0-100km/h time with APR Stage 1 tune?

[bakersdelight]

hi all,

My 08 GTI is chipped with APR Stage 1, with other minor supporting mods including APR D1 diverter valve, PD160 and K&N drop-in filter. Have recently changed oil (Mobile 0-40W) and spark plugs (Bosch FR7KPP33+)

I have timed my 0-100km time using a bluetooth OBDII dongle and android Torque app, I consistently get between 7.4-7.7s.

I get off the line with stability control off, slipping the clutch at around 2,500RPM, change to 2nd at about about 5,500 to 6,000RPM and rev out the 2nd gear to reach 100.

Other forum members with APR Stage 1 tune and similar mods have reported their 0-100km/h time at 6.5s, which is significantly quicker than my 7.4s...

Is there something wrong with my technique or car? I don't think I have boost leak, as the boost holds consistently at around 16 to 17 PSI under full throttle (although it does take a couple of second to get there after putting the foot down, which i assume is normal)....

any advice? Thanks!!

[noone]

I think there is a lot to be said for being able to get the power down. I've heard people talking about loosing traction in 2nd and 3rd, I don't think thats ever been an issue in my car when in the dry on decent roads in a straight line. Stiffer suspension, larger front swaybar, stickier tyres all help.

I also think people tend to want the times to be lower, so might take the odometer reading as enough (which is about 9% out on stock tyres).

APR is not the most aggressive tune, are you running the Version 1 or Version 2 of the tune? You can add a little timing using lemmiwinks, I notice a large difference. Also for some reason, the APR tune seems to dull over time, if you turn it off, drive it so you know its off and turn it on again, there is more torque for some reason.

So solid answer, but some ideas for you...

[Ryan_R]

Aren't stock GTI's supposed to be faster than that? Are you sure the time shown on your phone is correct? You could film a video of you speedo and then subtract the time you reach 107kph from the time you start when reviewing the footage on your PC. With APR Stage 1 I run max 21PSI boost and hit 100kph (or 108 indicated) in about 6.58 seconds (1.4L TSI twincharged)

[bakersdelight]

I think there is a lot to be said for being able to get the power down. I've heard people talking about loosing traction in 2nd and 3rd, I don't think thats ever been an issue in my car when in the dry on decent roads in a straight line. Stiffer suspension, larger front swaybar, stickier tyres all help.

I also think people tend to want the times to be lower, so might take the odometer reading as enough (which is about 9% out on stock tyres).

APR is not the most aggressive tune, are you running the Version 1 or Version 2 of the tune? You can add a little timing using lemmiwinks, I notice a large difference. Also for some reason, the APR tune seems to dull over time, if you turn it off, drive it so you know its off and turn it on again, there is more torque for some reason.

So solid answer, but some ideas for you...

thanks... I believe I got version 2 of the tune, since I only got it in August this year. When I did the run today, I "reset" the ECU to APR tune, so it was had "fresh" settings. How do I add timing using lemmiwinks without blowing my engine? Is there a tutorial for tuning the 1.8T?

but when I switch back to stock programme, I can only record around 9s for 0-100, the official claim is 8.2s, and I honestly don't think I am that crap of a driver when it comes to launching cars.

[bakersdelight]

Aren't stock GTI's supposed to be faster than that? Are you sure the time shown on your phone is correct? You could film a video of you speedo and then subtract the time you reach 107kph from the time you start when reviewing the footage on your PC. With APR Stage 1 I run max 21PSI boost and hit 100kph (or 108 indicated) in about 6.58 seconds (1.4L TSI twincharged)

The time shown on my phone is from ODB reading, so it should be pretty accurate... factory claimed stock time is 8.2s, so with the APR tune, I am faster than the factory claim, but seems slower than other people with the tune...

[Ryan_R]

Yes I've got the same app

I never thought the Mk5 GTI standard 0-100 time was that slow. That's worse than my car in standard form.

[bakersdelight]

Yes I've got the same app

I never thought the Mk5 GTI standard 0-100 time was that slow. That's worse than my car in standard form.

errr.... but we are in the 9N3 Polo GTI section of the forum, not Mk V GTI....

[bakersdelight]

I think there is a lot to be said for being able to get the power down. I've heard people talking about loosing traction in 2nd and 3rd, I don't think thats ever been an issue in my car when in the dry on decent roads in a straight line. Stiffer suspension, larger front swaybar, stickier tyres all help.

I also think people tend to want the times to be lower, so might take the odometer reading as enough (which is about 9% out on stock tyres).

APR is not the most aggressive tune, are you running the Version 1 or Version 2 of the tune? You can add a little timing using lemmiwinks, I notice a large difference. Also for some reason, the APR tune seems to dull over time, if you turn it off, drive it so you know its off and turn it on again, there is more torque for some reason.

So solid answer, but some ideas for you...

I had a look at V-tune, it looks pretty interesting, so you can up the boost by using V-tune as well? Awesome!!

Does it support OBDII bluetooth dongle as the connection point, or do I need to get a cable? Thanks!

[Ryan_R]

errr.... but we are in the 9N3 Polo GTI section of the forum, not Mk V GTI....

I arrive in these threads via the RSS feed and never notice what subforum I'm in, since you didn't say Polo I assumed it was the Golf.

[noone]

I had a look at V-tune, it looks pretty interesting, so you can up the boost by using V-tune as well? Awesome!!

V-Tune isnt compatible with our Tune / ECU.

Lemmiwinks or Custom Settings (the CC version) allows some control over a different bank of settings to what the tuners use. From what I know, Gavin does some tuning in these areas when tweaking a tune.

I use a ebay USB-Obd port adapter which works fine.

There are a number of threads on Vortex or if you know how to use Google to search VWW, you should be able to find my posts on it previously.

How you use it properly is to take logs of your 3rd gear pulls, watch the timing pull and add a little extra timing (position in the piston cycle when detonation occurs) to get more power. From memory you want to keep the timing pull under 4, across the board.

Please don't consider this a guide or recomendation, do it at your own risk and after reading up.

For me, I run about 3 degrees advancement in timing over the APR tune which to me offers more torque, probably at the expense of top end power.

Adding timing adds heat. The old school way was to add timing until you had detonation, then pull it back a little. With the sophisicaltion of our modern ECU's over the early ones for 1.8t's, the knock sensors are able to work around you, pulling out timing here and there if the sensors are not happy. As the APR tune is pretty mild / safe, I don't see the issue with it IF YOU TAKE YOUR TIME & LOG. No point going in blind, if you try to add too much the ECU will pull more timing than you added making the power less linear and more likely to go into a protection power cut.

As for how fast your car is, why its not faster, etc, its really hard to say without being in it. Maybe check with your tuner you def got the Version 2 of the tune, maybe take it to them, express your concerns and see if they can help log or they can take it around the block, see if there is anything obvious. There are so many small things that could be restricting a little power (something exhaust related, a sensor, N75, Diverter, Intake restriction, fuel delivery, boost leak (you mention 16/17 PSI which isn't high). Try doing a pull in 5th gear, see what the boost levels at, I would expect a little higher.

How many K's? Was it a hot day? The car feels torquier when its cold and dry.

Lots of little places you could be robbed of power, making sure your car is performing 100% takes money or effort, I try but it does tire sometimes.

[Ryan_R]

btw are you using 98 Octane petrol?

[bakersdelight]

V-Tune isnt compatible with our Tune / ECU.

Lemmiwinks or Custom Settings (the CC version) allows some control over a different bank of settings to what the tuners use. From what I know, Gavin does some tuning in these areas when tweaking a tune.

I use a ebay USB-Obd port adapter which works fine.

There are a number of threads on Vortex or if you know how to use Google to search VWW, you should be able to find my posts on it previously.

How you use it properly is to take logs of your 3rd gear pulls, watch the timing pull and add a little extra timing (position in the piston cycle when detonation occurs) to get more power. From memory you want to keep the timing pull under 4, across the board.

Please don't consider this a guide or recomendation, do it at your own risk and after reading up.

For me, I run about 3 degrees advancement in timing over the APR tune which to me offers more torque, probably at the expense of top end power.

Adding timing adds heat. The old school way was to add timing until you had detonation, then pull it back a little. With the sophisicaltion of our modern ECU's over the early ones for 1.8t's, the knock sensors are able to work around you, pulling out timing here and there if the sensors are not happy. As the APR tune is pretty mild / safe, I don't see the issue with it IF YOU TAKE YOUR TIME & LOG. No point going in blind, if you try to add too much the ECU will pull more timing than you added making the power less linear and more likely to go into a protection power cut.

As for how fast your car is, why its not faster, etc, its really hard to say without being in it. Maybe check with your tuner you def got the Version 2 of the tune, maybe take it to them, express your concerns and see if they can help log or they can take it around the block, see if there is anything obvious. There are so many small things that could be restricting a little power (something exhaust related, a sensor, N75, Diverter, Intake restriction, fuel delivery, boost leak (you mention 16/17 PSI which isn't high). Try doing a pull in 5th gear, see what the boost levels at, I would expect a little higher.

How many K's? Was it a hot day? The car feels torquier when its cold and dry.

Lots of little places you could be robbed of power, making sure your car is performing 100% takes money or effort, I try but it does tire sometimes.

Thank! Just ordered a VAGCOM cable off ebay, it should arrive in 2 week's time, will have some fun with it...

Does the ECU assign different boost levels for different gears? It seems I hit higher boost in 1st gear all the time? Sometimes it spikes at around 20-22Psi in first... will do a proper logging once VAGCOM cable received

I have previously raised in another thread that straight after I got my car fully tuned (from the 6 hour trial), it felt less powerful than the trial tune, but I thought it was just "placebo effect" , but now it looks like it wasn't placebo after all

I just did another run, it was 25 degrees outside, this time I recorded 7.3s. The car has 54,000Km. It was done 600m off sea level (Canberra), where air density is about 3% thinner than sea level, does it really affect the power that much?

[bakersdelight]

btw are you using 98 Octane petrol?

Yep, BP Ultimate 98, have also tried Shell 98, it ran like crap on shell, absolute no power and the turbo took its sweet time to spool up

[s4mmie]

I've always found BP Ultimate the best for power, Shell crap and Vortex 98 a good in betweener.
I find I get higher boost in 2nd and 3rd than 1st gear. I figure it's because the engine 'sees' less load in 1st. Similar to when you rev it at idle, no load, no boost.

[noone]

you should show more boost in a higher gear as there is more time for the boost pressure to grow, in 1st its over so quickly.

lots of variables, could be a boost leak, could be a dodgy component, could be an overly sensitive knock sensor retarding timing. For me, logging or having someone log is really the only good way to know whats happening, it wont answer all your qns, but certainly does arm you with a lot more info.