Stock Amarok Power figures

[Sharkie]

My Rok spent some time this week on a hub dyno. For those that don't know what that is, see here: Chassis Dynamometer - Dynamometers | Dynapack (International Dynamometers Ltd)

Essentially a hub dyno removes the variables that strapping down, tyre pressures and tyre grip has on dyno figures and other than an actual engine dyno is the most accurate representation of what the power output of a vehicle is.

To that extent, the figures on record that this Brisbane tuner and DynaPack dyno operator (Guy at Harding Performance) has on file was most interesting.

NOTE: These are for manual (6spd) Amarok's in 100% stock trim. Auto will have different figures and since Guy now owns an auto TDI420, may possibly be available in the future as well.

Max KW

TSI 300 (118kw VW rated) 125kw at the rear hubs @ 4000rmin

TDI420 (132kw VW rated) 121kw at the rear hubs

TDI400 (120kw VW rated) 110kw at the rear hubs @ 3800rmin

Hub dyno figures include drivetrain losses, so the estimated actual output of the TSI300 is ~136kw and not 118kw .....

Torque figures

TDI400 - max torque 393NM at the hubs @ 1965rm/min - but then it goes into a steep decline ....
- 355NM @ 2500rmin
- 305NM at 3000rmin
- 2nd turbo kicks in and creates a small flat curve component - still 300NM @3500rmin
- 260NM @ 4000rmin
- 175NM @ 4500rmin


TSI300 - max torque 308NM at the hubs @ 2500rmin - curve stays flat till 4000rmin
- ~300NM @ 3000rmin
- ~300NM @ 3500rmin
- ~300NM @4000rmin (you get the idea)
- 250NM @4500rmin
- 225NM @5000rmin
- 200NM @5500rmin

So, at 3000rmin TSI and TDI making the same torque .....

What this means on the road is that the TSI will accelerate faster (0-100 and 80-120+) and that the TDI will better maintain speed with a load at 2000rmin (about the 110km/h speed limit) up a hill. That same hill will require a TSI with a similar load to gear down to maintain speed.

[Transporter]

Yes, until you remap. Then you should get a different numbers on that dyno again. That goes the same for the TSI and the TDI.
The power and torque from the engine as advertised by the manufacturers is measured directly from the crankshaft, so what that mans once the engine is installed in the car it will have a different output at the wheels, since the ECU and TCU controls the engine output.

In the case of TSI300 with manual transmission and RWD, I'm not surprised that the measured output is higher than stated. There are always greater power loses with the auto transmissions.

So, when are getting the tune? It will be awesome to drive once remapped.

[Tornado_ALIVE]

I tend to shift at 2500 to 2800 in my TDI and rarely touch 3k on the street. Off road I will go over at times particularly in sand.

I would love to see the torque figure at 2k for the TDI. The TDI's torque is down low where the TSI you have to rev.

Have you got 0 to 100 figures on the 2 as I am not sure you are correct there. Would have to see the times to confirm. FYI, the TSI is only 2wd so the vehicle is lighter and will loose less through the driveline particularly over the permanent 4wd units. It would therefore not suprise me if it is quicker but neither are race cars. I bought mine to be a 4wd, so TDI was the way to go for me.

[Sharkie]

I tend to shift at 2500 to 2800 in my TDI and rarely touch 3k on the street. Off road I will go over at times particularly in sand.

I would love to see the torque figure at 2k for the TDI. The TDI's torque is down low where the TSI you have to rev.

Have you got 0 to 100 figures on the 2 as I am not sure you are correct there. Would have to see the times to confirm. FYI, the TSI is only 2wd so the vehicle is lighter and will loose less through the driveline particularly over the permanent 4wd units. It would therefore not suprise me if it is quicker but neither are race cars. I bought mine to be a 4wd, so TDI was the way to go for me.

Car Magazine in South Africa has tested the TSI and TDI and VW South Africa also lists 0-100. TSI is over 1 s quicker to 100 than the TDI.

[Sharkie]

Yes, until you remap. Then you should get a different numbers on that dyno again. That goes the same for the TSI and the TDI.
The power and torque from the engine as advertised by the manufacturers is measured directly from the crankshaft, so what that mans once the engine is installed in the car it will have a different output at the wheels, since the ECU and TCU controls the engine output.

In the case of TSI300 with manual transmission and RWD, I'm not surprised that the measured output is higher than stated. There are always greater power loses with the auto transmissions.

So, when are getting the tune? It will be awesome to drive once remapped.

Watch this space Miro Beta testing atm ....

[Sharkie]

Hub figures are showing what the car is producing at the wheels and what is being put to the ground, much more reflective of what you will experience on the road compared to crank figures ......

[Sharkie]

Also important to note the difference between the TSI and TDI in how they build revs .... one fairly slow, the other quick. In the time the TDI will rev from 2000-3000rmin the TSI will have done 2000-4000+ .....

[idaho]

What was / were the corrections applied to obtain the original figures? On a Dynapack printout it is normally one of the figures at the bottom (tcf).

[Transporter]

Hub figures are showing what the car is producing at the wheels and what is being put to the ground, much more reflective of what you will experience on the road compared to crank figures ......

I agree. One should never buy a car based on what the manufacturer printed in the sale brochure. The example; Hyundai IX35 CRD I've roadtested 4 years ago before we bought the Tiguan had (still has) 135kW and 397Nm torque and it was absolutely gutless when I compared to our 103kW/320Nm Golf5 TDI. It was not so long time ago when Hyundai was in the trouble in US for advertising that their engines have more power than they had.

I see a great tuning potential for 300TSI Amarok with 2WD, there are many utes that are 2WD.

[Sharkie]

What was / were the corrections applied to obtain the original figures? On a Dynapack printout it is normally one of the figures at the bottom (tcf).

tcf 1.00 .... meaning no correction applied.

[Ramee]

Here is another thread with some performance data of amarok and also with a exhaust and tune.
tsi tuning | Volkswagen Amarok | VW Amarok Forum

I think a turbo upgrade is the way to go to get big numbers considering amarok has different turbo compared to other TSI engines vw offer.

[Sharkie]

Here is another thread with some performance data of amarok and also with a exhaust and tune.
tsi tuning | Volkswagen Amarok | VW Amarok Forum

I think a turbo upgrade is the way to go to get big numbers considering amarok has different turbo compared to other TSI engines vw offer.

Different turbo yes, similar to the 1 fitted to A4, A5 and Q5 quattro 2.0Ts though, yet slightly unique.

Those tune boxes are a waste of time to be honest. I saw that thread earlier too, the figures they got was appalingly poor to be frank.

Massive numbers going to be coming from an APR stg 1 tune alone. The existing stock setup in the TSI Amarok really is well suited to a tune and other extras. Possibly best stg 1 results on a Gen1/2 EA888 ever. APR will release the numbers when they are happy with the testing.

When you see how APR approaches this, you know why there are no issues with the their tunes afterwards. After APR releases their numbers, I'll post details in my build thread

[Ramee]

Different turbo yes, similar to the 1 fitted to A4, A5 and Q5 quattro 2.0Ts though, yet slightly unique.

Those tune boxes are a waste of time to be honest. I saw that thread earlier too, the figures they got was appalingly poor to be frank.

Massive numbers going to be coming from an APR stg 1 tune alone. The existing stock setup in the TSI Amarok really is well suited to a tune and other extras. Possibly best stg 1 results on a Gen1/2 EA888 ever. APR will release the numbers when they are happy with the testing.

When you see how APR approaches this, you know why there are no issues with the their tunes afterwards. After APR releases their numbers, I'll post details in my build thread

Yeah.. A proper tune is always much better than those piggy back devices.
Looking forward to see upgraded values in your build thread. Another advantage of amarok that no other vw has is its weight can reduce anytime. Just remove the rear load tray when you hit the drag strip.

[bombsquad21]

Thanks for taking the time to publish all that Sharkie, literally cannot wait to get a tune on mine.
It's all quite subjective at the lower ranges of power I think, many many variables. I would just like to handle a slight incline on the motorway and not have to change from 6th to 3rd!

[Sharkie]

Thanks for taking the time to publish all that Sharkie, literally cannot wait to get a tune on mine.
It's all quite subjective at the lower ranges of power I think, many many variables. I would just like to handle a slight incline on the motorway and not have to change from 6th to 3rd!

Problem is, even though VW claims 300NM as the maximum torque from 1600, its a lie ..... ~300NM only arrives just before 2000rmin. And unfortunately the gearing (same between a TDI and a TSI) is set for a cruising speed in 6th at 100 and 110kmkm/h thats below 2000rmin. In reality that puts the TDI at its peak torque and allows effortless cruising but the TSI is outside its optimum torque curve and needs to have another 500-1000rmin onboard to sustain and pickup speed up a hill.

Dropping a gear (or 2) allows the TSI to be in the meat of its power and torque curves and results in it picking up speed quite significantly ..... the same unfortunately can't be said for the TDI .... dropping a gear (or 2) means it now falls outside of its peak torque and power curves and adding speed is relatively lethargic compared to the TSI.

Can't have the best of both worlds (without a tune anyway)