Whats the big deal about VR6's?

[The Seater]

I had two Mk2 GTi's, they handled as well as a front wheel drive car could but were slow as a wet week. I sold them and thought a VR6 was the answer. I was wrong.
I went out test driving VR6's and discovered that they really aren't that special at all. They do sound very nice though, and that did bring a smile to my face. I felt that the cars were exceptionally heavy in the front; handled like pigs; took a lot of effort to pull up and were all round too heavy. After learning about running and maintenance costs I was totally opposed to buying one.

I ended up buying a Seat Cupra Sport GTi. It has all the safety aspects of the VR6's with airbags etc. Has brakes practically the same size (Seat-280mm, VR6-288mm) both with ABS. Power is a bit shy (Seat-110kW, VR6-128kW). Same supposed "Traction Control" which is total crap in both circumstances. Less maintenance issues - 4cyl vs 6cyl. More comfortable - they have the same Recaro seats but Seat's ride is more supple.
Considering it is about 300kg lighter (and most of that is in the front end) the Seat has better handling, ride, performance, braking and economy. It's also years newer, and built with VW parts. In so many ways it is more of a proper GTi than Mk2, Mk3 and Mk4 golfs.

To put the performance side of things into perspective, I had two other people in the car at a set of lights next to a VR6 which only had a driver. The Seat won by half a car length to 100. Had it have only been me, I would have slaughtered it. Come to a corner, heaven knows how far in front of it I would have been.

So why all the hype about VR6's? :roll:

[Golf Loon]

I agree that the SEATs are underrated as a car. I think they are great buying and as you say like the original GTI, rather than the overweight Mk3, 4 and 5 Golfs.

BUT VR6s do make a great noise.

I have the best of both worlds, a Seat, with a VR6 in it!

[TassieGTi]

VR6

What I continually find ammusing is that people take so much from the fact that they may have 'dragged'a car from the traffic lights!! I have owned many modified cars with impressive specs on paper and have been involved in circuit racing for a number of years.....but have NEVER bothered trying to involve myself in a 'drag'. It would be very naive of you to think that your Seat out-performs a VR6 simply beacause you could reach 100 faster from the lights! What crap!

Apart from the fact that the Seat Cupra and Golf VR6 are completely different sized vehicles (Seat like a Polo) the specs are:

VW Golf VR6: 1245kg, 0-100 = 7.6 secs, torque = 235NM
Seat Cupra 16V: 1100kg, 0-100 = 7.9 secs, torque = 180NM

I only just recently sold my VR6 and loved it! I also drive a highly modified MK1 GTi 16V that can't even compare to the VR6 when it comes to pulling power, especially overtaking on the highway! Sure the MK1 handles better, but it does only weigh 850kg.

When intially sold for around $50 000, I am sure the type of people buying them were not those wanting to go dragging from the lights! For driving around the city and the odd drive on the highway...what a beautiful vehicle! With such great torque from the 6cyl, you don't need to rev its tits off to get around and change gears all the time! For driving on the highway you can't compare! As an example accelerating from 30-50mph in a VR6 takes 4.5 secs as compared to 7.3 secs in a 16V.

As for issues about maintenance, I have never had any more problems or costs associated with keeping my VR6 on the road than any other 4cyl VW I have owned!

The biggest issue for me is the fact that it is a Seat! Apart from using VW mechanicals, Seats to me look terrible and are ugly things! Tell your average Joe off the street that you own and drive a Seat and they will look blankly at you! It might aswell be a Lada! The Seat has not developed a reputation within Australia and their re-sale is terrible! I would not buy one for that fact that I would find it near impossible to sell it! The best thing about them being so cheap is that soon you will be able to pick one up for next to nothing , rip all the mechanicals out and put them in a MK1!

As for being a proper GTi it can never be......It's a Seat!

[imported_brackie]

Re: VR6

Seats to me look terrible and are ugly things!

Beauty is definitely in the eye of the beholder. I like the look of Seats. Sure, they ain't the prettiest car in the world but then neither is the Golf 3 or 4. I d agree that the main reason that they didn't sell well here is because of how they look, but we Aussies are a bit reluctant to take on unknown Europeans. Remember Lada and Skoda?? It always amazed me how well the Korean cars were marketed. We all know they aren't the best but soooo cheap!!!!

[The Seater]

I can honestly say that the Seat is quicker. I test drove 5 VR6's and none of them would contemplate arriving at 100 in less than 8 seconds. I would like to know if someone has achieved better than that in a standard car.
Around a track the VR6 would be horrible - it might have a marginally higher top end speed but would understeer too much in corners (as seen in a video I have seen, as you may well have, of a highly modified purple VR6 around Phillip Island). I believe a standard VR6 wouldn't be any quicker than a standard Cupra Sport around any track.
As for highway driving, again the VR6 might have the higher top speed but unless you go to the NT its useless. The Seat would have no trouble in accelerating at the same rate. You might have to work the engine harder and use the gears but its designed to do that and its fun.
I also found the VR motor highly inefficient. While test driving I noted 18ltr/100km while driving mildly quickly after a 15 minute drive. The VR6 puts out a measly 128kW and 235Nm. I used to own a 1978 Mercedes 280CE that put out 136kw and 240Nm from the same size motor (that standard engine setup was developed in the early 70's).
The Golf is 200mm longer, but cabin space is practically the same - only the boot is slightly smaller in the Seat.
Current prices of VR6's are a good indication of how they are not as good as they're cracked up to be. They were a $50,000 car 10 years ago and now can be picked up for under $10,000.
I agree, the Seat isn't the best looking car, but its not bad. The amount of blank stares coming off peoples faces after I've burnt them off sure is sweet though. The rarity factor is good. In fact I can only find one of them for sale at the moment:
http://carsales.com.au/pls/carsales/!cs_content.private_vehicle?vehicle_id=2790994&cur rent_rec=1&used_rec=6&total_rec=8&sort_type=&total _rec=8&sort_type=&make_id=25&state_id=-1&search_distance=25
Doesn't seem like too bad a price either compared to what you get for a VR6.

[aprr32]

I would have to say that none of your compaints about the vr6 have ever shown up in my R32 which is the best Golf ever made and the best looking water pumper to come out of VW!

[vee_dub]

oh well....

i believe MK3 is a very nice car...despite the facts Seat is a nice car too.

I personally drives 2 Mk3 GL n VR6, 2L with H&Rs handles, u canot believe how good it feels, with bit of camber adjustment it loveable.

VR6 is around 10 years old, i got it from a car wrecker recently, share between me n my cuz, so the suspension is abit weak n old :S indeed it feels abit under steer n stuff. Honestly if u install a set of coilovers n nice camber it wouldnt be a problems.

As u said VR6 SOUNDS GREAT, n it got a very well structure. High Torque engine~. LOOKS fat when u lower an MK3.~ indeed it sucks up lotta fuel, but may be it worthwhile hehe...n also it's an 6 cylinder 2.8L of course it sucks more.

with regard to service n parts heheehehe as if european cars service n parts can be cheap in australia. OO" heeheeee On the other hand, i aint sure about parts of SEAt.. i believe MK3 is easier to obtain than seat.

May be i am baised..cause i own 2 MK3...but that's my opinion~. when i compare cars..i compare to there chassis structure first, VR6 5 doors hatch and Seat Gti is a 3 doors hatch. It would be fair if u compare seat to CIVIC or 206 GTI. those 2 doors + Lock is pretty heavy.

as aprr32 said heheh R32 indeed the best golf even made....STANDARD it already looks Stunning! Despite the 3.2L..with 4 Motion it handles like a beast. I WISH i got one..

BUT EVERYONE GOT THEIR OWN WAY TO VIEW THINGS..I RESPECT THAT~


Big DuB

[evorobin]

Well having watched that vid of Matt's VR6 on the Island this weekend I'd say that it handles very well. Coming into the first corner after the straight it snaps into oversteer which he corrects

The Seater update your profile mate

[vee_dub]

if u really hate the under steer...snap a rear sway bar on from Whiteline 200 bucks hehe n then if u got bit og money camber the rear a lil
for sure over steer nor under

[TassieGTi]

VR6

You are never going to convince me with your argument Seater! As for saying the Seat is quicker...well I can only quote the facts, especially the 0-100 times as that is something I am not interested in testing! I own and drive a car for many reasons and burning someone off at the lights is certainly not one of them!

You are making alot of assumptions about the VR6 based on test drives, especially believing that a VR6 would be horrible around the track.....based on what experience? Additionally, believing that current prices of VR6s are an indication that they are not as good as they are cracked up to be is a highly ignorant comment!

I think that you missed my point when trying to compare a VR6 with a Seat Cupra! However, you have made your purchase and are obviously happy with your acquisition.....that's all that matters!

Personally, trying to compare a Seat with a Golf VR6 is like comparing a Porsche 924 with a 911!

[Golfwise]

One doesn't compare a SEAT Ibiza to a Golf they are not in the same size or price value category.
A SEAT Ibiza is a Polo with a Spanish body, short and narrow.
A Golf is a Golf.Say no more,they have already proven themselves.
And Seater when you burn everybody off at the lights think of the families of the 77 plus people that have died on Australian roads over the Christmas holidays.

[mikinoz]

will this be the discussion that we have of the R32 in years to come?

If Seat is a VW then an aircooled Beetle is a Porsche!

[GoLfMan]

sorry mate nothin will compare to the R32

[DVR68U]

hey guys ive been absent for a while, but i have a vr6 and i get 8l/100 and with a chip and front koni's i have nothing to complain about. but the vr6 was and is the best motor VAG has come up with. variations have come in many forms w8 and w12 engines. isnt it the w12 which is the most powerful current production car . 1000hp!

no matter what is said and done ill always love the VR6. The way it sounds with intake and exhaust ever time i get behind the wheel, im in a state of bliss with the pedal to the floor.
cheers brenton

[Golf Loon]

Good to see you back on the forum. Mate. I can hear his VR6 from 10ks away when he comes visiting, it has such a resonance to the exhaust.