Flat battery problem after installing 9000-1 - any suggestions ?

[NZTiguan]

Well said Maverick

[G-rig]

sorry to bring up this subject again, but in fairness to everyone, the battery drain problem does actually appear to be the car's problem. Batteries running flat have been reported with the RCD510 and also now with RNS510 units.

What was the problem and how did you fix it anyway? I doubt it would be the car's problem or the service team would have fixed it? Did you upgrade the can gateway?

[CatonaPC©]

Well said Maverick

I concur, also.

[Maverick]

And to add one last little bit. With the RNS 510 all versions up until firmware revision 1100 worked in all Mark V's with no power drain issues. Firmware release 2660 came out and upgraded the unit to be functionally the same (CAN bus interface wise) as the other third generation head units (RNS 310, RCD 210, RCD 310 and RCD 510) and upgrading this would show a power drain issue with cars with older CAN bus gateways.

But this is not an official Volkswagen release as such and was not performed by the dealers and was not intended for older cars. Any car that had a RNS 510 installed from the factory did not have any problems with this firmware.

Volkswagen are releasing (internally but they will be available on the interweb very soon after) two new firmware revisions in the next week or two.

2700 which is an update to 2660 and hopefully will fix a few bugs like with the location showing up in Germany at startup. It is possible that the location showing up in Germany is because the firmware has been loaded on older hardware that can't support this version fully.

900 which doesn't have voice control but is designed for older headunits A and B revision and doesn't have the power drain issue when fitted in older cars.

I have info here on the problem along with the fix. Volkswagen have a TSB? (I think it's a TSB will have to dig it out) which mirrors what I have listed.

Upgrading 2nd generation radios (RCD 300, RCD 500) to 3rd generation (RCD 210, RCD 310, RNS 310, RCD 510) power drain issue

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What was the problem and how did you fix it anyway? I doubt it would be the car's problem or the service team would have fixed it? Did you upgrade the can gateway?

I don't have the problem so never had to fix anything.

[clip]

Thanks for some more clarity around this issue Maverick.

[G-rig]

I don't have the problem so never had to fix anything.

So no battery drain or just on some older cars?

[clip]

So no battery drain or just on some older cars?

It's complicated G rig. As I say, it has not happened to me and I have run an alternative branded NAV unit. But has to others with Tigs and other VW models.

I was merely pointing out that this issue is not confined just to alternative branded NAV units (as many are quick to blame). There is more to it than that, as Maverick indicates.

[ploz58]

Batter drain

a little bit off the subject, but may give some light on this matter of battery drain.

Friends in the USA, purchased for their parents an brand new 5 series BMW,
the car was stock standard but had lots of "nice things".
The parents only had on old chev, and raised all their kids to go to uni and get good jobs etc.


Back to the subject

The car pretty much only got driven to church on sundays, and from new and stock, it was developing a flat battery between drives to church, Multiple visits to BMW to locate the " Fault'. Father wanted his old chev back

The solution for them was to place the car on a trickle charger between Church trips!! This was the solution from BMW and they gave them a trickle charger.

I believe the 5 series uses a Canbus system and BMW have fairly good diagnositc equipment

Just my 2 cents

Forums are a great place to learn stuff

Phil

[G-rig]

That's a good point, if you are only doing very short trips or not using the car much the battery probably isn't getting charged enough, and given other electronics turn on/off fairly regularly then that will drain the battery. Although the battery in most new VW's is pretty good i thought (mine is 640A) and the car should start.

I've got a similar thing with my amps & turn on pop/voltage drop.

[Maverick]

.......
The car pretty much only got driven to church on sundays, and from new and stock, it was developing a flat battery between drives to church, Multiple visits to BMW to locate the " Fault'. Father wanted his old chev back

The solution for them was to place the car on a trickle charger between Church trips!! This was the solution from BMW and they gave them a trickle charger.

I believe the 5 series uses a Canbus system and BMW have fairly good diagnositc equipment..........

But a fault with a BMW has what to do with CAN bus?

That's like saying that one computer on a network is faulty so the whole network is faulty and so are all other networks.

BMW's don't all go flat after a week because of CAN bus, like the VW they can sit for months and still start without a problem. CAN bus is just a way for modules in the car to communicate effectively with a large reduction in the amount of wiring requires which reduces manufacturing costs, improves fuel consumption and reduced number of connections.

And one of the big benefits of CAN bus is power saving where it can shed modules in order to save power. Little things like turning off lights before they drain the battery are all extras and whilst some of the features were around before CAN bus they weren't all integrated and didn't work together.

Problems occur because many don't take take the time to understand what CAN bus is, how it works or the benefits it offers and want to do things the old way which are no longer appropriate or workable. The same people are quick to blame the car and/or CAN bus when in reality the problem is the product and/or the install.

In the past you could be an auto electrician with minimal skills and no computer knowledge, now it requires you to understand a great deal more about the car and no longer can you get by with just a multimeter but specialised tools need to be added to the inventory.

It's complicated G rig. As I say, it has not happened to me and I have run an alternative branded NAV unit. But has to others with Tigs and other VW models.

I was merely pointing out that this issue is not confined just to alternative branded NAV units (as many are quick to blame). There is more to it than that, as Maverick indicates.

Aftermarket head units are where the majority of problems are, it you take a look at the problems the waywell units have had through multiple revisions and there is no pattern as to CAN bus gateway versions nor the version of waywell headunit.

The third generation problem with VW headunits is well documented, consistent and only a recent "issue" which is easily resolved with a gateway change.

Clearly waywell have absolutely no idea what they are doing nor have they taken the time to properly implement their CAN bus interface. I'd put money on them taking another product from any manufacturer (like one of the standalone interfaces for generic headunits) and reverse engineering this and only picking up parts of instructions that work in certain cars and not in others.

You can see this in their development where one issue is fixed and five other problems are introduced. It's very hit and miss and I can see problems occurring when the headunits stop working when VW does an update to the car or changes out a module. The owner will no doubt blame VW. The same will apply when the waywell units are sold, they may have worked in the original car but may not work in the new car.

There are companies that get the CAN bus interfaces to work correctly, the real question is why can't waywell

[ploz58]

Can bus

Im getting a little lost,
Is there a good reference that explains exactly what CANBUS does or is ?

kind regards
Phil

[Transporter]

Im getting a little lost,
Is there a good reference that explains exactly what CANBUS does or is ?

kind regards
Phil

Try here. for more is your friend

[sa-r32]

I just had my first battery drain episode after installing the avc90001 and not driving the car for 3 days.

After reading the thread I'm not certain I saw a fix, is there one ?

Thanks
Paul

[Sanman]

I just had my first battery drain episode after installing the avc90001 and not driving the car for 3 days.

After reading the thread I'm not certain I saw a fix, is there one ?

Thanks
Paul

Contact Rob at auspacks who is an AVC9000-1 reseller

http://members.optusnet.com.au/auspacks/

He has a modified harness for the AVC9000-1 that integrates a relay that disconnects the CANbus when the ignition is off. Solves the battery drain problem