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  • ECS Clutch upgrade

    Hi All,

    I find it surprising that a clutch upgrade with a lightweight flywheel isn't really promoted/discussed/viewed etc as a "performance mod." (maybe it is but not discussed much)
    With 5-9kw at the wheels I view this as an attractive perfromance mod. More power quicker acceleration as well as a stronger, longer lasting clutch...I wouldn't even had known about it had I not posted re: my OEM clutch slowly packing it in....I have one ordered - I'll post finingss once installed. I was all for a FMIC but considering winters on the way, I'll go for the clutch for now and consider a FMIC end of spring

  • #2
    You must have been asleep mate we have been talking about ecs clutches here for quit some time
    Alba European
    Service, Diagnostics and repairs. Mobile Diag available on request
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    • #3
      Originally posted by Chipped View Post
      Hi All,

      I find it surprising that a clutch upgrade with a lightweight flywheel isn't really promoted/discussed/viewed etc as a "performance mod." (maybe it is but not discussed much)
      With 5-9kw at the wheels I view this as an attractive perfromance mod. More power quicker acceleration as well as a stronger, longer lasting clutch...I wouldn't even had known about it had I not posted re: my OEM clutch slowly packing it in....I have one ordered - I'll post finingss once installed. I was all for a FMIC but considering winters on the way, I'll go for the clutch for now and consider a FMIC end of spring
      I'm right wth you on this one mate! I too think its one of the best areas of modifications but I don't think most people fully appreciate what a lightend flywheel means. In terms of what you have or experienced with the clutch, after reading a lot of threads, it may actually be the gear box not the clutch that is playing up. Its just a thought but there seems to be a lot of polos with gear box issues such as crunchy gears and dodgy syncro meshs. It did also occur to me that if you do upgrade the clutch you may just introduce problems to the gear box as the stronger clutch puts added work on the gears. Again its just a thought. But then again there are the benefits of a lightened flywheel so it may all just cancell each other out and be ok on the gearbox. I suppose you don't know these things until you give them ago.

      In regards to a FMIC I too think I'll put that off as well. I find I don't really drive as much in the heat but when I do I don't really drive far enough or long enough for heatsoak to be a noticable hindrance. I'd much rather look at the exhaust at the moment and put the FMIC off to a latter date.
      APR V2 Tuned, APR Dogbone mount, APR R1 DV, K&N Panel Filter, SEAT Intake, Forge TIP & FSB, Bilstein & H&R, Whiteline RSB, Full Milltek 2.5" exhaust

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Chipped View Post
        Hi All,

        I find it surprising that a clutch upgrade with a lightweight flywheel isn't really promoted/discussed/viewed etc as a "performance mod." (maybe it is but not discussed much)
        With 5-9kw at the wheels I view this as an attractive perfromance mod. More power quicker acceleration as well as a stronger, longer lasting clutch...I wouldn't even had known about it had I not posted re: my OEM clutch slowly packing it in....I have one ordered - I'll post finingss once installed. I was all for a FMIC but considering winters on the way, I'll go for the clutch for now and consider a FMIC end of spring

        I dont understand where you got the idea that a flywheel increases power ?
        All a flywheel does is allow the engine to spin up faster and not maintain as much momentum from the engine . There is no change to the efficiency of the combustion . This is classified in the same section as weight reduction , lighter wheels and gearing changes . It doesnt make the car more powerful but it does make it faster
        Bug_racer supports the rebellion of the euro revolution

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Bug_racer View Post
          I dont understand where you got the idea that a flywheel increases power ?
          All a flywheel does is allow the engine to spin up faster and not maintain as much momentum from the engine . There is no change to the efficiency of the combustion . This is classified in the same section as weight reduction , lighter wheels and gearing changes . It doesnt make the car more powerful but it does make it faster
          Someone on here said it does if you look at the other clutch thread. Not syaing he is right just that is where he got it from.
          For Sale 2006 VW Polo GTI
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          • #6
            One thing that lets the Polo down I reckon is the looooooooong clutch travel and I find it way too light and the take-up point too vague for my liking (but then I'm used to heavy clutches having cut my teeth on a Nissan Patrol, then an MGB) - would an uprated clutch change that?

            Have driven a Civic Type-R and a S2000 - now those are on the other extreme, clutch pedal travel is way too short, great for racing I'm sure but takes a lot of getting used to.

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            • #7
              Yes it does make the clutch feel heavier and shorter travel but in my case not to short. if this makes sense.
              For Sale 2006 VW Polo GTI
              Have a Look
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              • #8
                Originally posted by Bug_racer View Post
                I dont understand where you got the idea that a flywheel increases power ?
                All a flywheel does is allow the engine to spin up faster and not maintain as much momentum from the engine . There is no change to the efficiency of the combustion . This is classified in the same section as weight reduction , lighter wheels and gearing changes . It doesnt make the car more powerful but it does make it faster
                Yeah you are right - It doesn't add any extra power to the engine but what it does do is that it allows the power you already have to be better utilised since there is less rotational mass for the engine to turn. This results in more power to the ground through the wheels and as such you will see this on a dyno. However slight its still a fact. Not only that but the extra clamping power of the clutch itself allows a greater transfer of power to the transmission. So yes it doesn't make the engine more powerful, it allows a more efficient use of that power to make the car perform better.

                One thing that lets the Polo down I reckon is the looooooooong clutch travel and I find it way too light and the take-up point too vague for my liking (but then I'm used to heavy clutches having cut my teeth on a Nissan Patrol, then an MGB) - would an uprated clutch change that?

                Have driven a Civic Type-R and a S2000 - now those are on the other extreme, clutch pedal travel is way too short, great for racing I'm sure but takes a lot of getting used to.
                Yes the stock clutch is, shall we say, soft & spongy. If you get the right aftermarket clutch this will improve things dramatically.
                APR V2 Tuned, APR Dogbone mount, APR R1 DV, K&N Panel Filter, SEAT Intake, Forge TIP & FSB, Bilstein & H&R, Whiteline RSB, Full Milltek 2.5" exhaust

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                • #9
                  Lightweight flywheel... I lost some hours of sleep thinking about it and until now I not sure what to do.

                  There are some good and bad things about it.

                  I don’t know if for a street turbocharged engine using a lightweight flywheel is a good thing.

                  The flywheel is an “energy accumulator”, it will give you torque, will help you climb, will awake the turbo faster, but, the engine will respond slower.

                  A LWFW will change your torque curve, I don’t know if will be less torque or it will be in other place in the graph, the engine will respond faster, probably you will need to use more the throttle. Also the engine will lost rpm more quickly, you will need to be more precise in your shifts.

                  Those ECS aluminum FW have a significant weight drop, I’m very curious to see a car with one of them

                  Hi performance V8 N/A cars use LWFW, the clutch is double plate and they are “heavy”, however they work well between 6000rpm to 8000rpm

                  Who has a LWFW in the Polo?
                  Where can I find a Dyno graph from a car equipped with a LWFW?
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                  • #10
                    I have one mate and there is a dyno plot in one of my threads. Search custom code in the polo section and you will find it.
                    For Sale 2006 VW Polo GTI
                    Have a Look
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                    • #11
                      A change to the flywheel weight will most certainly affect the power a car delivers at the wheels.

                      What it does NOT do is increase the total power produced by the engine. It is therefore not a power producing modification at all. Rather a change in the ratio you have to calculate power at the engine vs power at the wheels.

                      There are both drawbacks and advantages to it as mentioned here in other threads.

                      For example:
                      As standard 150kw on the engine can be 120kw atw; changing the flywheel weight (ie making it lighter) will see 125kw atw but the engine would still be producing 150kw.
                      Current: 2023 MY23 T-Roc R Lapiz Blue + Beats Audio + Black pack 2018 MY19 Golf R manual Lapiz Blue + DAP) 2018 MY18 Golf 110TSI (150TSI) Trendline manual White2014 Amarok TSI Red (tuned over 200kw + lots of extras) 2013 Up! manual Red 2017 Polo GTI manual Black Previous VWs and some others ...
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                      • #12
                        Yep, that was my understanding - will let you know how it goes

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                        • #13
                          From my experience, a lighter flywheel will not improve peak HP at the wheels.

                          We did this on my Cayman S (~ 12kg flywheel down to a 5.5kg flywheel) - it made less than~ 1kw before & after on the dyno. (It only makes around 200 wkw)

                          The difference in responsiveness was great - huge improvement - well worth it (normally aspirated motor).

                          The difference between the 997 GT3 & GT3 RS is a lighter flywheel. It accelerates faster, but has the same top end output.
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                          • #14
                            Geez guy thats a dinner plate mate At least you know the pressure plate bolts are tight now hey
                            Cheers
                            Jmac
                            Alba European
                            Service, Diagnostics and repairs. Mobile Diag available on request
                            Audi/VW/Porsche Factory trained tech 25+ yrs exp
                            For people who value experience call 0423965341

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                            • #15
                              Hi Guy,

                              So what kind of a clutch are you running in ur K04'd Polo Gti? to handle all that extra smack?

                              Cheers

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