Which upgrade should I do first

[go1better]

Do the APR stage 1, I did it a year ago on my 147tsi DSG, unreal, no issues, made a great car awesome.

[PeteC]

Dear All,
I am also a new owner of a Tiguan and I was looking at the chip tuning option. Everybody is talking about the APR Stage 1 tuning, but what about BSR tuning?
I just checked on the net, APR is around $1450 AUD and BSR is around $1170 AUD. Both provides similar HP increase.
Is anybody using BSR on this forum?

[tigger73]

Dear All,
I am also a new owner of a Tiguan and I was looking at the chip tuning option. Everybody is talking about the APR Stage 1 tuning, but what about BSR tuning?
I just checked on the net, APR is around $1450 AUD and BSR is around $1170 AUD. Both provides similar HP increase.
Is anybody using BSR on this forum?

If you want to save some $, APR will likely have a 15% off Easter sale. Their Christmas sale has just finished.

You need to check whether your Tig can be tuned over the OBD port or if it needs to be bench tuned. Somewhere in 2010 they changed ECUs in the Tigs and the later Bosch units have security on them that stops most people from tuning over the port.

If you need a bench tune then you're pretty much limited to what tuners that have bench tuning hardware in your location. APR can definitely do it and so can a number of other tuners - depends where you're located as to which brands are available.

First thing is find out whether your ECU can be read/written over he OBD port and then you can make some decisions from there.

You can't go wrong with APR though there are less expensive options out there also. One thing to consider is how far you're going to go with performance upgrades and whether the 6speed auto box can handle the extra power/torque.

[PeteC]

You can't go wrong with APR though there are less expensive options out there also. One thing to consider is how far you're going to go with performance upgrades and whether the 6speed auto box can handle the extra power/torque.

Thanks tigger.
My car is from March 2010 so I hope it has the older system, but I am going to check it.
Where I live I can find both APR and BSR tuning garages.

I am not going further with performance upgrades, I am only thinking about the chip tuning, nothing else. But it seems you think my transmission will not handle the extra power?

[tigger73]

Thanks tigger.
My car is from March 2010 so I hope it has the older system, but I am going to check it.
Where I live I can find both APR and BSR tuning garages.

I don't know much about BSR - haven't heard of anyone else getting one yet - though their tool for programming looks like it would work over OBD port only so if your 2010 model Tig is March you may be lucky and be able to use the tool.

I think if you buy the tune without the tool it's only $870 - just depends if it's going to be something that you need later.

I am not going further with performance upgrades, I am only thinking about the chip tuning, nothing else. But it seems you think my transmission will not handle the extra power?

No just something that you should investigate before putting the tune on. I know both DSG and manual transmissions are OK for stage1 but haven't heard of someone with a 6 speed auto doing it - not to say that you can't but just something that you're better off checking out before you go too far down the track.

If you're going increasing power by 50% and adding some more torque it's going to create more stress for the drivetrain. It should be able to cope with it but better to be safe than sorry and do your homework before trying to claim warranty on your drive-train (while you still have some left that is).

If you haven't done already, I suggest also checking out the http://www.vwwatercooled.com/forums/...ing-56616.html thread as there's a heap of useful info there.

[PeteC]

No just something that you should investigate before putting the tune on. I know both DSG and manual transmissions are OK for stage1 but haven't heard of someone with a 6 speed auto doing it -

Thanks tigger. I checked the recommended thread in your post and on the last page you just replied to someone who did Superchip tuning on his old automatic Tiguan. So there is hope as I can see it provides similar kw and torque as APR and BSR!

[Martin]

I would fully agree with these quotes

Do the APR stage 1, I did it a year ago on my 147tsi DSG, unreal, no issues, made a great car awesome.

Re APR stage 1, best value for $ in my opinion, effortless overtaking and shaves at least 1 second off 0-100 sprint for a bargain price.

My Octavia is a 6 speed DSG which is rated for 360nm torque
The Stage 1 APR ECU raises torque to 297mn
And it is the mid range torque that makes the biggest difference
(Can't use full power in 1st now - traction control always kicks in)

[tigger73]

Thanks tigger. I checked the recommended thread in your post and on the last page you just replied to someone who did Superchip tuning on his old automatic Tiguan. So there is hope as I can see it provides similar kw and torque as APR and BSR!

Yes Superchips is another OBD port tuning tool. As long as your vehicle can get tuned over the port (which I suspect it might well be able to), this will work.

You're lucky if you can get your car tuned over the port as otherwise it means removing the ECU from the car, soldering jumpers onto it and flashing on the bench before putting it back in the car and hoping everything starts.

[donweather]

My Octavia is a 6 speed DSG which is rated for 360nm torque
The Stage 1 APR ECU raises torque to 297mn
And it is the mid range torque that makes the biggest difference
(Can't use full power in 1st now - traction control always kicks in)

Hey Martin, did you have any issues getting the Stage 1 APR on your Octavia? Did they bench tune it, given it's a 2012?

I too have an Occy and am seriously thinking about chipping it, but am concerned how the extra power will be handled by the front wheel drive only? I find some serious traction control and torque steer already with the 147, let alone the APR 190kw?

[Tigger]

Hey Martin, did you have any issues getting the Stage 1 APR on your Octavia? Did they bench tune it, given it's a 2012?

I too have an Occy and am seriously thinking about chipping it, but am concerned how the extra power will be handled by the front wheel drive only? I find some serious traction control and torque steer already with the 147, let alone the APR 190kw?

I Agree! I have chosen not to tune my 2012 RS as the way it delivers the power is so different to our Tiguans with AWD...
I feel that it will break traction too easily, thus making any gains in power useless from off the line...

[tigger73]

I Agree! I have chosen not to tune my 2012 RS as the way it delivers the power is so different to our Tiguans with AWD...
I feel that it will break traction too easily, thus making any gains in power useless from off the line...

Same problem as all the GTI boys have with fwd and 200kW - easily loses traction in 1st and 2nd. That's why a tuned Tig is quicker off the lights as it can actually get the power down to the road whereas the other just spin their wheels before getting going.

Solution is RS4, Golf R or something else with AWD... ahh maybe a Tiguan

[Martin]

Hey Martin, did you have any issues getting the Stage 1 APR on your Octavia? Did they bench tune it, given it's a 2012?

I too have an Occy and am seriously thinking about chipping it, but am concerned how the extra power will be handled by the front wheel drive only? I find some serious traction control and torque steer already with the 147, let alone the APR 190kw?

No problem getting it at all mate, off the shelf...
I believe they have two programs, one for the TFSI and one for TSI (much better fuel pump)
They flashed it and did a few operational checks but no tuning was required
(remembering all modern engines with ECU run on a closed loop anyway)

Traction in 1st off the mark is tricky post the ECU upgrade
If you park on the white lines or if the road surface is choppy you will be in trouble
On a good surface, you only use 30%~40% throttle, get it rolling and up to ~3000rpm and then let it rip
You will still be much faster than stock and surprise many others around you

The midrange torque increase is far more effective than the peek power increase
In all other gears, the ability to drive on torque and effortlessly overtake quickly is just wonderful
(and in my opinion, the less time I spend on the wrong side of the road the better)
The APR stage 1 ECU update will take 1 second off your 0 to 100kmph time
There is no other way I can get that improvement by spending only $1,250 (xmas discount)

When reving out, past peak power, the top end seems worse than stock
I am currently short shifting at 6,000rpm with the steering wheel paddle and driving on the torque
I'm putting the exhaust down pipe, Stage II ECU and cold air intakes on the car next week to help address this
(Also doing roll bars, springs and lower control arms - one day this car will become my club racer)

I am not experiencing torque steer
I've tried to induce it but I'm pretty disciplined (through Kart and club racing)
(I've also driven a BMW M3 and a V8 Supercar around Eastern Creek)
Off the throttle before turn in, wait until after the apex before applying throttle, you'll be fine
(If you are using large amounts of throttle while turning in, you are not cornering hard and are unlikely to get torque steer)
If you put a turn or more on the wheel and plant the right foot from stationary I would expect that to be ugly
I thought the lack of torque steer was one of the WAG benefits (compared to others like Mazda 3 MPS)

This is the most powerful, quickest and best behaved FWD car I've ever owned

[james928]

2.0 TFSI Tiguan use the MED17.# DME which is tuner protected via OBD2. Bench flash no worries with the right gear. TriCore Siemens 1766/96CPU Ive done well over 50 of these in the last year. GTi has the same DME all be it with completely different internal file compile. R used MED9.5 old school. As far as I am aware all the non-R 2.0 model range use the MED17.# family controller now.