Let the tinkering continue.....

[Greg Roles]

All that gunk is really quite scary. I thought VW were good engineers. Why didn't they engineer this gunk out of the system to prolong engine life. Maybe they are thinking along the lines of the chinese and design something to just last past the warranty and then die like my kettle. I reckon theres an art form to predicting when something is going to die.

I am really tempted to perfom inlet surgery on my TDI as well but the car being under warranty is always on the back of my mind. Maybe next christmas santa could give me a mann oil/air separator and a day of patience.

It's all to do with emissons. I'm sure the actual engine design team didn't vote yes to the EGR levels, but had no choice to pass Euro V and VI. Decide for yourself, but the best avenue is a Provent and the odd spray flush offered by VW, as hobbling the EGR will indeed raise EGT's and CO outputs. I've been making sure my inlet is as cool as possible, and along with water meth my CO should be as low or lower than stock when I remove my EGR completely. Those with DPF's need to be extra careful, as that gunk when spray cleaned will most likely end up in the DPF as non regenable ash. And that is direct from the VW tech bulletin I have talking about oil burning to ash, and that eventually clogs the DPF permanently.

[Preen59]

Haha i was wondering why i woke up sore on the weekend and couldn't remember the night before.. You could have just bought my a drink instead of slipping something in it you know..


Good info here. Me likey.

[Calais]

Seeing all that accumulated soot and matter through the intake has answered a lot of questions I had about my last car and the steady decline in fuel economy and the assosciated decrease in performance. I can only imagine how my Fiat Punto Sport 1.9 JTD would have been faring when I sold it with 80,000kms on the clock......

Thanks again for the edumacation this thread is providing!

[gldgti]

good work mate.

that looks a lot like the level of buildup we found on mollins 1z tdi before we cleaned and put it in the mk1... although a bit drier (less oil). i would say the pro-vent has probably helped quite a lot.

that throttle body assembly is a bit sad - be a good thing to be rid of that. how long before your warranty runs out?

[dazag]

Quick question - is this happening with all TDI engines, both PD and CR versions??
I have a brand new Skoda RS with the VW TDI 125kw CR engine fitted, only done a little under 4K in it so far - should I be checking the inlet for oil contamination?? I guess depending on what i find I should be looking at a Pro-vent to slow the problem down. But going off your pics cogdoc, it's doesn't completely fix the problem, just masks it for a bit longer and make it a bit more manageable...........
What a pain in the arse!

[Greg Roles]

good work mate.

that looks a lot like the level of buildup we found on mollins 1z tdi before we cleaned and put it in the mk1... although a bit drier (less oil). i would say the pro-vent has probably helped quite a lot.

that throttle body assembly is a bit sad - be a good thing to be rid of that. how long before your warranty runs out?

I'd reckon about the time Gav puts a DPF delete kit onto it! Two years in now mate, and no probs so far....yep I'll bet stock TDI's are a lot oily-er....

[Greg Roles]

Quick question - is this happening with all TDI engines, both PD and CR versions??
I have a brand new Skoda RS with the VW TDI 125kw CR engine fitted, only done a little under 4K in it so far - should I be checking the inlet for oil contamination?? I guess depending on what i find I should be looking at a Pro-vent to slow the problem down. But going off your pics cogdoc, it's doesn't completely fix the problem, just masks it for a bit longer and make it a bit more manageable...........
What a pain in the arse!

Can't prove it, but I'd put money on it. Provent is only a minimiser, not a solution, but anyone with a DPF needs a Provent moreso, as any burnt oil ash ends up in the DPF, and can't be burnt off. As Aydan mentioned, my gunk was definately dry, and I'd expect a similar 50K TDI such as MikinOz's to be a lot wetter. Perhaps that would help it get sucked into the engine???

I expect all modern diesels with the latest emissions to suffer from this to some extent.

[CatonaPC©]

This goes out to all the Provent non believers

I still wouldn't install a provent. I never doubted the gunk builds up, either. What you have shown here is that with regular maintenance, it can be cleaned. It's probably not the best solution, but for the vast majority of TDI owners who cannot or do not wish to tamper with their cars, our only option is the dealer servicing.

Nevertheless it's an excellent visual example of what to expect, and I'll be monitoring it carefully.

[Calais]

I still wouldn't install a provent. I never doubted the gunk builds up, either. What you have shown here is that with regular maintenance, it can be cleaned. It's probably not the best solution, but for the vast majority of TDI owners who cannot or do not wish to tamper with their cars, our only option is the dealer servicing.

Nevertheless it's an excellent visual example of what to expect, and I'll be monitoring it carefully.

I'll be the first to put my hand up and say that it is highly unlikely a dealer would ever pull down the inlet side of diesel as part of 'routine servicing'.

I'd like to know what sort of replacement cost is on the DPF, considering that with the addition of a provent, you would in effect be preventing a lot of the gunk from re-entering the combustion chamber, and reducing the risk of internal damage over time.

I am happy to stand corrected if my understanding is inaccurate though!

[craigy]

I'll be the first to put my hand up and say that it is highly unlikely a dealer would ever pull down the inlet side of diesel as part of 'routine servicing'.

I'd like to know what sort of replacement cost is on the DPF, considering that with the addition of a provent, you would in effect be preventing a lot of the gunk from re-entering the combustion chamber, and reducing the risk of internal damage over time.

I am happy to stand corrected if my understanding is inaccurate though!

VW do know about the build up and do check it as part of the service. My 45K service had an additional cleaning of the intake service which I was charged for.
I will be removing DPF, adding Provent and adding water/methanol injection in the near future.

[Transporter]

I'll be the first to put my hand up and say that it is highly unlikely a dealer would ever pull down the inlet side of diesel as part of 'routine servicing'.

I'd like to know what sort of replacement cost is on the DPF, considering that with the addition of a provent, you would in effect be preventing a lot of the gunk from re-entering the combustion chamber, and reducing the risk of internal damage over time.

I am happy to stand corrected if my understanding is inaccurate though!

Approximately between $3,000.00 and $5,000.00 you should get at least 160,000 km out of the DPF it depends how and where you drive. The Provent will save you a lot of money on repairs and extra maintenance, if you keep your car beyond 100,000km. These people who upgrade their rides every 3 years or so, can blindly trust VW technicians who created the engines where a lot of blow by can mess up the inlet tract, cause other problems and then turn the blind eye on it, saying that's normal.

[Greg Roles]

I'll be the first to put my hand up and say that it is highly unlikely a dealer would ever pull down the inlet side of diesel as part of 'routine servicing'.

I'd like to know what sort of replacement cost is on the DPF, considering that with the addition of a provent, you would in effect be preventing a lot of the gunk from re-entering the combustion chamber, and reducing the risk of internal damage over time.

I am happy to stand corrected if my understanding is inaccurate though!

A Provent will definately prolong the life of your DPF. Simple fact that VW themselves state it fills up eventually due to non burnable oil ash amongst other things. $5500 is the full VW Australia price someone on here mentioned.

Ludicrous huh?

[gregozedobe]

I will look very seriously at trading my TDI just before the extended warranty runs out (in 3 years time).

It will be 6 years old by then and probably have covered approx 100 - 120,000Km. IMO replacement parts are needed way too often and cost way too much. Common (expensive) problems on 2.5 TDI Transporters are DMF, driveshafts, Turbo, Aircon, Waterpump, Auto gearbox (I have a manual) and long term I think the DPF is also very much under suspicion.

It's a great van to drive, but I don't like the idea of not being covered by warranty after reading the all too common complaints about expensive repairs (some of the tales of woe on the Brickyard forum are particularly sobering).

[motk]

A Provent will definately prolong the life of your DPF. Simple fact that VW themselves state it fills up eventually due to non burnable oil ash amongst other things. $5500 is the full VW Australia price someone on here mentioned.

Ludicrous huh?

Eep. Glad I have the non DPF engine then, but it doesn't auger well for the Tiguan I was looking into ... Surely VW can't be relying on nobody in the 2nd hand market noticing this? A bit concerning for resale at least!

[Greg Roles]

Anyhoo, I've got my solution to the gunk problem, ditch all the systems involved, so back to liberation of NM...

I've just heard the DPF delete pipe is about 2 weeks away. I'm aiming to have the full 2.5" inlet welded up and fitted, the EGR and throttle flap deleted from the inlet with my QTP flap instead ( only for shut down / run away ), the Snow kit installed and gassed up, and a cat back exhaust to suit.

I've simply got to find a good inlet plumbing welder here in SE Qld and it's a pretty straight forward install, but I'm after someone who can do a custom cone from the turbo outlet, building up to 2.5" much like the stock pipe kinda does ( it's full of dents for fitment ). I am keen to hear from anyone who has a recommendation!!

Secondly, and more perplexingly is the exhaust. The JBS DPF delete pipe is 2.75", which is both bigger by 1/4" and has no DPF, so it's going to flow a LOT better, but to be honest I'd prefer a 3-3.5" downpipe, purely for zero backpressure. A 2.5" pipe is good for around 250hp on a gasser, but if you add in the higher volumetric efficiency and sheer gas flow of a diesel, well I wish it was a little larger for my power goals. For the "stock" DPF delete tune ( which by all accounts is AWESOME ) it's gonna be fine, but I'm aiming for a bit beyond that.

So I've got a 2.75 dump, and a stock 2.5 system. Given larger cat back exhausts never liberate much power ( if any! ), as the gas has cooled, and it's the hotter downpipe flow that matters, I'm thinking of sticking to the stock cat back, adding a custom resonator only, and dumping it to the road at the rear axle area. Shorter, and basically straight, should flow ideally.

Still keen on one of those Aero muffs, but they recommend putting it up as close to the front as possible in a diesel, given the lower temp gases, so I'm stuck between choosing a 3" to be as low a restriction as possible with a 2.75" pipe in, or simply a 2.5" unit. They are absolutely straight through, but all the research I've done shows they are both living up to the hype of helping flow, hp and MPG, and quieter than anyone would believe. I'm going to commit to an exhaust plan this week, so any ideas otherwise????