The Indicator Stalk Thread

[thestu]

Just deal with every car being different in some way! It's easy!!!!!!!

But I do lean towards the left because I own two cars with it there.

[ConR]

We can make it easy on everyone and remove the stalk all together and make it voice activated. But if you've lost your voice you're screwed.

[Greg Roles]

It annoys me enough I'm not opposed to the idea of swapping them over despite the fact they will end up upside down and need the action reversed. I'm with mountain man on this one, it's pure indifference.

[Ryan_R]

The Ford Focus also has its indicator on the left

I know that - obviously you didn't get it

[Corey_R]

lol yeah... I re-read.
I have a Ford Focus (08 TDCi with <5000km on it) at my disposal. I could sell the Polo GTI at any time and use the Focus whilst I'm waiting for my R to arrive.... I'm delaying selling the Polo as much as possible, cause that means I'd have to drive the Focus... lol

[slipshot]

To mountainman - you should remember that Europe includes both left and right hand drive countries (albeit mostly lhd) so stating Europe has them in a particular position is not correct.

The UK has a rule (ADR equivalent) that says all indicators must be on the left hand side of the steering column. Been like that for donkeys years. Don;t know the reasons for that though.

Mainland Europe cars and scandiwegans have it on the left too bu6t they are lhd. Given most cars that derive from Europe come from the UK (spec wise) because of the rhd similarity, the indicators will remain on the left and why not.

Japan has rhd cars yet has both as far as I remember although my mind could be playing tricks.

Because Australia allows both, people will offer both. It's a cost saving ultimately. There are more lhd cars sold in the world that rhd, so those in rhd markets must pander to the greater economies of scale.

I found the right indicator strange when I first moved here in 2000, bought a WRX and used the wipers quite a few times. But you soon get used to it and then no big deal. My preference is the left, but only because that is what I'm far more used to.

Having said that, 5 pages of chat about it shows it's an emotive subject. But I doubt many people could contribute their placement to an accident!

[Tony_Mitchell_1983]

Whats wrong with a Corolla?.... not that Ive ever owned one but a lot of nice people have (probably a lot more people than have owned Vdubs - but Im not going to research it)

Nothing. It's what I was driving before the golf. I guess that makes me a professional on the subject.

My point was they're Japanese so the indicator lever won't confuse the more simple minded driver.

[Mountainman]

The UK has a rule (ADR equivalent) that says all indicators must be on the left hand side of the steering column. Been like that for donkeys years. Don;t know the reasons for that though.


Because Australia allows both, people will offer both. It's a cost saving ultimately. There are more lhd cars sold in the world that rhd, so those in rhd markets must pander to the greater economies of scale.

When I lived in London in the late 70's the new Honda Civic I owned had the indicators on the right just like the Civic I later owned in Australia.

Your second statement sums it up completely. We get what we get from Europe because it saves money and the regulations say they are allowed to do it, not because it is the best ergonomic set-up.

[ConR]

Sorry man, but the best ergonomic set-up is in the eye of the beholder. What seems right and comfortable to you may not apply to someone else. I have no issues whatsoever with the indicator being on the left. I came to the GTI from a Suzuki, where it was on the right. Adjusted to it within, well, the same day.

Perhaps you should end your comments with the words "in my opinion".

[Mountainman]

Sorry man, but the best ergonomic set-up is in the eye of the beholder.

lol.. I think you mean "beauty there".
Ah well, I guess that the world of car makers must have the same opinion as I do. How warmly comforting that feels haha.

[blanch0b]

in my opinon, left is best, ive been a righty all my life but now in the GTI it just seems to make more sense! (im negating the fact that im in love with my car and it can do no wrong - 'touch wood')

[ConR]

lol.. I think you mean "beauty there".
Ah well, I guess that the world of car makers must have the same opinion as I do. How warmly comforting that feels haha.

Really? I wasn't aware that those words could only be used within that context. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

It must also be comforting to be that cocky too eh? Maybe you should sell your VW and stay away from them, since the indicator is such a nuisance.

[Mountainman]

Maybe you should sell your VW and stay away from them, since the indicator is such a nuisance.

A nuisance? As I said before, yes, but hardly a deal breaker. I'm not being critical of the car itself but of VW (and Mercedes/BMW and all those other European manufacturers) themselves for taking the cheap way out. They didn't have to change it for the British market - their largest right hand drive market - so we are just left with what we've got. And cocky? I can be when I'm right. I notice no-one has been critical of VW for making all their German buyers put up with the indicators on the other side of the steering wheel to the gearchange.

[Corey_R]

Mountainman, I'm saying this as a moderator here, which now means I have to try and be as impartial as possible despite my opinion on the subject which is well known....

From Freedictionary.com

er·go·nom·ics
n.
1. (used with a sing. verb) The applied science of equipment design, as for the workplace, intended to maximize productivity by reducing operator fatigue and discomfort. Also called biotechnology, human engineering, human factors engineering.
2. (used with a pl. verb) Design factors, as for the workplace, intended to maximize productivity by minimizing operator fatigue and discomfort: The ergonomics of the new office were felt to be optimal.

As everyone here can read these forums, I assume everyone can see that not every person is the same height, shape or size. So designing equipment to be ergonomic means creating it with the adjustability to be adapted to a wide range of peoples requirements. A desk with is ergonomically laid out for one person, might be an ergonomic disaster for another person. It and the equipment on it needs to be adjustable to be truly ergonomic for more than one intended user.

Thus, your assertion that the correct "ergonomic" placement of the indicator stalk is on the right hand side directly conflicts with the actual definition of ergonomic. For an indicator stalk to be ergonomic, it'd need to be adjustable to suit the different requirements of different drivers.

So as a moderator, I ask you to please stop with your posts talking of "ergonomics" and European car manufacturers being "cheap", unless you can actually provide valid references as proof of either of these being the reason that particular manufacturers place the indicator on a particular side of the steering wheel. I don't wish for this thread to fall into the ditches. Cheers

[Tony_Mitchell_1983]

BOOOORRRRRING!!!!!!!

I don't wish for this thread to fall into the ditches.

It has fallen over. And I really really hope it doesn't get up!