Crafter 2.5 Particulate filter

[goober]

howdy, I run a fleet of VW 2007 Crafters 2.5 in Adelaide and we are now experiencing particulate filter problems, the dealer has told me they are not a warranty item and to pay $4700 is ridiculous. I had my own mechanics take one off and we heated up the blocked front portion with a oxy torch without melting anything and from the rear end they blew compressed air.....the filter unblocked and then we made a funnel to run compressed air until the unit blew out all the particles of soot.
The vehicles are used for city work and are rentas.......
has anyone else here had problems with the DPF, and I am wondering when the golf diesels etc start to have problems I can see that people will remove the DPF and take the guts out of the unit.

[phaeton]

Has your company used the correct oil in the Crafter?

[Transporter]

How many km's have you done? Also as phaeton pointed out, using right oil is vital!

[h100vw]

Removing the filter alone isn't the way to go. There's already lots of DPF deleting going on in the UK. Put it into google and see what you get.

Gavin

[goober]

Has your company used the correct oil in the Crafter?

yes, we have been using the recommended oil by VW, apparently its the short trips that does the clogging up, if it were owner/ operator I could understand but being renters its hard to tell someone that when a light appears.....drive at this speed for this amount of time etc.........thus rather than pay $4700 for a newbie the cleaning of the unit is what we reckon works.

But talking to the service dept at VW adelaide, they have told me that they are seeing many DPF vehicles come in on limp mode and having to tell an owner they need to pay 000's to rectify the problem is causing grief at the counter

[phaeton]

Yeah short trips with diesels with DPF is not good.

Thats why if I do buy my next VW it will be a petrol.

[Cousin]

Subaru is having exactly the same problem with their new diesels. Too many suburban plodders.
Cars are coming in at 7,000 ks with the engine light on. DPF is nackered because they're just putting around the shops and kids to school.
It's going to cause a massive swing away from diesel if a fix isn't thought out.


M

[bushnut]

there was a few problems with early DPFs but newer DPFs were installed in later models i think we are on a third generation DPF now there is also a software update to improve regeneration times not having to drive on highways for 20 Min's to clear out the DPFs/ regeneration and there is also a software update for stop start driving such as courier drivers stopping and starting but is rarely done as Volkswagen group Australia has reservation's of this one as it is a final solution and can cause blockages. if its a early DPF i would expect VGA to replace it as a good will warranty claim. if you've driven it round with the DPF light on the dash for some time over 500K's or so VGA will probably deny the claim as the manual says to take to a vw dealer as soon as possible excess driving will cause damage to the DPF the engine control unit will log the kilometers when the light came on the dash so the ks driven can be seen . also i think there a recall going on at the moment for this software update depending on Vin range. there is also problems with the DPF pressure sensor that reads how full the DPF is by means of reading the airflow through the DPF pipe at the front of the DPF and one at the rear works out the difference of air flow from front to rear these can be faulting not reading correctly and bring the light on early meaning a visit to the vw workshop. when in the workshop we do a forced regeneration with diagnostic tester. if you have a fleet of them kick up a bit of a fuss and say i own x amount of these vehicles am looking at replacing them with new and wont be buying Volkswagens in future and mention Mercedes as there the same van with different engine but allot more money. if you have no joy with the dealer contact VGA themselves. hope this helps you

[The_Hawk]

third generation DPF now there is also a software update to improve regeneration times not having to drive on highways for 20 Min's to clear out the DPFs/ regeneration

Seems I have been living under a rock, can someone link me to a thread or some info on what this whole DPF thing is and how your supposed to look after it (being that we are now driving a shiny new TDI with a DPF)??
Two or three days a week it will get a decent run but in reality the rest of the week it is stop / start traffic to the shops and back... Should we be doing something special?

[goober]

there was a few problems with early DPFs but newer DPFs were installed in later models i think we are on a third generation DPF now there is also a software update to improve regeneration times not having to drive on highways for 20 Min's to clear out the DPFs/ regeneration and there is also a software update for stop start driving such as courier drivers stopping and starting but is rarely done as Volkswagen group Australia has reservation's of this one as it is a final solution and can cause blockages. if its a early DPF i would expect VGA to replace it as a good will warranty claim. if you've driven it round with the DPF light on the dash for some time over 500K's or so VGA will probably deny the claim as the manual says to take to a vw dealer as soon as possible excess driving will cause damage to the DPF the engine control unit will log the kilometers when the light came on the dash so the ks driven can be seen . also i think there a recall going on at the moment for this software update depending on Vin range. there is also problems with the DPF pressure sensor that reads how full the DPF is by means of reading the airflow through the DPF pipe at the front of the DPF and one at the rear works out the difference of air flow from front to rear these can be faulting not reading correctly and bring the light on early meaning a visit to the vw workshop. when in the workshop we do a forced regeneration with diagnostic tester. if you have a fleet of them kick up a bit of a fuss and say i own x amount of these vehicles am looking at replacing them with new and wont be buying Volkswagens in future and mention Mercedes as there the same van with different engine but allot more money. if you have no joy with the dealer contact VGA themselves. hope this helps you

Agreed, I still think that here in Aust it will be an issue that will cause grief. If someone purchases a Hyundai i20 diesel (of which i was going to buy 15 of them as renta cars) butI know Europcar in Aust has purchased them, but should the light come on and the need for regeneration occur our limited "freeway" systems means that one cannot get the exhaust hot enough to perform the task....thus limp mode occurs. And for a car costing say 20k AUD a DPF would make up 30% of the purchase price.....this alone is madness. I also know that diesel in Aust is of a different grade than the EU and whether this changes the problem I dont know.

In the end fleet owners will have to decide or pressure the manufacturers with Euro 5 emission systems but clearly this entire thing has the hallmarks of a bureaucrat without thinking the average owner's needs. And what happens when these DPF's start to hit the second hand market for the second hand buyer will invariably not look at regeneration processes.

personally I reckon its a mistake, VW have not assisted because the regen process was not completed as per their instruction.....like derr, how would a 1 day renter worry about it, just keep driving and let someone else worry about it.

[phaeton]

Seems I have been living under a rock, can someone link me to a thread or some info on what this whole DPF thing is and how your supposed to look after it (being that we are now driving a shiny new TDI with a DPF)??
Two or three days a week it will get a decent run but in reality the rest of the week it is stop / start traffic to the shops and back... Should we be doing something special?

Hi Aaron

One major tip is to use the correct oil specs which can be found in the manual I think there are only 2 or 3 oil suppliers that actually comply with manufacturer specs the Genuine Oil, Penrite & elf I think Transporter has mentioned.

Using the wrong oil will block the DPF.

Second tip read the manual

[The_Hawk]

The van is likely to only be serviced by VW (or a VW specialist) so oil shouldn't be an issue.

Second tip read the manual

As for the manual, I had a quick flip through pretty much all of it and didn't notice anything, but to be fair I wasn't having a good read. I'm planning to pull it out and have a proper read through, although everytime I go to grab it I realise my wife is out with the car (and the manual)

[Greg Roles]

DPF blockage occurs both from soot, and from oil ash. I'd HIGHLY recommend anyone with a DPF gets a Provent or similar high quality oil blowby seperator, and plumbs it inline from the tappet cover and inlet , as there is a lot of oil vapour entering the stock VW inlet. Since hobbling my oil blowby via a Provent, then into the exhaust ( illegal ) I've not had a single regen happen that I'm aware of. It's probably doing them automatically every several hundred kms or whatever the minimum default is, but before I was getting an obvious, higher idle one every week or so. Has to be something in that. Also, you HAVE to drive the thing hard enough to get the EGT's up, and thus burn off the soot from the DPF. An EGT gauge is a valuable tool there, for now I drive at higher revs, and avoid off boost sub 1800rpm at all times. I never hit 6th on the freeway, and am often in third at 50-60kph. Lugging it along sub 1800rpm is producing a TON of soot. Not sure how good the DSG box is at doing this.

From what I understand of the actual makeup of the VW DPF, blowing it out in reverse will be a temporary fix at best, and if you do indeed need to start getting DPF's replaced, would highly recommend looking into DPF delete tunes which give both more power AND more economy, or upgrading to a decent aftermarket DPF from specific manufacturers such as Donaldson. This is going to be a huge issue for the current gen of diesels, and it's why I've been going on and on about Provents for some time now.

[Transporter]

The van is likely to only be serviced by VW (or a VW specialist) so oil shouldn't be an issue.



As for the manual, I had a quick flip through pretty much all of it and didn't notice anything, but to be fair I wasn't having a good read. I'm planning to pull it out and have a proper read through, although everytime I go to grab it I realise my wife is out with the car (and the manual)

As Greg said, install Provent.
I suggest, drive normally, don't turn the engine off if you make very short trips (if possible), use premium diesel with the higher CN and use diesel fuel additive. I use Morey Diesel Engine Smoke Killer everytime I buy fuel and at every oil change I put bottle of WURTH CR Diesel additive or LiquiMoly Diesel SpeedTec in the tank.

[Greg Roles]

Absolutely, good point Miro, I'd NEVER run standard diesel in my DPF equipped car. BP Ultimate or
Vortex ( when BP not available ) for me.