VW Passat, Audi A4, BMW 3?

[genkifd]

IS250 isnt quick at all - IS350 on the other hand is very comparable with the R36 / CC V6 performance.

for a 70k Audi you would be looking at a 2.0t FWD with minimum options
as for the BMW 323 but RWD.

to me the obvious choice is the R36 / CC V6 or IS350 (i think you can get the lowest model for this price bracket).

[Sharkie]

In your position I'd consider either the IS350 or a C250 CGI C-Class if buying new.

The IS350 obviously outgrunts the R36 (233kw/378NM v 220kw/350NM) has RWD and a proper auto and starting at $65K is quite a bargain. It will ouperform the R36, also has much more prestige than a VW and much much much better customer service.

Sadly being a big BMW fan the only 3series I'd recommend would be the 335i and thats far outside your price range. Also a brand new 3 series is due late 2011.

The C250 CGI is the new kid on the block, starts $65K and has a new direct injection 1.8 turbo. Making 150kw/310NM stock it is a bit off the R36's performance, however like all turbo cars will respond really well to selective tuning and will likely make at least 220kw/450NM and then be quicker than either the R36 and the IS350 and far more prestigious and classy.

Personally I'd pick the C-Class .....

[MrVW]

I realise I don’t HAVE to respond to every post, however you have taken the time to write so I am going to take the time to respond.

for $80k you could pick up a nice 5 series 2-3 years old. I dont see why it has to be a new car. It will loose 20% value as soon as you drive it out of the showroom

This is true, and certainly has been my experience with the Jetta I currently own – which has lost a substantial portion of its new car value in the last two years. I am a little nervous about buying second hand on account of the associated maintenance costs / potential maintenance issues. I have noticed a few cheap BMW 5 series around my local dealership, although have always considered that they are cheap because the high range mileage servicing/maintenance is not cheap at all! Is this a misconception?

I have to agree with the fact that a new car will depreciate once it rolls out of the showroom. I reckon maybe a 1-2year old car is worth considering.

The BMW 5-series might not have enough of a punch off the line though. Is there any A4 Quattro available for that price range? They are pretty quick ain't they?

I wouldn't really go the IS series. I was considering the IS250 back then. I can tell you, it is a really small car. There is hardly any head room nor space behind.

Another reason I have steered clear of a second hand BMW 5 Series is that I don’t know that they will provide enough power, especially for the 80k price range. My local Audi dealer has some pretty sweet second hand A4 Quattros in stock – however they are mainly 2.0L turbos that produce little more than 150kw. They’re not slow, however also not as fast as an R36. That being said, I do like the Audi A4 interior... very slick!

i drive a audi and used to have a vw.both cars a good value.

What do you have specifically?

I hate to bring the thread down to boganville, but my SS-V sportwagon fits that criteria with plenty of change. May not have the finesse, but super practical and pretty quick out of the box... perhaps not the most elegant look inside or out, but that's an individual choice.

(note: if I didn't have a boat to tow, I'd choose the R36 instead!!)

Holden’s Series 2 models are dramatically better than their predecessors, especially in terms of interior design (which is a big thing for me!). Unfortunately, one of the biggest reasons for buying a European car (from my point of view) is the associated cutting edge technology. Holden are catching up to the big Euro car makers in technological terms, however are still yet to introduce...

- Dynamic Light Assist

- A Park Assist function that is equivalent to that which will be in the 2011 Passat.

- Sat Nav heads up display - something I use quite a lot in the Jetta.

- Lane Assist / Adaptive Cruise Control (Holden may have this – I can’t see anything in the literature I have obtained from Holden!)

... Technology that will be available to me if I buy a 2011 Passat in the first quarter of 2011.

Your comment about towing a boat using a Holden instead of a VW is an interesting one. Either you have a big boat, or there are problems towing using an R36 that I need to know about. Can you fill me in on the detail?

I stepped out of an IS250 Sport Luxury into my R36, whilst not as quick, it was still quiet quick.

The IS350 compares in price pretty well to the IS250.

My wife and I are not a fan of the current IS model. That being said, are Lexus due for a new IS model in the next year or so? I will Google and find out!

IS250 isnt quick at all - IS350 on the other hand is very comparable with the R36 / CC V6 performance.

for a 70k Audi you would be looking at a 2.0t FWD with minimum options
as for the BMW 323 but RWD.

to me the obvious choice is the R36 / CC V6 or IS350 (i think you can get the lowest model for this price bracket).

Re: Audi – agreed. By the time you spec up an Audi, you’re talking 100k!

In your position I'd consider either the IS350 or a C250 CGI C-Class if buying new.

The IS350 obviously outgrunts the R36 (233kw/378NM v 220kw/350NM) has RWD and a proper auto and starting at $65K is quite a bargain. It will ouperform the R36, also has much more prestige than a VW and much much much better customer service.

Sadly being a big BMW fan the only 3series I'd recommend would be the 335i and thats far outside your price range. Also a brand new 3 series is due late 2011.

The C250 CGI is the new kid on the block, starts $65K and has a new direct injection 1.8 turbo. Making 150kw/310NM stock it is a bit off the R36's performance, however like all turbo cars will respond really well to selective tuning and will likely make at least 220kw/450NM and then be quicker than either the R36 and the IS350 and far more prestigious and classy.

Personally I'd pick the C-Class .....

Yeah – I don’t think you can surpass a Mercades Benz for prestige. Would I also be right in assuming that Mercs hold their value better than their European counterparts?

The decision in relation to a Mercades Benz or VW is Prestige or Performance. If I do decide that prestige is an extremely important factor, I may as well skip BMW, Audi and Lexus – and go to the Merc!

On another note, it almost seems that the name of this thread should be changed to 'R36 Passat alternatives', considering the conversation has diverted from just Audi/BMW/VW. How the heck do I do that?!

[genkifd]

imo the current C Class has a pretty poor interior - a lot of hard plastic panels. getting 220kw with just a tune would be optimistic

[thezoneR32]

Surely for $80k this is a no brainer? 325kw! 550NM!

http://www.carsales.com.au/all-cars/...=105&silo=1011

[Nath]

I agree a fantastic donk, but its just soooo ugly.

O and whats with having the dyno graph on the individual plaque......

Surely for $80k this is a no brainer? 325kw! 550NM!

http://www.carsales.com.au/all-cars/...=105&silo=1011

[adrock]

Wasn't the criteria leather? That rules out the R36.

[Dr Block]

I agree a fantastic donk, but its just soooo ugly.

O and whats with having the dyno graph on the individual plaque......

Ugly is an understatement!

[flyingfridge]

What about Passat CC V6 AWD?

[BrettD]

The only other issue you will have is that they are not bringing any more R36's out as the current Passat is being superceded (with no R36 replacement apparently) so you will have to either buy a second hand one or be lucky enough to find a demo or new one somehow still at a dealer!

There is a Demo 'Black R36 Wagon' at Pickerings Volkswagen in Townsville, QLD..might be worth a look

[PA.]

There is a Demo 'Black R36 Wagon' at Pickerings Volkswagen in Townsville, QLD..might be worth a look

Could be a bit water logged.

Hope all the members in wetter parts of this great big brown land of ours are copping well with the floods.

[flyingfridge]

The only other issue you will have is that they are not bringing any more R36's out as the current Passat is being superceded (with no R36 replacement apparently) so you will have to either buy a second hand one or be lucky enough to find a demo or new one somehow still at a dealer!

There is a Demo 'Black R36 Wagon' at Pickerings Volkswagen in Townsville, QLD..might be worth a look

We still have a few R36s around, I wouldn't say they're in short supply yet, every time I think the last one has gone through they manage to pull one out from somewhere... we delivered a brand new black wagon yesterday and have a white wagon demo and a blue sedan demo. I guess if you want something really specific you might have some trouble.

[MrVW]

Sooo...

RE: C class interior being too plasticy. I am not surprised to hear that, and that rules it out – I am not spending 80k on a plastic interior, otherwise I would buy a Honda (and get change for my 80k!)

RE: HSV GTS, it's too kitted up for me. If I were looking for a performance machine, you're right - it's a no brainer. Unfortunately, I want elegance and prestige also. Sorry if that offends anyone.

RE: Leather in R36 - you're right. That's a shame; I figured Leather is better for cleaning child related spillages (ice cream, soft drinks etc). Any thoughts on that?

RE: Water Logged R36 - I feel guilty for laughing at that comment (I have a poor sense of humour). I agree - hope all members in wetter parts are OK. The core comment however, regarding an ex-demo R36, is a decent one... however I think about how thrash demo/loaner cars... and that makes me not want to buy one.

RE: Availability of R36 - I have already talked to my dealer and there are a few in stock. It’s next to impossible finding one in my spec!

Re: Passat CC V6 AWD, my wife hates the back end. "It looks like a squashed alien"...

RE: 2011 Passat R - I have read that VW are / are not producing any more R36s in different places. How positive are we all that there will be no more produced? To hear that VW are no longer producing a Passat R surprises me, as:

1. I thought VW’s goal was to have an R series for each Production model;

2. The R36 has been VW’s fastest Production vehicle.

I will be disappointed if there isn’t a 2011 Passat R, that may take me away from the VW brand...

[flyingfridge]

From what I have read, there will be a 2011 Passat with the 220kW AWD in highline trim... With regard to Passat R, I guarantee VW are doing the classic German thing saying there will be no performance model and then turn around and launch it 18 months after the 'regular' models come out. In everything German there is always a delay to the hi-po cars, look at the M BMWs, AMG Mercs, Golf R, R50 and so on...

On the upside, the 2011 Highline Passat will have full leather trim rather than Alcantara....

[MrVW]

From what I have read, there will be a 2011 Passat with the 220kW AWD in highline trim... With regard to Passat R, I guarantee VW are doing the classic German thing saying there will be no performance model and then turn around and launch it 18 months after the 'regular' models come out. In everything German there is always a delay to the hi-po cars, look at the M BMWs, AMG Mercs, Golf R, R50 and so on...

On the upside, the 2011 Highline Passat will have full leather trim rather than Alcantara....

I agree. I'd put money on there being an R within two years on the standard Passat's release. Question in, who wants to wait that long for a new car?