Will this intercooler fit?

[Tim]

No!
What we are saying is that not all changes in direction are created equally.

[h100vw]

I can see both sides of this argument and I reckon providing the end tanks have a large enough capacity, room for the air to change direction without hitting too much of a dead end, then whether it is single or dual pass will make very little difference.

Gavin

[kaanage]

That proviso is where the discussion currently sits!

Anecdotally, there isn't much pressure drop across the SEAT FMIC but I await the results of the dyno day with bated breath (and suggest that the group purchase be put on hold until this is settled with meaningful measurements of the pressure and temperature drops )

[Tim]

I can see both sides of this argument and I reckon providing the end tanks have a large enough capacity, room for the air to change direction without hitting too much of a dead end, then whether it is single or dual pass will make very little difference.

Gavin

Im with you there. If the end tanks were big enough I guess it would flow in a similar fashion to 2 separate 90 degree bends. Id love to see how it all worked in reality.

[Guy_H]

You cannot judge the flow by looking at the outside of the intercoolers end tanks either.

The reason the APR one works so well is the internal vanes in the end tanks that are cast in to direct the airflow - unfortunately it adds considerably to the costs:

APR - High Performance Development for Audi, VW and Porsche Vehicles.

[VWindahouse]

Guy, any chance of getting a Polo along on Saturday with the APR cooler??

You busy Eddy?

[Redliner]

Install instructions for Seat:

http://forgemotorsport.co.uk/media/intssibpinst.pdf

The pipework instructions should all be relevant.

[Eddy]

Guy, any chance of getting a Polo along on Saturday with the APR cooler??

You busy Eddy?

Hoyhoy.

Yeah.
Anthony me will be busy spectating you chaps.
Now I have a choice of 3 vehicles to drive up there, which one will I take.

[clicht]

Looking forward to seeing the real life test this weekend.
I may be lookng at this rather simplistically, but the larger the area of the ic, the lower the temp. However the potential for more back pressure.
So would there be a formula for whats beter... Lower temp, less boost ( cause of pressure) or higher temp, more boost.
The forge unit is not good, since it has too much pressure drop, but given the charge temperature drop, shirley it is still beter than the smic.
The same hold true for larger ic's, although there will be a point of diminishing returns.
However lets see this weekends runs. I trust guy will be monitoring charge temp/ pressure vs. Kwatw

[VWindahouse]

Hoyhoy.

Yeah.
Anthony me will be busy spectating you chaps.
Now I have a choice of 3 vehicles to drive up there, which one will I take.

I'd be happy to kick in some coin to see the wee Blue Girl run or maybe Guy will shout you for being such an awesome customer

Either way it would be brilliant to have an APR intercooler to do some comparisons with.

Cheers Eddy!

[Sharkie]

I'd be happy to kick in some coin to see the wee Blue Girl run or maybe Guy will shout you for being such an awesome customer

Either way it would be brilliant to have an APR intercooler to do some comparisons with.

Cheers Eddy!

Agree with Ant here, Eddy ..... only, I'm interested to see the K04, as that is in my near future ..... BRING THE POLO!

[seangti]

I trust guy will be monitoring charge temp/ pressure vs. Kwatw

This may be better raised in the dyno thread, though what will be measured this weekend? kwatw will be secondary to charge temps and pressure drop as that's the basis of this discussion and limits the variables (which there are still quite a few).

Out of curiousity, does air intake method impact IC temps or flow rate? i.e. PD160 Vs Stock Vs ram/pod style? (or am I getting carried away here?)

[Guy_H]

http://www.vwwatercooled.org.au/forums/f21/polo-vag-dyno-day-brisbane-saturday-august-25th-75349.html

Updated list.

We will certainly log what we can within reason on the day - it's pretty easy to check the boost requested vs actual & the intake temps - start & finish - so no problem there!

We need someone to collate the data & if anyone is an Excel wiz, then you can draw up all sorts of nice comparison graphs!

[Guy_H]

On the subject of intercoolers, there is some excellent information on design & construction here:

ARE Cooling

ARE have been around for a long time & have built some prototype stuff for us over the years, they also initially worked with us on resizing & testing the APR core for the 9N Polo (unfortunately we discontinued it due to lack of demand).

Well worth the time to read it.

[noone]

So would there be a formula for whats beter... Lower temp, less boost ( cause of pressure) or higher temp, more boost.The forge unit is not good, since it has too much pressure drop, but given the charge temperature drop, shirley it is still beter than the smic.

Lots of variables, temp, humidity, lag, turbo, other restrictions. Even altitude can make a difference. Even perception, a better peak boost may appeal more to some than mid range torque.

I found that in summer the SMIC can not cool sufficiently when not moving (trafic lights, etc) whilst I didn't gain any power from the Forge system, it certainly helped my power in summer.

This is also impacted by the tune, knock sensors, etc, so a tune with more timing may be inclined to pull timing more easily with a little extra temp.