Red Devil mkII - The Journey Continues

[seangti]

Hi, I'm seeking input on wheel alignment settings. The car has tracked to the left marginally since I got it, I replaced the suspension and got a wheel alignment yet still tracks left. It's more a disconcerting feeling as it lacks consistent feel. I called the suspension mob back to seek clarification and they tell me it's due to the castor not being equal and non adjustable. I have Superpro lower control arm bushes.

The alignment settings:
Front
Castor in degree: 4.28 (L), 4.78 (R)
Camber in degree: -0.91 (L), -0.76 (R)
Toe: 0.1mm (L), 0.1mm (R)

Pre alignment toe was -3.5mm (L) and -3.7mm (R), all other angles had essentially no change.

What's people thoughts on this castor comment,
- is 0.4 deg enough to cause the car to veer left?
- Are control arm bushes left or right hand side oriented... could they have been installed wrong way way or something (I've never heard of this in the 6+yrs I've been learning about these cars).
- Can/Should I correct the veering by compensating with the toe angles?
- Take the car elsewhere?
They knew the car is predominantly track oriented and cautioned about toe angles being beyond straight ahead.

My silver car has very good steering feel but have been unable to find previous alignment details as comparison.

[h100vw]

I reckon those Superpro bushes are adjustable. However, it needs setting as you fit the bush. No idea how you'd manage to do that. I installed them by eye, with them in the neutral position. Adjusting them would be pretty hard graft to get it equal on both sides.

They aren't handed, you can rotate them to any position. I was just looking for the install instructions on line but couldn't.

I just got another set in the back of my S3, I'll have to open them up later to look.

Gavin

[nat225]

Does it have a front subframe (like mk5/6 platform)? Previously i was also having similar issue and the castor was different by much left and right, possibly due to incorrect whiteline alk and subframe alignment.

The caster was different by .5 degree and it was enough to veer the car to the left, until Heasman steering did something with the car alignment to compensate the caster diff.

Now with superpro lca and alk bits installed by Jmac (i was very impressed), the caster left and right are almost similar.

[vwthunder]

Are you going to get the Kmac Camber/Castor strut tops back in ?

Trying to find one of my alignments

[Stuwey]

I'd find another wheel aligner, who doesn't just go 'by the numbers'. Mine is currently set number-perfect on a newer machine. Turns nice, but drives a bit weird on the streets.

Another place that i've had do mine has spent about two hours doing it, on the old repco-style swivel plates. No computers. About 15 individual laps around the block. It points sharp and feels very positive on the street, too. Just need to get a day off work so i can go back

How is the rear alignment? I had 11mm of total rear toe - 5mm on one side and 6mm on the other. Now adjusted to 2 and 3 respectively, and is WAY happier to turn-in.

Time to find some old bloke who knows what's going on, not some kid at a tyre shop.

[nat225]

Heasmans also fixed mine using swivel plate / ruler equipments. No computer involved, just pure skills and expertise.

[seangti]

Thanks for the input guys. The subframe could make sense so will explore.

Nat, where is Heasmans? I can only find details for them in sydney.

Troy, the plan is to reinstall the Kmac's, perhaps will happen sooner as a strut top bearing on the silver car is clunking. I'm yet to contact Kmac for the suspension tops.

Stuwey - you're exactly right about them going purely by numbers. The guy road tested it, gave the keys back and said it steers to the left. I asked him to clarify before I left and he blamed potentially worn engine mounts and control arm bushes - which is BS as they are all near on brand new.

The rear has the whiteline shims which change the toe by 3mm. I'd have to look at the figures again, at face value it seemed ok.

[39erman]

I'm involved with a dedicated track car and we have heaps of problems getting a correct wheel alignment done by tyre shops and the like.

Now we only use dedicated motorsports people like VSports here in Sydney who do the whole alignment including alignment, ride height and corner weighting. Makes a HUGE difference to the way the car handles, brakes and wears its tyres.

Spend some time and seek them out in your city, but you wont get this type of setup for $100. You pay for what you get.....

[Jmac]

Cant agree more here . Spent Yrs during my app doing quattros etc and took hrs, not toe and go $100 would get you nothing. Its specialised man, cant stress it enough.

[grandturismo]

Go see Ken @ Accurate Suspension.

[39erman]

Yes, and I cannot stress enough that getting the correct ride height AND corner weighting WILL balance the car better = better lap times.

You will then be able to play with tyre pressures more accurately. R spec tyres DO NOT like to be over pressured and I have not seen any that run more than 36-38 psi HOT. As mentioned previously, just ask the tyre dealers out at the track, their more than willing to help even if your not a customer....

[seangti]

Yes, and I cannot stress enough that getting the correct ride height AND corner weighting WILL balance the car better = better lap times.

You will then be able to play with tyre pressures more accurately. R spec tyres DO NOT like to be over pressured and I have not seen any that run more than 36-38 psi HOT. As mentioned previously, just ask the tyre dealers out at the track, their more than willing to help even if your not a customer....

Thanks for your input. I'll go see Accurate Suspension today, Ken is renowned for his work, so good place to start for my humble ambitions.

I took the alignment sheet to another tyre place who've done a good job on my other car, they said the settings look all good and the aligner previously worked for them and they rate his knowledge highly. Could be a corner weighting issue, I know it's not sitting perfect atm.

[39erman]

Could be a corner weighting issue, I know it's not sitting perfect atm.

Corner weighting is not hard as long as you have adjustable spring platforms on all corners of the car. If not it can be quite time consuming. You can do some pre height adjustments at home by deciding on your preferred ride height and using a rule or tape measure from the same spot on each corner of the car. Try to do this on a relatively flat surface otherwise you'll just end up jacking up on corner more than another. With this done it will change all your previous wheel alignment settings so then it's off to the wheel aligner.

Also, if you have stabliser bars, make sure than when the car is at its preferred ride height that none of the uprights/links are tight or binding as this will corner jack the car and transfer load to the opposite side. You should be able to discount the upright/links freely when the car is fully wheel aligned/corner weighted.

Then go out and enjoy....

[seangti]

I've decided to book the car in with Accurate Suspension for next week. They're also going to fit the Kmac adjustable strut tops so will dial in some camber and castor, along with corner weighting. As I still want to drive the car on the street I'll probably go with -2 to -2.5 deg camber. They aren't hugely fond of the Kmac gear, but for the polo there is little option.

Bring on timeattack in October, champing to get out there and give it a hot go.

[vwthunder]

I am running full negative camber which is around -3 or more for street, im going to get another alignment done soon, will be interesting to compare notes

Do you know how much corner weighting is ?