Double Hex, XZN Fasteners, Bolts & Nuts Discussion

[Sunny43.5]

We had a broken roller on our T5 the bloody door nearly fell off !!!! just caught it in time , the roller had just disintegrated . The real mongrel is actually getting the old one off as VW have used avery specific sized fine Torx driver its much finer than normal Torx and believe me without it you,ve got no chance of loosening the bolts . I eneded up getting my son to support the door and I used an air chisel to loosen the bolts they came out really easy then , I replaced the two bolts with High tensile allen keyed ones as I did not want a repeat performance if they need to be done again . The only indicator we got that the rollers were failing was a tight feel when opening the door it had only done 85,000 kays at the time . Howard PS you could spray some silicone spray on the rubbers to see if it quietens the noise .

[IN2VWS]

Many people make the mistake of trying to fit torx keys in some VW and Audi bolts. They are in actual fact triple square keys, or XZN keys.

Triple square, also known as XZN, is a type of screw drive with 12 equally spaced tips, each with a 90 degree angle. Its name derives from overlaying 3 equal squares to form such a pattern with 12 right-angled tips. Common sizes are 6, 8, 10, and 12 mm. Triple square drives are used in high torque applications, such as cylinder head bolts and drive train components. Triple square fasteners are commonly found on German vehicles such as Audi, BMW, Mercedes, and Volkswagen.

[Sunny43.5]

And yes they are a pain in the a$^s this is just a sliding door roller !!! , I get really peed off with manufactureres worldwide who inflict this stupidity on us mere mortals . Why in the hell can,t they use a common style bolts etc for various applications , I am convinced more and more every day that they are trying to force us to stop fixing our own vehicles by inventing new styles to thwart us from undoing things . Have you ever tried to refit the exhaust clamps on the old T4 diesel engine absolute stupidity . One engine has a flexi joint which bolts together while the other has these crazy spring clamp things . Howard

[IN2VWS]

Why is it the manufacturers fault because you don't don't have the correct tools to do a job. These tools are not difficult to buy.
If you are going to do your own DIY on modern VW's and Audi's, then you need to buy these tools.
'Common style bolts" will not always suffice for all applications.
These XZN fasteners usually have very shallow heads on them. Some applications require high torque fasteners, which, if had common heads like allen keys, you would soon have a round hole where an allen key would no longer work.

[Sunny43.5]

I get were your coming from but my original statement still stands , I work every day with cars I install sunroofs and I am still bamboozeled by the fact that a simple thing like internal fittings in a roof lining like sunvisors- grab handles and interior lights require in some cases up to 4 different tools to take out fasteners in the same area . I have to switch from Torx drivers- phillips -then a variety of hex head bolts of different sizes . Thats hardly what I would call smart , now the sliding door roller is not what I would define as needing these XZN fasteners . I will correct what I said earlier I replaced the XZN not with allen key but with actual good old fashioned high tensile bolts with washers , I garauntee they will not come loose and I will easily be able to remove them with every day tools that most people would have in their tool kits. I don,t want to start an argument over what manufactureres use but when your door is about to fall off and you are trying hard to fix a problem I could not find any auto stores in my area near Brisbanes southside that even new what the hell these things were when I asked . Its a bit like the old days Imperial bolts metric bolts and whitworth bolts , and yes I do know about torque settings and high tensile bolts etc I have rebuilt my fair share of engines car and motor bike . But again its just a bloody roller for a door it does not support the whole weight of the door , just another fine example of over engineering with no thought for the end user .Howard PS I wont add any more to this particular thread I think I have made my case quite clear on the subject . I hope Darknight fixes his problem .