VW Nationals 2009 Sydney.

[Mischa]

depends, how expensive are you when it comes to be payed off??

Jokes.

That be fine with me. but you can't enter your car and judge at the same time eh?

meh i honestly couldnt care less about entering or not, i just wanna have my cars in the show undercover. ill spend a bit more time washing them this time too

anyone wanna judge with me?

[fuzion]

you need in all honesty people who KNOW mk1, know mk2/mk3/mk4 .. not only if wow it has wheels and its lowered.. or a bodykit. overall finish etc!

im happy with you judging, long as you dont wear those freakin fishnets again like the other night...................................

im happy to come just for the gtg, so either way .. might even bring the passat if its done!

HOPEFULLY steve will FINISH hes freakin car, i reckon he doesnt even have it anymore!

[Mischa]

well i know the mechanicals but im not a car cleaning freak like a lot of people here. maybe someone who's into the whole detailing thing could help me out with that side of it since afterall its a show&shine

[static1800]

id happily come and talk at the meeting if need be but they are aircooled based people and watercooled cars owned by them are mk1/mk2s and no mk3/mk4/mk5 etc! things are expected to change of course no doubt..

Actually not the case, several of the guys from club vw have mk3's and mk4's as daily drivers.

There were some issues last year with awards but i dont think that came down to judging but errors in data entry or when the form was filled out for entry.

I think this year we need simpler categories, just best;

mk1
mk2
mk3
mk4
mk5
Audi
Seat
scirocco/corrado

best in show (all models)
best engineered

etc. no standard and modified categories which will make judging simpler and I think it makes more sense because a standard mk3, mk4 or mk5 isnt at all special. We will also have no issue of is my car standard or modified like we have in the past.

just my 2c

[DUB 20V]

Actually not the case, several of the guys from club vw have mk3's and mk4's as daily drivers.

There were some issues last year with awards but i dont think that came down to judging but errors in data entry or when the form was filled out for entry.

I think this year we need simpler categories, just best;

mk1
mk2
mk3
mk4
mk5
Audi
Seat
scirocco/corrado

best in show (all models)
best engineered

etc. no standard and modified categories which will make judging simpler and I think it makes more sense because a standard mk3, mk4 or mk5 isnt at all special. We will also have no issue of is my car standard or modified like we have in the past.

just my 2c

well that prob drops about 25 cars cause std clean cars wont bother trying to take on a modded car imo,

[DubSteve]

HOPEFULLY steve will FINISH hes freakin car, i reckon he doesnt even have it anymore!

Yeha you could be right dude lol, its still there working on it this weekend

[static1800]

That could be the case but a standard mk3 be it well looked after isn't in the same league as a standard mk1 or split window Kombi for example. Sure it still requires looking after but I don't feel its the same because the majority of our cars are fairly new as opposed to the aircoolers.

That also brings up how we would judge our cars you shouldn't automatically win because your mod list 2 pages long, but I don't think we fit into the standard all out fit and finish of the aircooled guys.

It is a hard thing to juggle either way we go people are going to be upset which always happens at shows... how about we just have no awards to avoid all the whinging that will ensue

[DUB 20V]

That could be the case but a standard mk3 be it well looked after isn't in the same league as a standard mk1 or split window Kombi for example. Sure it still requires looking after but I don't feel its the same because the majority of our cars are fairly new as opposed to the aircoolers.

That also brings up how we would judge our cars you shouldn't automatically win because your mod list 2 pages long, but I don't think we fit into the standard all out fit and finish of the aircooled guys.

It is a hard thing to juggle either way we go people are going to be upset which always happens at shows... how about we just have no awards to avoid all the whinging that will ensue

yeah no awards sounds good, and we all just have a big bbq and drinks.

[fuzion]

no awards sounds good.. doesnt bother me either way.

print outs for people im sure they're happy. or maybe a performance vw/vwma showbag or something with a mug? who knows.

i understand what your saying static and agree, and yes 2 page+mods etc.. but it is unfair also to people who HAVE modified golfs/passats/whatever who modify to look better (in they're opinion) and get nothing from it as they are in the same league as a factory standard vehicle.. get what i mean?

if monies is the issue for trophies or awards/show bags or products you may/may not win .. i am sure people such as seb, matt, dragan, ian, guy etc would be happy to provide some funds or actual trophies to make sure we do have enough categories for people to be enticed to enter they're vehicle.

(not argueing here) just continueing the convo

[static1800]

I see exactly where you guys are coming from, it is a tricky decision to make. The main reason I bring up the standard/modified thing is in the past it has always been hard to say this car is standard and this one is modified as in where is the line drawn. I guarantee we won't have a dead standard mk1 or mk2 turn up if there are any out there at all so why have a class for it? I personally don't care if I win a prize or not, I have in the past and it was cool but it's not the reason I come to the show.

If we can come up with a judging system that is fair for both modified and standard cars to be in the same class than that would be great, not sure if it can be done or not though.

I think the simpler it is the better for judging and for our sakes.

[The_Hawk]

It's pretty much up to us what categories we have and how we judge them. Club Vee Dub are pretty accomodating with whatever number of trophies we want to have.

What we DO need is a group that wants to sit down somewhere and nut out what categories and how they will be judged (and by whom).

I would suggest we have a set of judges for each category (you can't judge your own, but you can judge multiple categories), you need ot have good knowledge to judge a category. This way you can enter your Mk4 but judge Mk1's for example and it should all be over much quicker, easier and with some knowledge (80's Vans anyone? )

Will have to have a beer night at someone's house/pub sometime soon to start this process so it can be presented to Club VeeDub with enough time to be organised right. It would also be good if we had a volunteer or two to be part of the Club VeeDub Nationals Comittee itself, although you would need to be a financial member of Club VeeDub, something I strongly encourage all Sydney based people to do anyway. If nothing else it gets you into a CAMS affiliated club

[Golf Loon]

you need in all honesty people who KNOW mk1, know mk2/mk3/mk4 .. not only if wow it has wheels and its lowered.. or a bodykit. overall finish etc!
!

Fuzion, you need to come to ameeting and express your opinion. Myself and Hawk and a few others organized the watercooled judging last year and have completely re-arranged the judging criteria.

There was a glitch in the communication between our judges and the reading out of the prizes which hopefully wont happen this year.

Basically its a hard job, come along and help us or dont whinge about it.

[Golf Loon]

If you dont have standard and modified, its all just judged on fit and finished, so the cleanest car wins.

[Jarred]

If you dont have standard and modified, its all just judged on fit and finished, so the cleanest car wins.

You make a good point Matt, as well as a few others.

I think standard class is pointless, esp for the newer cars, mk 3, 4, 5 etc. Seeing a standard mk 1 is pretty impressive, although significantly rarer than a standard `69 bug. hence, I don't think there will be many std mk 1's there.

Perhaps we can have two category's for watercooled cars. Daily driver & modified. That way the cars that get driven everyday & have stone chips and practical ride heights can compete against each other and then the heavily modded cars can compete in thier own category.

It's a rough idea I know but work with me. Maybe seperate the catergory's based on number of modifications. ie 5 Mods will put you in "standard" and 6 or more mods put you in the "modified class". Something like that. the what is classed as a "mod" will have to be clearly defined though. I was thinking of bigger mods, like wheels, susp, shaving, body kit, engine work etc not just small "trinket" type mods.

Maybe you could pitch the mk 4's & 5's together and early cars together. or split up the car's by year.

Anyways, before I start rambling, that's my idea, though it does need work.. happy to discuss it further.

[DubSteve]

If you dont have standard and modified, its all just judged on fit and finished, so the cleanest car wins.

Point right there!

I also think besides the muckup of last year the judging criteria that we had put down was pretty good.

I apart from that it was a much better improvement than the year before!