Golf R or GTI Manual?

[Dan199]

Where are you based? If you’re in or around BNE, you’re welcome to come and have a drive in mine (it’s a 7.0 not 7.5 though).


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Cheers dude but I'm down in Melbourne

[Jap]

You do know their phasing out the R and gtd manual over here don’t you? Something to do with eu emissions, so you may have a knock on effect down there

[BenT]

You do know their phasing out the R and gtd manual over here don’t you? Something to do with eu emissions, so you may have a knock on effect down there

Yikes! Was that in the news somewhere?


Ben

Current
2015 Polo GTI manual
2018 Golf GTI Original manual

Previous
2014 Polo GTI DSG
2013 Golf GTI DSG
2006 RenaultSport Megane 225 Cup manual
2006 Golf GTI manual
2005 Golf 2.0 TSI manual
2001 Astra SRi manual
2000 Pulsar SSS manual
1999 Astra CD auto
1998 Pulsar SLX auto
1991 Pulsar GL manual
1981 Subaru Leone auto

[Jap]

No a sales manager from a vw garage posted it on a UK golf page,

[Mattlock]

No a sales manager from a vw garage posted it on a UK golf page,

As frustrating as that kind of news is, it confirms my complete base feeling about the Mk7 manual R (and GTI) - it is a car built around the DSG that is then ‘adjusted’ to fit the clutch. It feel like it’s a dying breed in VWs arsenal.

This lack of connectedness is why I’m off to do a second drive of the i30N tomorrow (the drive with my head, rather than the excitement of the press hype).


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[Splashalot]

This lack of connectedness is why I’m off to do a second drive of the i30N tomorrow (the drive with my head, rather than the excitement of the press hype).


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Will be most interested in your unbiased opinion on the i30n. Some of the press hype is so OTT you would think Hyundai could enter it in F1 and walk away with a win in every race. My gut feeling is that the i30n is more a competitor to the Focus ST than GTI. Quite different cars with a different focus (so to speak). But I've not driven the i30n, hence interested in your opinion.

[Mattlock]

Will be most interested in your unbiased opinion on the i30n. Some of the press hype is so OTT you would think Hyundai could enter it in F1 and walk away with a win in every race. My gut feeling is that the i30n is more a competitor to the Focus ST than GTI. Quite different cars with a different focus (so to speak). But I've not driven the i30n, hence interested in your opinion.

So I’ve driven the i30N twice now with 2 different dealers on 2 different sets of roads and with 2 different specifications, once with a dealer on board and once by myself.

The car is impressive. It is really good in all the right places. AS a headline, it is on a par with my 7R (206kW version; I’ve not driven a 7.5 so I don’t know if the extra power from the 7.5 would swing the balance back).

All the following comments are in relation to my R, which is stock except for a Dogbone Insert.

Driving:
The N feels more on its toes and keener to turn in. It’s mechanical LSD is pretty awesome. You can punt the car into a corner and feel it tighten up and drag the car round. The initial turn-in is crisper and as the car is a FWD the handling and weight transfer is easier to predict. The overall vehicle weight will have a bearing here too and not lugging the extra diff around makes a difference (particularly as it’s not always helping).

This is important as one of the biggest issues I have with my R is that the Haldex is a tricky beast to use properly. I think you have to be a really good driver to access it properly, and on a track, as the R still feels capable of cornering way faster than the N.

The steering in the N has better feedback. It weights up nicely and I felt more connected to the wheels.

So the N is probably more accessible on a day-to-day basis on roads and with a normal driver.

The N’s adaptive suspension is better tuned than the R’s. On bumpy, pot-holed roads in an industrial estate, the N is far more composed in Normal mode than my R. There’s no crashy sounds or harsh vibrations through the body and steering. It’s a small but noticeable difference and I liked it.

Equipment/Interior:
The N in Luxury pack is pretty good. However, the non-Luxury version is also fairly well equipped considering the price point. The seats are good and very supportive. There’s loads of room in the back (as good as the R) and the boot is much bigger (so a tick from me for lugging my kids around).

The Luxury pack adds a bunch of things that I think are important, most notably the proximity entry/exit, front parking sensors and rain-sensing wipers and folding mirrors. You also get electric seats (x2) with memory, leather and a push-button starter.

I’ve driven with and without a sunroof. It robs headspace (as usual) but isn’t too close to your head. Without it, though, I could wear a big hat and not have issues.

A lack of LED interior lighting is a bit of a shame and there’s more grey plastic then there should be. In overall aesthetics, the R is a better cabin to sit in but the differences are marginal, especially considering the price point difference. The R’s cabin isn’t $5k better than the N’s!

Build Quality:
Think Mazda. This thing is as well built as my brand-new Mazda 3. The doors all shut positively. They’re not a heavy as a VW’s but not far off. All the switch gear feels solid and well-made. The column stalks are a bit flimsy but, again, no better/worse than a Mazda.

Panel gaps were consistent across both cars and they are a touch wider than a VWs but not scary big.

You’ll notice where the clear-coat on the paint stops as the panels wrap to the inside. Less noticeable on the white car I drove but there (again, just like the Mazda) and can only be seen if you look closely with the boot open.

There’s no gas strut for the bonnet.

Like the Focus RS and the Falcon Sprint 8, they’ve spent the money on the important bits (drivetrain, suspension and engine).

Performance:
It’s as quick as my R in everyday use.

The brakes are better. They pre-prime as you lift off the throttle so that initial deadness in the R is missing. As soon as you touch them, they bite and you stop - quickly. I did an emergency stop and it was good. ABS was effective and the pedal didn’t flex under the full stomp.

I think that the only place the R has the N licked is the 80-100km/h overtake in 4th on the freeway. It’s subjective but the R’s extra torque tells here. The N isn’t slow - the R is just insanely rapid at this particular function. The N’s overboost function does pretty much fill the gap between the 2 cars for the 10-15s that it operates.

The rev matching is amazing and covers the other major bug bear I have with the R - I can’t heel/toe it properly. I didn’t try to heel/toe the N manually as it wasn’t my car but the software got it right every single time, even if you drop it 2 or 3 gears or dip the clutch and wait before re-engaging it. Plus you get some pops from the exhaust which make you giggle every time!

It can live on 95RON fuel, rather than the 98-only diet for the R, although I’d still probably only put 98 in it.

Overall:
The N is 95% of my R at a fully loaded price point that is $5k cheaper than the R Grid (better equipment spec at that point).

It has a better warranty and is more fun (exhaust pops, rev matching). In terms of the grin factor - it’s there. It’s a lot of fun for less money than an R or a GTI.

I can see why the market is getting all excited over this car. It’s really going to give VW a hard time. Hell, Wheels mag just rated it above a Civic Type R!

As my R is only a few months away from coming to the end of the lease, I will be doing the maths next week on switching to the N. Same fun, better warranty, a car built around a manual gearbox and easier to access for everyday drivers and everyday driving conditions. Plus it’s cheaper than the R Grid by $5k. The only interesting thought will be future re-sale value. VWs tend to hold value well, not sure about the N.

I’ll drive the N for 3 years by which time the RN30 will be available and then the world will get turned upside down again.

[WallySimmonds]

Interesting write up, thanks.

I think VW will be very worried once the dual clutch comes out. I've not looked at the N for precisely that reason as I want an auto.

[Mattlock]

Interesting write up, thanks.

I think VW will be very worried once the dual clutch comes out. I've not looked at the N for precisely that reason as I want an auto.

Yeah, at the moment it’s only appealing for the small market segment that wants a manual gearbox. I agree that once the dual clutch car is out at the end of this year, they will have an exact match for VW and then it will be interesting to see what the Mk8 does to re-dress the balance.



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[rosslm]

Yeah, at the moment it’s only appealing for the small market segment that wants a manual gearbox. I agree that once the dual clutch car is out at the end of this year, they will have an exact match for VW and then it will be interesting to see what the Mk8 does to re-dress the balance.
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If you look at some overseas rankings they tell a mixed story Autocar has the Honda Civic R in first Ford RS second Golf R third Hyundai i30N in tenth so it's swings and round abouts they still rate the Golf R as the best daily. Owning both a 7R and 7.5R DSG got to say the latest iteration has just added to an already very good car, moved my JB4 to the new car just lifts the performance to another level and still the 7.5 is averaging 1L/100 better than the 7 7.2L/100 km over 9000 km admittedly I'm not a city driver wouldn't recommend the R as a city daily though it's better as a cruiser. I'm sure the MK8 will again raise the bar, the MK7 has been around 7 years and still looks fresh.

[Mattlock]

If you look at some overseas rankings they tell a mixed story Autocar has the Honda Civic R in first Ford RS second Golf R third Hyundai i30N in tenth so it's swings and round abouts they still rate the Golf R as the best daily. Owning both a 7R and 7.5R DSG got to say the latest iteration has just added to an already very good car, moved my JB4 to the new car just lifts the performance to another level and still the 7.5 is averaging 1L/100 better than the 7 7.2L/100 km over 9000 km admittedly I'm not a city driver wouldn't recommend the R as a city daily though it's better as a cruiser. I'm sure the MK8 will again raise the bar, the MK7 has been around 7 years and still looks fresh.

Yeah, just like all car tests really - fairly subjective and opinions

As for the R not being a City daily, I agree 100%. My R is doing exactly that duty right now and has been from Day 1. I bought it knowing this but also knowing that I’d always wanted to own an R and at the time the GTI wasn’t a significant step forward from my Mk5 GT Sport in terms of performance.

My R over 36,000km has managed an average of 10l/100km and that tells where it spends most of its time. Get it on the freeway (as I have these last 2 weeks) and it soaks up those km like no other.

I think the N works for me as it gives me (most of) the performance of the R but in a more city commute friendly GTI style package.

It also works for me as I get bored with my cars after 2-3 years and change them. An expensive habit but I’m addicted!


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[BenT]

.

It also works for me as I get bored with my cars after 2-3 years and change them. An expensive habit but I’m addicted!


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What cars have you had?


Ben

Current
2015 Polo GTI manual
2018 Golf GTI Original manual

Previous
2014 Polo GTI DSG
2013 Golf GTI DSG
2006 RenaultSport Megane 225 Cup manual
2006 Golf GTI manual
2005 Golf 2.0 TSI manual
2001 Astra SRi manual
2000 Pulsar SSS manual
1999 Astra CD auto
1998 Pulsar SLX auto
1991 Pulsar GL manual
1981 Subaru Leone auto

[LibraR]

Yeah, just like all car tests really - fairly subjective and opinions

As for the R not being a City daily, I agree 100%. My R is doing exactly that duty right now and has been from Day 1. I bought it knowing this but also knowing that I’d always wanted to own an R and at the time the GTI wasn’t a significant step forward from my Mk5 GT Sport in terms of performance.

My R over 36,000km has managed an average of 10l/100km and that tells where it spends most of its time. Get it on the freeway (as I have these last 2 weeks) and it soaks up those km like no other.

I think the N works for me as it gives me (most of) the performance of the R but in a more city commute friendly GTI style package.

It also works for me as I get bored with my cars after 2-3 years and change them. An expensive habit but I’m addicted!


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How do you last two or three years...? 😆

[Mattlock]

Vauxhall Barina
Holden Astra
Mazda CX-7
Golf GT Sport
Tiguan
Mazda 3
Golf R

All in the last 10 years, family requirements excepting!




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[Mattlock]

How do you last two or three years...? [emoji38]

Haha. I know. It would be faster if it wasn’t for the Minster and my kids. Garage space is also a challenge but a couple of mates and me are working on that solution!

I already have a list on CarSales that I am keeping my eye on!


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