mine says it's a CBZE, so I think I'm screwed. Unfortunately the post 2015 cars are above my price range (as is everything else in the market nowadays). My other pick was a 2008 TDI 1.9 manual Golf with 143k, but I'd be paranoid that I'd need to drive it a minimum of 30 minutes every time or I'd be ruining the engine.

What sort of budget are you looking at?

In the ~12K range there are some 66TSI's (manuals) around on Carsales.
In the same range you could find an early Mk7 manual Golf too. A much better car than the Polo and not any heavier on fuel realistically.

If you are willing a 2009-2010 Polo GTI can be had for less and are much livelier than either and also not much heavier on fuel. I had 1 and regularly got low to mid 5l/100km on the highway. The 1.8 engine in this is also much more reliable than anything since built by VW. 3 door only, so that limits its use as a family car.

[expatNoob]

About $10K. Market is insane now, I'm seeing 2012 Yarises with 150K+ going for like $12000. Or ones with major paint/clear coat peel for the same. Polos seem to have been largely ignored until now, suddenly everyone wants one because the Japanese used car market is so inflated.

Also do not want a 3 door, so that limits me a bit. I prefer manual though.

[expatNoob]

What sort of budget are you looking at?

In the ~12K range there are some 66TSI's (manuals) around on Carsales.
In the same range you could find an early Mk7 manual Golf too. A much better car than the Polo and not any heavier on fuel realistically.

If you are willing a 2009-2010 Polo GTI can be had for less and are much livelier than either and also not much heavier on fuel. I had 1 and regularly got low to mid 5l/100km on the highway. The 1.8 engine in this is also much more reliable than anything since built by VW. 3 door only, so that limits its use as a family car.

You'll be happy to know I passed on the 2013. I couldn't justify driving something that was potentially a ticking time bomb in terms of the chain.

Looking at two TSIs, a 2015 and 2016. Both have <100k but one has the backup camera and alloys, the other is a little more basic but much cheaper (and I like the colour better ). I suppose I can get mags on the used market, but it sounds like the RVC is a little more labour intensive.

[Lucas_R]

My other pick was a 2008 TDI 1.9 manual Golf with 143k, but I'd be paranoid that I'd need to drive it a minimum of 30 minutes every time or I'd be ruining the engine.

A Polo of that age will not have the DPF (diesel particular filter) which is what is the problem is on more modern diesel engines when doing lots of short trips.

The 1.9 TDI is a pretty damn reliable motor.

BUT, these Polo's are getting pretty old now and will start having age related issues (worn suspension, engine mounts, rusted exhaust, oil leaks etc etc. Personally I would buy a newer car with your budget.

[expatNoob]

A Polo of that age will not have the DPF (diesel particular filter) which is what is the problem is on more modern diesel engines when doing lots of short trips.

The 1.9 TDI is a pretty damn reliable motor.

BUT, these Polo's are getting pretty old now and will start having age related issues (worn suspension, engine mounts, rusted exhaust, oil leaks etc etc. Personally I would buy a newer car with your budget.

I'm not sure how long I'll have the car for - might be moving overseas in the next year, so buying new isn't really worth it.

Oh, and the TDI is a Golf. The 1.9 is a nice little workhorse, but the one I'm looking is on 143k, when all the structural issues start cropping up. It also seems like the fuel efficiency with thhe Golf TDI is on par with the Polo 1.2, so it's a toss-up.

[Lucas_R]

I'm not sure how long I'll have the car for - might be moving overseas in the next year, so buying new isn't really worth it.

Oh, and the TDI is a Golf. The 1.9 is a nice little workhorse, but the one I'm looking is on 143k, when all the structural issues start cropping up. It also seems like the fuel efficiency with thhe Golf TDI is on par with the Polo 1.2, so it's a toss-up.

Sorry I thought you said it was a Polo. They offered the same 1.9TDI engine in both the Polo and Golf in that 2006-2009 period. Obviously the Golf is heavier so the fuel consumption would be better in the lighter Polo.

Do you want auto or manual?

For 10k in the current market you are going to be quite limited in what you can get that is still decent.

Cars to avoid:
Holden Cruze. Absolute crap cars. Terrible auto gearbox.
Ford Focus with auto transmission (manuals are fine). Autos have lots of issues
Any VW/Audi/Skoda with the 1.4 twincharged engine (supercharged and turbocharged). Run even faster if it has the 7 speed auto (DSG) transmission.


carsales.com.au

carsales.com.au

carsales.com.au

carsales.com.au

[expatNoob]

Sorry I thought you said it was a Polo. They offered the same 1.9TDI engine in both the Polo and Golf in that 2006-2009 period. Obviously the Golf is heavier so the fuel consumption would be better in the lighter Polo.

Do you want auto or manual?

For 10k in the current market you are going to be quite limited in what you can get that is still decent.

Cars to avoid:
Holden Cruze. Absolute crap cars. Terrible auto gearbox.
Ford Focus with auto transmission (manuals are fine). Autos have lots of issues
Any VW/Audi/Skoda with the 1.4 twincharged engine (supercharged and turbocharged). Run even faster if it has the 7 speed auto (DSG) transmission.

I've seen maybe one or two TDI Polos on the market but they all seem to have the 1.6. Very few Golfs around with the 1.9, nearly all of them are the 2.0 Dieselgate models. I actually really liked the 1.2 turbo on the Polo, it's got a lot of pep and pickup. Last year, I borrowed a friend's 2009 1.3L Yaris for several months (only had 75K on it) and that thing was awful. No power at all and the paint was just peeling everywhere.

I'll take either auto or manual, I don't mind driving manual so that gives me an advantage in pricing and possibly maintenance. I heard the DSG was problematic, though?

I'm also in the minority on these forums, as I'm after efficiency/practicality over performance.

[Sharkie]

The DSG in the 1.2 Polo's will absolutely give you an expensive headache at some point, avoid and go for the manuals only.

The 1.9TDI was in the Mk4 (9N3) Polo and is pretty bulletproof, although now getting a bit old. The 1.6TDI in the Mk5 (6R) Polos is not bad actually and can be chipped for more power and even better fuel consumption although a bit pricey compared to your budget.

A rare beast was the 1.4 naturally aspirated base model in the 6R Polos, these are slowish but very reliable and reasonably good on fuel. Less than 10K mostly.

You get any of the Polo's you are looking for, for far less if you are willing to consider a car that has been repaired (in some way) before. If you don't intend to keep it for ever this may be a really good option. I did exactly that Polo restoration project - 2016 66TSI. The whole project, including buying the car and getting it fixed cost me less than $6000 for a 2016 66TSI .... obviously I did a lot myself and was hands-on the rest with my contacts, but they are out there in the market (facebook marketplace) generally for about $9K.