8v vs 16v

[Golf Houso]

You are an idiot if you believe this.

The 20VT engines are more to buy and will need a $2500 minimum aftermarket computer to run.
If you got an ABF 16v and loom and ecu, its plug and play into a Mk3 and would cost less than half.
You wouldnt go as fast as a 20V, but you would spend a lot less.

Perhaps if you spent less time on the net and more time having experience with cars, you might know what you are talking about.

Note the ALOT more, as you probably know is a very subjective word and I never meant it in terms of 100's of $'s, but rather in 1000's $'s. Considering you recently put a 1.8T in an Ibiza over a matter of days and had to road registered, even retrofitting the loom to fit the dash. I doubt it would have costed anywhere near much as if I were to do it, but it was done by you, and done in a rather short period of time and for next to nothing I'd imagine being a wrecker.

So yeah maybe I should spend less time on the net and more time having experience with cars, and then I might know what I am talking about

[Jarred]

how about volvo? you know peter jones' set up with his DIY cold air intake? apparently he used a volvo airbox, and theoretically, couldn't i run a turbo without a computer?

or am i just talking out of my ass? thanks for input though guys

NO! you can't just turbo K-jet.

pete's done the volvo airflap mod, like many others do. It's a larger airflap/airbox that flows more (basically) thats what the mod is. and you can't just whack a turbo on it.

Yes you can run a turbo without a computer as such, but that would be using a carb. If you're serious about turbo'ing, save your pennies and go standalone engine mangament and ditch the K-jet. Not worth the hassle imo

Sorry for OT.

[Golf Loon]

Note the ALOT more, as you probably know is a very subjective word and I never meant it in terms of 100's of $'s, but rather in 1000's $'s. Considering you recently put a 1.8T in an Ibiza over a matter of days and had to road registered, even retrofitting the loom to fit the dash. I doubt it would have costed anywhere near much as if I were to do it, but it was done by you, and done in a rather short period of time and for next to nothing I'd imagine being a wrecker.

So yeah maybe I should spend less time on the net and more time having experience with cars, and then I might know what I am talking about

LOL less talking more listening for you Houso. It took a lot longer than that to build the 20VT Ibiza. That was with a complete donor car which was already running aftermarket fuel computer, so really just had to be plug and play.

That took me, an experienced industry professional a fair while. To those of you talking hot air and theorising about doing such a job at home. Good Luck.

It still costs lots of money wheteher I do it or you do it at home.
I can do it faster as I have a workshop and facilities and knowledge, but you will have lots of dramas to overcome and that will cost you time and money.

Jay Jay. There were Turbo Technics conversions back in the day which used the kjet setup. And yes you can push more fuel into a NA setup using Volvoparts. Early Saabs also used Kjet, but I never had much luck getting those parts to work on VW. Volvos yes.

Audi 200T used kjet, Turbo and 5cylinder. Look it up. In the US they cut the 5th cylinder part off the manifold and use only 4 of the lines and bolt it onto your 4cylinder motor.

Easiest upgrade for your car Jay Jay would be a 16v, as yours is one of the few Mk2 running Kjet. Plug and Play for you mate

[Golf Loon]

NO! you can't just turbo K-jet.

Yes you can.
Google Kjet and Turbo Technics.
Here is a thread with pics

http://vagdrivers.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=17879&pid=164473&st=20&#entry164473

[Golf Houso]

LOL less talking more listening for you Houso. It took a lot longer than that to build the 20VT Ibiza. That was with a complete donor car which was already running aftermarket fuel computer, so really just had to be plug and play.

That took me, an experienced industry professional a fair while. To those of you talking hot air and theorising about doing such a job at home. Good Luck.

It still costs lots of money wheteher I do it or you do it at home.
I can do it faster as I have a workshop and facilities and knowledge, but you will have lots of dramas to overcome and that will cost you time and money.

Jay Jay. There were Turbo Technics conversions back in the day which used the kjet setup. And yes you can push more fuel into a NA setup using Volvoparts. Early Saabs also used Kjet, but I never had much luck getting those parts to work on VW. Volvos yes.

Audi 200T used kjet, Turbo and 5cylinder. Look it up. In the US they cut the 5th cylinder part off the manifold and use only 4 of the lines and bolt it onto your 4cylinder motor.

Easiest upgrade for your car Jay Jay would be a 16v, as yours is one of the few Mk2 running Kjet. Plug and Play for you mate

so what was the time and cost then?

[evorobin]

Considering you recently put a 1.8T in an Ibiza over a matter of days and had to road registered, even retrofitting the loom to fit the dash

Can I see a quote from matt because he is clearly mustard these days!

Go away, do it and come back and humble us with your wisdom...

[aliasmk2]

how about volvo? you know peter jones' set up with his DIY cold air intake? apparently he used a volvo airbox, and theoretically, couldn't i run a turbo without a computer?

or am i just talking out of my ass? thanks for input though guys

Even if you could get it all setup, kbasic is really limited to about 200hp
People did not stop using for no reason

[Jarred]

Yes you can.
Google Kjet and Turbo Technics.
Here is a thread with pics
http://vagdrivers.net/forums/index.p...0&#entry164473

re read. The emphasis was on the "just". as in my previous post, I said it's possible, but you need turbo stuff from volvo turbos, porsche 200T etc etc

So not something you can 'just' do

but for jayjay, expense and difficulty wouldn't be worth it imo

I'll read that thread later on.

[Golf Loon]

Cost $6k for the donor car

Took 3 months, not constantly, but a bit everyday.

Also factor in new bushes, engine mounts, timing belt and lots of other stuff you will will wanna change whilst the motor is out.

Also modifications to fit the intercooler, piping, wiring and more.

No change from $10k.

My brief was to get the car running.

Dave has probably spent anothe $5k or more getting the thing to go faster and faster with ecu and turbo upgrades.

Factor in the original purchase of the cupra and you could just go and buy a POLO GTI.

He does have a unique car, but thats the cost.

A conversion is not an exact science. It is hard to quantify and price up.
They usually cost more than buying a stock later model car and end up being worth less.

I`m not trying to shoot you young blokes down, but go and build something, then share your wisdom.

[Jarred]

Even if you could get it all setup, kbasic is really limited to about 200hp
People did not stop using for no reason

I'm pretty sure some people have gotten more out of it before! 300HP I've heard of. And mercedes was using it up until the 90's! it's really not that bad.

[Golf Houso]

Cost $6k for the donor car

Took 3 months, not constantly, but a bit everyday.

Also factor in new bushes, engine mounts, timing belt and lots of other stuff you will will wanna change whilst the motor is out.

Also modifications to fit the intercooler, piping, wiring and more.

No change from $10k.

My brief was to get the car running.

Dave has probably spent anothe $5k or more getting the thing to go faster and faster with ecu and turbo upgrades.

Factor in the original purchase of the cupra and you could just go and buy a POLO GTI.

He does have a unique car, but thats the cost.

A conversion is not an exact science. It is hard to quantify and price up.
They usually cost more than buying a stock later model car and end up being worth less.

I`m not trying to shoot you young blokes down, but go and build something, then share your wisdom.

Thats all that I wanted to know... thanks

[Brisben]

Factor in the original purchase of the cupra and you could just go and buy a POLO GTI.

He does have a unique car, but thats the cost.

A conversion is not an exact science. It is hard to quantify and price up.
They usually cost more than buying a stock later model car and end up being worth less.

I`m not trying to shoot you young blokes down, but go and build something, then share your wisdom.

Wise words I reckon, I don't know anyone who has heavily modded a car without losing lots of money in the the process. I mean a loss because no one keeps a car forever, at the point of sale , watch you money float away.

I have found best buy something modded already, then you get the bargain, the only downside is some of these heavily modded cars have been done poorly and you don't know really what your buying.

But on a cost only basis a worthless exercise.

[ScienceVR6]

12v FTW!

But it seems to me an injected 16v has far better tuning ability than a VR6. Like someone here said some where else, You need some sort of weird vodoo magic to get power from a VR6.

I'd love a 16v GTI MK3 3 door.
I recon it would make a bloody fun car, agile, just as quick as a VR, and possibully quicker, once tuned of its face.

Just a hypothetical.

If i wantted an extra 50hp, would it be cheaper to get it out of a VR or a 16v? (injected) (provided the 16v was already here, and in a car)

[peedman]

Might as well share my 16v build experience. Even tho i used to do everything on my car myself before, its a lot harder first time taking car apart since there are problems that u run into doing it by urself. Factor in the lack of tools, garage space, lack of hands and money and the build time increases alot. Now ive spent alot of money on my car and its taken longer than a mechanically experienced person would take but its the fact of giving it a go and doing things myself that are most rewarding. That being said, a 20V would have been nice but there would have been no way i could have done that myself.

[bsting]

Ive owned both, the 8v and the 16v GTI. As a GTI its not as good as the mk1 or mk2 GTI's (my pick is the 16v in the mk2 range) but it is a great daily with easy to find cheap bits to keep it running! and better on the long trips for the comfort side...
16v is much better for thrashing all though the revs!

60kgs lighter in the front over the VR6.

Worth trying to import one ex-japan i reckon but you will only find 5door ones there...Saw a few 3door ones in untouched tidy nick in the UK last month...

Has anyone put the ABF in a 3door mk3 yet? Hurry up!