Multivan TDI versus V6 petrol

[rymi]

Hi folks,

Looking at the possibility of a T5 Multivan Highline with 4 motion, new or used, either TDI or V6.

The 128kw TDI seems by far the most popular choice, with its impressive torque figure of 400Nm. However, I have read comments in reviews that it is "rather truck-like in its application, with plenty of diesel clatter at idle and under revs" etc. Several reviewers have been disappointed with its noise levels.

By contrast I've read that the V6 is a much more refined unit, has a much more impressive power figure of 176Kw but produces a lot less torque at 315Nm, does 0-100km/h 2 seconds quicker, albeit using more fuel, but is more in keeping with the luxury feel of the vehicle.

With the relief in fuel prices of late, combined with the fact diesel costs more than unleaded, I'm steering towards the petrol. I will only be doing occasional light towing.

Has anyone test driven both who can provide a comparison?
Is the TDI noisy, ie. as the driver, is it possible to carry out relaxed conversation with 2nd and 3rd row occupants? Do you find yourself turning up the stereo to drown out the engine?

How does the V6 go up hills, towing, or with a load on board?

Which is a more entertaining drive with the manual transmission?

I realise I will need to test drive them both myself to make a decision, but any comments appreciated from anyone who might have already done so.

Ryan

[jets]

With the relief in fuel prices of late, combined with the fact diesel costs more than unleaded, I'm steering towards the petrol. Ryan

This will only be temporary, the OPEC leaders are meeting now to reduce output to force prices back up. The fall of our dollar relative to the US dollar will also ensure fuel prices will remain high.
There is a reason why the TDI is more popular, it's all round a better unit.
The petrol may be slightly quieter & refined but once you experience that torque at low revs, particularly with the manual trans you won't consider the petrol unit.
I don't own a T5 but have driven an auto T5 from Alice Springs to Adelaide & there is no way I would agree with motoring writers who complain about engine noise. Once under way it's a very quiet unit & certainly not truck like as has been suggested.
I know I am biased towards the diesel[my 4 cars are all diesel] I borrowed a Polo petrol auto while my Mk5 Golf was being serviced & was I glad to be back in my Golf at the end of the day. The surge of power from the diesel really is, for me, the superior driving experience.
When it comes time to trade/sell a T5 my money is on the diesel every time.

[Ivo]

Depends what you consider noisy really. I have a TDI Multivan. Yes at start up and at idle there is a diesel rattle, is it annoying.....NO! I sat in the middle row of my van yesterday with my kids while my wife drove. I was amazed how quiet it was in there, no engine noise at all.

I love the power of the TDI, I had come through a roundabout and was heading up a slight hill, road was wet and I had my foot down, I broke traction at around 60km/h and then traction control kicked in. Sure the road could have been slippery but this motor really has some pulling power.

As for petrol price, they will go back up but it will be a slower rise then what we just experienced I think......why? Because there is no money around to invest and try to make a quick buck. Does anyone really think the motorist in China or India have stopped driving???? Of course they have not, the price went up not as a result of huge demand but as a result of the speculators who new the excreta was about to hit the world financial markets and they wanted to make a quick buck. Now the scumbag opec mob are cutting production to force the price up. Sorry for the off topic rant

[Pumpe-Düse]

I'd have to buy the V6 if I was choosing. I mean... its a van... that can beat some "sports," cars in a drag race. And you can make it sound sexy like an R32, since its the same engine. Who wouldn't take that option? lol...

[Transporter]

My T5 use 9.3L-10L/100km city driving and short trips loaded up.
I wouldn't get that fuel economy in V6 and for that reason I wouldn't buy one.
Pulling power up the hill at any gear is great and exhaust has nice tune - love that sound. And 4Motion on wet road drives nicer that on dry road.
Shortly - you can drive fast in Tdi and still get good fuel economy unlike V6 petrol.
And 0-100km in 10s is not for racing anyway. Many 10 years old cars can do better than that.

[gregozedobe]

You need to drive both engines, in the conditions and roads you mostly drive on. My van (not a multivan) has much more road noise then engine noise (and I quite enjoy the 5 cyl TDI "warble" under load, it isn't intrusive or annoying).

If you do lots of round town driving the auto gearbox may be a better setup with the TDI than the manual.

[rymi]

Are there any petrol Multivan owners out there willing to defend the V6?

I once test drove a 100 Series Landcruiser Diesel and Petrol back to back and there was no comparison. For overtaking, or for quick acceleration to pull into traffic or to catch an amber traffic light, the petrol was by far the winner. The turbo diesel suffered badly from turbo lag at low revs and was slow off the mark, and breathless for overtaking due to its narrow rev range. It was also relatively noisy and produced considerable vibration.
The petrol V8, by comparison, was silky smooth, quiet, allowing passengers to really enjoy the stereo, quick off the mark, and far better at overtaking, due to its willing top end.

Load them up with a 2.5 tonne boat, and things might be different. But I don't own a boat. I didn't end up buying either vehicle, but if I had, there was no way i would have considered the rattly and gutless turbo diesel. I believe the 200 series diesel is much better now, virtually matching the petrol's performance.

Just wondering if the same applies to the Multivan. How will the TDI and V6 compare at passing a road train, when there is a car coming the other way?

Anyone actually test driven the V6?

[rymi]

Hmmm, gregozedobe,

I will be doing a mix of both country and city driving, but I really want a manual. This is one of the things that attracts me to the Multivan , the fact that it is one of the few luxury cars available with a manual transmission, and besides, the 4 motion option (which I would want) is only available in manual anyway.

That's another reason for considering the V6 - since it has virtually twice the usable rev range this could mean less gear changes and more relaxed driving around town, ie. not having to keep it on the boil in the 2500-3500 range to extract performance, as I have heard is necessary in the diesel.

I have a friend who has a Nissan Navara diesel, which also produces 400Nm and a very similar 125kw. It too has a 6 speed manual. I have test driven it, and found that while it produces strong pulling power if you work the stick, if you are caught in the wrong gear and require a quick burst of acceleration, it is completely gutless. ie, cruise around a corner in 3rd, plant your foot, and there is absolutely nothing available until the tacho reaches about 2500 RPM, after which it does give a positive shove. I also found it somewhat awkward to drive quickly off the mark as first gear is so short and runs out of revs so quickly, and the change to second really slows you down.

How does the Multivan TDI go in a similar situation, ie pulling out of a corner in third? How high is maximum revs, and is it willing to rev?

Anyone done TDI performance upgrades? How do they affect to 0-100 time, and do they improve the top end of the rev range?

[Ivo]

I am selling my 100 series cruiser 6cyl 4.5l as I have replaced it with my Multivan. The TDI blows the doors off it at any speed. Seriously, its a lot faster. I have also driven a 100 series auto turbo diesel...it was like a train, slow to get going but plenty of towing power. The TDI would eat it 0-150kmh time, probably twice as fast.

I bet the TDI would tow a van just as well. But the cruiser would be better if your launching a big boat on a slipper ramp compared to an auto TDI, 4 motion should probably be ok.

Just some more thoughts for you.

[Sharkie]

Ryan, best bet would be to drive both back to back and then make your decision.

Personally I'd go for the V6 if fuel comsumption is not an issue. It is smoother and quicker (both can be chipped if you want) and the V6 is more in tune with the luxury car feel.

The TDI will have better resale after 3 years, so if you buy 2nd hand a 1-2 yr old V6 would be cheaper to buy.

I respect the TDI but love the V6. Sometimes it is an emotional decision....

[gregozedobe]

Just wondering if the same applies to the Multivan. How will the TDI and V6 compare at passing a road train, when there is a car coming the other way?

I've done a lot of overtaking of road trains with my TDI (FWD, manual, usually approx 500Kg load). I'm impressed, it really gets up and boogies when you ask it to. If I want to get past quickly I change back to 4th and typically I'm doing 140+Kmh and backing off when I go past the cabin of the truck). If you leave it in 6th it still gets past easily, but not with quite the same "zing". Out on the highway you would have to class it on the "fast" side of overtakers rather than the slow side - it is very confidence inspiring.

I can't comment on the V6, as I haven't driven one.

How does the Multivan TDI go in a similar situation, ie pulling out of a corner in third? How high is maximum revs, and is it willing to rev?

The 124Kw TDI obviously pulls much better than the Navara at low revs. In 3rd gear mine starts to pull with some power at 1200rpm, by 1400 it is getting perky and by 1800 it is seriously accelerating. It starts to run out of power at 4000rpm, so I usually change by 4200. I remember my first test drive of a 124Kw TDI, I laughed out aloud at how well it accelarated in 3rd

The manual is not great off the mark, as 1st and 2nd are quite low geared (and easy to spin the wheels in the FWD version). So it goes harder than you would expect from its official 0-100 times once it is in 3rd (and higher gears.

The AWD version won't spin the wheels so much, but you are always carrying that extra weight and drag, so this will reduce the performance slightly and increase the fuel consumption (but if you are considering a petrol V6 then fuel consumption doesn't appear to be a big concern for you).

Another thing to remember is that the V6 will probably need (expensive) 98 octane petrol, while the TDI will need (expensive) diesel (and because it has a skinny filler pipe you can't easily fill up at the truck fuel pumps).

Hope that helps, but you need to drive both versions, as the engine characteristics are very different.

[Seano]

Personally, given the grief that has been associated with the T4s with the VR6 and an auto box........I wouldn't touch a T5 with that combination. Besides they are as rare in their home market as hens teeth let alone here....

...and for Hueys sake.....it's an auto box!!!

[rymi]

Thanks guys,

I will report back when I have test driven both (may not be for a while as I live in the country).

Ryan

[shogun2]

Go the TDI!
I've had mine for three years now, and couldn't be happier.
The Adelaide to Alice drive that Jets was mentioning is soooo easy in the TDI. It's better than driving a car because of the room and the diesel engine is a treat on the open road. I was getting somewhere near 8.5 l/100Kms cruising. The road trains were not a problem. As Greg was mentioning, when you're past them you are doing over 140K - seriously fast in a van, and stable as hell.
No problems about cabin noise either. Easy to have conversations with others when you are carrying the tribe. Even goes great on corrugated dirt roads - as long as you find the speed sweet spot. I've even had ours on the beach at Aldinga - had some strange stares when the whale is boogying through the soft sand.
I drove the petrol version when I wanted a demo, as they didn't have a diesel at that stage. But it was an auto, and I didn't like the way the auto seemed to hunt for a gear. So manual is the only option we would recommend.

[phaeton]

Having ridden in shogun2 (Rod's) MV I can agree with the TDIs quietness at freeway speeds.