Cleaning the EGR and Inlet on a GT

[poyta]

I decided that I should take apart my EGR Valve and Inlet Manifold to clean up the 3 years and 45,000kms worth of oil that's deposited in there. Thought I might share some before and after photos with you guys so you can see how nasty it can get in there. Please note I'm not running a Provent or any kind of oil/air separator but after seeing this perhaps its best I invest in one.

Before photos showing the EGR valve -





After photos -






The before photos of the inlet manifold -





After cleaning the inlet manifold -





Anyone wishing to do something similar - put aside a whole weekend because that stuff is hard to clean and get off and be prepared to get very dirty. I recommend you buy about 5 cans of that cheap $2 de-greaser from Cheap as Chips - I initially bought 2 cans of heavy duty carby cleaner but that didn't work nearly as good as the $2 stuff. Also take note of which bolt goes where on the inlet manifold because they are all unequal lengths and you probably wont remember how they go back together.

Only just got to drive the car today after the clean so I can't give you a realistic assessment of any improvements but today it registered about an 0.5l/100km improvement in fuel economy on my usual run to work - whether that's because i just had a good run to work or the cleaning has improved things remains to be seen.

Anyone want some advice on how its done don't hesitate to ask.

[jazd]

You want to do mine?

Perhaps I'll give that a go before I buy a Provent kit. How difficult was it? Just a matter of undoing a few bolts and pulling it off? Much chance of ****ing it up?

[poyta]

You want to do mine?

How difficult was it? Just a matter of undoing a few bolts and pulling it off? Much chance of ****ing it up?

Not really. Like I said you just need to ensure you remember which bolt goes where. You'll need Torx drivers to undo the bolts - make sure you don't drop any as they will be hard to retrieve and generally be careful with the rubber gaskets so you can re-use them.
Once the manifold is off make sure you don't spray anything into the inlet of the head or let anything fall in there.
Then I guess the only other thing you could do is over-tighten and strip the threads but basically its quite an easy job, just very time consuming and very dirty. Wear gloves!!!!

[HiTorque]

Wow, it's a dirty one! Hi Poyta. Did you start from the big hose coming up to the flap motor section? Did you have any problems fitting the hose back at the end? The fitting was so difficult last time that it's the only thing that stopped me from repeating this cleaning surgery. I am getting mentally ready for it and bought "Cheap" degreaser already. I had it done two years ago, but it was too late as the sludge got into electronics compartment of the flap motor section. I am no longer using Caltex, switched to BP only + all Morey and Moly additives, but I guess it might still need the cleaning.

[Ozsko]

No way to spend a weekend, bugger that. Pull the whole lot off and get it cleaned in the tank at an engine reconditioner, it should only cost beer money. I don't know about plastic components, best ask them.

[whitelion]

Holy Toledo Batman, that's some serious carbon sequestration going on there !
Steve

[poyta]

Did you start from the big hose coming up to the flap motor section? Did you have any problems fitting the hose back at the end? The fitting was so difficult last time that it's the only thing that stopped me from repeating this cleaning surgery.

Yes thats where I started and where I ended. Yeah it was a bit of push to get it back in but nothing too bad, I just pushed hard and the little metal clip on the hose just went "click" and it was on. You need to ensure that the rubber O-ring gasket is on the end of the metal section of the rubber hose. I found this gasket on the floor and was baffled where it came from initially - if you put it into the Valve unit first then the hose wont fit back on so make sure its on the hose section. Also make sure you pull the clip out on the Valve unit quite a bit before trying to put the hose back in. If its only partially pulled out the hose wont go on.

[Greg Roles]

Nice work mate. The good news for anyone wanting to have a go, all the manifold gaskets are o-rings, and very reusable, but I priced the manifold gasket just in case at VW last time, and it was an immense $6.

All the right fuel and additives in the world will make no difference to the inlet buildup. The VW engines petrol and diesel are direct injection, so all that good stuff only sees the combustion chamber, all this gunk comes from crankcase blowby pre turbo ( which coats the entire post turbo intake, intercooler, and EGR/flap mechanisms ), and EGR exhaust inlet at the valve mechanism ( making that black sludge ). The only way to drop it is a Provent/Can, manual cleaning, and an EGR delete or minimisation, but there's things to consider in doing that, especially in the oilers. You're mad not to run some sort of can in a direct injection engine you intend to keep beyond 100k.

Manifold is nylon, so should survive most chemicals, carb cleaner doesn't worry it in the slightest.

You are right the boost hose clips are a biarch, need to eat your wheeties to get them back together sometimes.

Can't wait till I can remove the EGR, then I will have a rather spotless inlet apart from a little turbo bearing oil weep.

[Transporter]

In the case of 103kW BKD engine; the gasket between manifold and cylinder head is metal gasket and manifold is AL alloy.

[Greg Roles]

Good point, I can only speak for the 125kw!

[Transporter]

Good point, I can only speak for the 125kw!

The thread is named GT, so you're right. I only noted just in case that someone with just MK5 TDI would want to follow the instructions.
and just a hint, if you reuse the rubber gaskets (Orings), you can use Loctite 515 or 518 on them to increase reliability, but it is always better to re-new the gaskets, especially when they aren't expensive.

[poyta]

The only way to drop it is a Provent/Can, manual cleaning, and an EGR delete or minimisation, but there's things to consider in doing that, especially in the oilers. You're mad not to run some sort of can in a direct injection engine you intend to keep beyond 100k.

Do you really think that a Provent or some kind of catch can will really stop this? I ask because you posted much earlier this -

http://www.vwwatercooled.org.au/f28/let-tinkering-continue-28464-16.html

Your EGR valve looks just about a filthy as mine and at this stage your car had a lot less mileage than mine and you had a Provent installed.

Could that gunk perhaps be coming from that exhaust pipe thats running into the EGR valve? ( In which case a Provent wouldn't help )
I noticed that the actual flap in the valve thats facing the intercooler hose was the cleanest side of the EGR valve whereas if all the gunk was coming from crank case blowby flowing through the intercooler hose it would be the dirtiest?

[Greg Roles]

You have a good point, but the main difference is my buildup was dry soot, whereas yours is more the typical wet sludge. I can't see a catch can stopping the EGR soot buildup, which does seem to happen in my case, but it does remove the oil film all through your intercooler and pre flap plumbing, and as it removes extra oil from the combustion chamber, it has to be a good thing for oil ash blocked DPF's. The perfect solution is dropping or deleting the EGR and using a catch can, but yeah, if you are prepared to pull it apart every 50k or so, you can survive just fine without a can ( in a non DPF car ). I figure a $175 Provent is a lot cheaper than a $4200 DPF, and I had always planned to keep the car well into DPF blockage territory at an approx 150k, so anything to extend that event is fine by me!

Then you get into the carbon deposit theory on the valves....... the price of a catch can seems minor in comparison.

[poyta]

The perfect solution is dropping or deleting the EGR and using a catch can.

So has anyone got a decent and effective EGR delete kit out yet for the GT? From what I've read its not so simple.

[Transporter]

Using good fuel additive could help. Since you have the DPF try Wynns Diesel Power 3, Diesel Clean 3. Wynn's Belgium bvba

The Diesel Power 3 looks very promising on the paper, I will pick up the box next week and give it a go.