APR Tune - 162TSI - worth every $$

[Dose Pipe Sutututu]

It is WOT surge. Not compressor stall after throttle lift. Don’t think it’s knock

Definitely sounds like too much duty cycle applied as boost is coming on, also symptoms of not enough exhaust flow.

Generally in other applications is mainly from compressor wheel vs. turbine mismatch. Good example is a GT2876R. 76mm exducer on a 28 series turbine.

[Boosted_GP]

Can’t tell you now it 100% duty cycle 0-redline.

Definitely needs more open downpipe/cat. I have a 7R DP sitting in my garage that I may decat and fit.


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[Psych101]

Can’t tell you now it 100% duty cycle 0-redline.

Definitely needs more open downpipe/cat. I have a 7R DP sitting in my garage that I may decat and fit.


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Can you do intake mods with apr stage 1? Maybe the tune expects the restriction from the stock airbox with snow grate to prevent surge. Have you tried putting it back in?

[Boosted_GP]

As far as I know you can. But will need to double check.

What is a “normal timing curve for a flash like this?

Currently my car is -4.5deg @3000rpm. -1.5 @redline.

Seems very retarded?


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[tigger73]

It will depend on what fuel you’re running and what the tune file is set up for.

Are you looking at timing retardation per cylinder? -4.5 is probably not that far away from pinging. I’d much prefer to see it around -1.5 to zero.


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[Boosted_GP]

APR Tune - 162TSI - worth every $$

Thanks tigger73. Yes I agree. I am not happy with the timing Pull.

I’m waiting for my proper obd reader to arrive so using my phone at the moment. So not sure if it’s timing pull or actual timing of cylinder 1.

Using 95ron +10%eth. =~98Ron.

Map is stage 1 v1.2 (intended for use with a DP).

Is there a PID. List for our cars somewhere?

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[tigger73]

I really think you have a fuel issue. I think you’re still running around 97 octane. I’d either get 98, run a decent bottle of octane booster or get a 95 tune.

I’ve had issues with fuel and had to remove timing from the tune to run on slightly lower octane.

You’re much better off running a 95 octane tune file and be safe than run the higher power file and run into pinging/detonation.


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[Psych101]

As far as I know you can. But will need to double check.

What is a “normal timing curve for a flash like this?

Currently my car is -4.5deg @3000rpm. -1.5 @redline.

Seems very retarded?


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I don't think timing is your issue. The problem is more boost than the engine can process at lower rpm. Reducing boost (aka custom tune) is one solution. Talk to the APR dealer and see if they have a solution.

It is normal to have delayed timing under high boost conditions but can't tell you what values to expect on this motor.

[tigger73]

I don't think timing is your issue. The problem is more boost than the engine can process at lower rpm. Reducing boost (aka custom tune) is one solution. Talk to the APR dealer and see if they have a solution.

It is normal to have delayed timing under high boost conditions but can't tell you what values to expect on this motor.

I think APR will tell him to run the correct fuel for the file. If he's got a switchable tune then hopefully he has a 95 file that he can run while he's running lower octane fuel.

There's nothing wrong with the tune. The problem is with the fuel.

And APR generally won't do custom tunes. I don't think running on 95 with 10% ethanol is going to get it to 98 octane and that is where the issue is. Octane booster will help but probably just best to run the lower octane file if he can't get a reliable source of 98.

[Boosted_GP]

Hey guys.

Thanks for all the input.

Forgot to add. My tune is a 95Ron file. (At least that’s what I saw being loaded on my car)

No 98 Ron in South Africa. 95Ron is the highest. So either octane booster or ethanol.

Ethanol here has a Ron if 113. So if my maths is correct 10% eth will get you to 98.8 Ron. But I know it has different burn properties.

Also I live at 1600m. (5700ft) ASL. so the turbo works hard to make the boost.

I will go back to the dealer tomorrow and try establish the issues and see what we can do.

Personally I prefer a lower boost correct timing tune to a high boost retarded timing tune.

What logging software does everyone use for this?


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[Sharkie]

If you believe your APR dealer knows what he/she is doing, taking it back and show them the problem. Knowing tuners in RSA quite well, it is a bit of a hit and miss picking a good tuner ...... also, unless other similarly tuned cars are doing the same thing there may be something else wrong with your car. It is not uncommon for another issue (boost leak for instance) to remain undetected in stock form but show up when tuned. Have the dealer identify the problem and then fix it.

Remember that the 95 tune from the USA (where APR is based) is actually the 98 tune for the rest of the world, so a 93 tune may be a better fit for RSA. Even then I'd be adding a good octane booster to it (no not ethanol!).

[Dose Pipe Sutututu]

Thanks tigger73. Yes I agree. I am not happy with the timing Pull.

I’m waiting for my proper obd reader to arrive so using my phone at the moment. So not sure if it’s timing pull or actual timing of cylinder 1.

No way it would be running negative timing, car wouldn't move. Running negative timing is only for anti-lag strategies OR torque reduction during gear change.

I assume what you're logging is knock strategies from either long term or short term ignition trim tables.


My advice is go back to your APR flasher and ask for the low torque APR Stage 1 tune, from the torque curve you can see they ramp the boost much more "gently" i.e. progressive DC applied on the wastegate instead of aggressive DC.

I doubt APR "tuners" have the ability to provide custom tunes, all APR are OTS.

[tigger73]

No way it would be running negative timing, car wouldn't move. Running negative timing is only for anti-lag strategies OR torque reduction during gear change.

I assume what you're logging is knock strategies from either long term or short term ignition trim tables.


My advice is go back to your APR flasher and ask for the low torque APR Stage 1 tune, from the torque curve you can see they ramp the boost much more "gently" i.e. progressive DC applied on the wastegate instead of aggressive DC.

I doubt APR "tuners" have the ability to provide custom tunes, all APR are OTS.

You can log timing retardation per cylinder which is the amount the ECU is pulling back timing to prevent detonation.




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[Jy_tig]

So it seems stage 1 is gets about a 5s 0-100. Anyone have recorded times of a stage 2 or 2+?

[FastMitch]

Forgot to add. My tune is a 95Ron file. (At least that’s what I saw being loaded on my car)

Does this mean there exists a '91Ron file' so you can put standard 91 unleaded in the Tiguan ?