How much torque can a DSG comfortably withstand..

[Jash]

Hey,

I am in the process of buying a Mk5 Golf GTi and am weighing up DSG vs. manual. I plan on doing a Stage 1 or 2 tune and want to see what people's thoughts are on robustness of the DSG? I am concious that reasonable increases in torque can be unhealthy for complicated boxes and don't want to wear one out too quickly.

J

[milldinho]

I've upgraded to k04 and have 407nm at wheels, which means more torque at the gearbox with no problem so far, but have blown a conrod hehe

[Tweeked]

I have 481nm at the wheels and it has been fine for 30,ooo km. After that sort of power increase clutches become the next issue. DSG software can also help.

[Transporter]

In long run, the manual is far better in the terms of reliability, that's for sure. So, if you can drive manual, go for the manual.

[tigger73]

DSG needs to be serviced every 60,000km. Oil in these is like gold as it's about $300-400 just for the oil (not including labour). Check that the DSG services have been done and that the gearbox shifts are clean (no shudder).

Keep in mind the DSG are an expensive unit to replace and probably one of the reasons that someone would sell their Mk5....

As Transporter says the manual is a much safer bet.

[h100vw]

On the other hand I can't think of reading that a DSG flew apart due to a tune on a road car. The mechatronics fail, that's well documented, there's places fixing that up these days.

DSGs need servicing true but the cost per km is negligible over 60k.

I tune a few of these and wouldn't pass up the chance of a good DSG car on the hunt for a manual, which as it rolls over 100k is creeping closer to needing a new clutch. That's likely to be a $2K plus job with a DMF.

Gavin

[nat225]

Dsg should be serviced at 60,000km OR 4 years.

Someone with the correct service manual please correct me incorrect.

It would take me 6 yrs to reach 60,000km.

And yeah as gavin said, manual clutch replacement and the LABOUR costs total is not cheap.

[parso_rex]

Actually DSG oil costs these days are not anywhere near that mentioned above, its certainly alot less now, I think our guys do the whole DSG service in that price range you mention and that's everything oil parts labour 2 people with vagcom etc!!
The DSG will hold far more torque in stock form than the manuals so in a bizzare twist it can actually work out cheaper than a heavy duty clutch replacement that you would certainly need with some serious power.
We have many cars now with hundreds of launches at the dragstrip and there have not been any signs of failure yet and these are launches above 4500rpm too. Its kind of weird because all of us have expected some very expensive clutch upgrades at some point but it just hasn't occurred........yet
oh and no one has 481 NM from a stage 2 tune bahhaaaaaa

[Tweeked]

oh and no one has 481 NM from a stage 2 tune bahhaaaaaa

Yes haha... this seems funny but Dyno result say otherwise. GTI35 standard with KO4, so yes it is closer to a stage 3 than a stage 2.

[Tweeked]

See attached.

[tigger73]

There's a big difference between a Pirelli/K04 car and GTI/K03. Even more when tuned. OP is looking at a Mk5 GTI and your dyno is for Mk6 Ed35 so we're really not comparing apples with apples.

The Ed35 is a seriously impressive car and keeps pulling all the way to redline compared to the GTI/K03 which tends to run out of puff (depending on the tune).

Keep in mind OPs original question - both cars will be running the same 6 speed DSG so he should be relatively "safe" with a stage 2 GTI.

Keep in mind that both cars have traction issues and this helps to "protect" the Transmission as the tyres are the limiting factor in transmitting all that torque/power to the road.

I'd be more concerned about the DSG in an AWD Golf R bit these seem to cope with the extra power from stage 2 tunes also.


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[Tweeked]

Tigger my only point is that the DSG can handle pretty much what most people will throw it's way (there is your apple). A reasonable increase in power and Tq will not hurt it.

[Ramee]

Tigger my only point is that the DSG can handle pretty much what most people will throw it's way (there is your apple). A reasonable increase in power and Tq will not hurt it.

Lol . Yes it will be able to handle about 600Nm of torque without breaking but eventually clutch will start to slip on DQ250 units (used for GTI and R). So clutch will be the limiting factor on DSGs. On the other hand DQ500 (Tiguans) DSG units have manufacture rating of 550 Nm torque limit but no idea what are the real limits are.

Hell one guy ran nitrous on his stage 2+ golf R and had close to 700 Nm of torque without breaking it. But soon he had to upgrade the clutch packs to SSP ones.

Nitrous is on! - VW GTI Forum / VW Rabbit Forum / VW R32 Forum / VW Golf Forum - Golfmkv.com