MT vs DSG survey

[trueman]

Can anyone who has a MT GTI and regrets not getting a DSG please post and conversly those who have a DSG GTI and regrets not getting a MT.
Please see other MT DSG Thread

[noone]

I don't think you are going to get many responses in here.
Try the Mk 5 or Mk 6 sections, you can create a poll if you are feeling creative.

[trueman]

yes just realised thanks

[trueman]

MT vs DSG survey

Can anyone who has a MT GTI and regrets not getting a DSG please post and conversly those who have a DSG GTI and regrets not getting a MT. Just out of interest as just reading a thread on golfmk6.com
__________________
2010 GTi CW
DSG ACC Detroits
MDI BT
Due end March

[trueman]

http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3607

[Corey_R]

I had a Golf GTI MKV with DSG and never regreted not having a manual.

I have a Polo GTI right now and regret not having a DSG

[Guy_H]

My MKVI is a manual, very happy with it. My MKV was a manual as well. The MKVI gearchanges & control feel is all better than the MKV.

When our Golf R gets here, I'm very tempted to get a DSG gearbox - just for fun

[MurphyTheElf]

I love having the DSG for plodding along in the city and for peak hour. The changes are very quick and the exhaust fart sounds just awesome. Paddle downshifts are especially nice.

However, I do sometimes wish for the control of a manual. The DSG will never replace that. If you flatten the accelerator, it will kick down regardless of the selected mode. Changing between reverse and drive is obviously slower. When traction control kicks in, the DSG will often change up to negate wheelspin, however, it quickly changes down again when traction is regained. Effective but a little disconcerting - especially in paddle shift mode. And of course the much-maligned pause before acceleration at standstill. In my opinion this is the biggest pitfall and I really wish it could be overcome. Acceleration is probably still faster than most people could manage in a manual, but I honestly feel that the pause costs me precious seconds.

Meh, the grass is always greener on the other side.

If you're a real world driver, go the DSG. If you're a track warrior or a control freak, then go the manual.

[Corey_R]

Hey Murphy - you still haven't read the manual yet have you ?! :p

If you push the accelerator all the way to the floor, you hit a switch which tells the car to downshift (if revs allow). If you go almost all the way to the floor, you still get 100% acceleration, but the DSG won't downshift and will hold the current gear.

The 'pause' at start off is more of a concern, although VW claims to have reduced that pause even more with the Golf R (not sure if that's true). Also on this note, a link to the 6spd DSG for dummies was posted a few days ago in another thread here and reading it gave a few points directly in relation to this situation, interestingly under the 'Fuel Saving' heading (I don't have a DSG atm to see if these work):

Fuel saving methods

One of the ways in which the DSG allows better fuel consumption over a manual gearbox is the ability to disconnect it's clutches when no engine effort is required. This occurs when the brake pedal is depressed (e.g. at stop light) and also when driving on a straight road when no pedal input is detected. When braking the clutches do not disengage unless the car is at a complete standstill.

The fuel injectors are also cut when no pedal input is detected also saving fuel. It is easy to see when you have the "instantaneous" fuel consumption figure in your MFD showing - it will be 0.0 when you take your foot off the pedal whilst moving.

An unfortunate side effect of this is a common complaint of "hesitation" when taking off from a standstill. This is because there is a delay between the DSG being told the brake pedal is no longer being depressed and it re-engaging the clutches.

Ways around this include:

* Easing off the brake rather than quick release. The "Hillhold" function means that under partial brake application at standstill clucthes are engaged. This means that at partial brake, the clutches will be connected allowing instant power transfer.
* Tapping the throttle to "wake up" the DSG and cause it to connect the clutches. The DSG will stay awake for 1-2 seconds before it disconnects clutches again if you still have your foot on the brake.

So yeah - if the 'tap' function actually does engage the clutches and make the DSG ready, that would remove basically my only complaint about the DSG gearbox.

[MurphyTheElf]

Hey Murphy - you still haven't read the manual yet have you ?! :p

If you push the accelerator all the way to the floor, you hit a switch which tells the car to downshift (if revs allow). If you go almost all the way to the floor, you still get 100% acceleration, but the DSG won't downshift and will hold the current gear.

*sigh* Yes, I've read the manual. Yes, I'm aware of the switch. I don't think it needs to be there. If you push the shifter to the left, it should be fully manual. Apart from stall prevention, that is.

In the heat of the moment, subtlety is easier said than done. I'm a foot-masher. Hey, I didn't say I was a great driver.

[bigmouthmedia]

It's the first time I've used DSG - and while it's a bit unusual and different to the Mazda3 I came out of and had instant acceleration, once you train yourself in the fine art of slightly hitting the accelerator after the brake, it's a good unit - plus it helps with manual tiptronics.

[Corey_R]

*sigh* Yes, I've read the manual. Yes, I'm aware of the switch. I don't think it needs to be there. If you push the shifter to the left, it should be fully manual. Apart from stall prevention, that is.

In the heat of the moment, subtlety is easier said than done. I'm a foot-masher. Hey, I didn't say I was a great driver.

Hehehe - yeah, I hear ya! I actually read the manual, and in all the 'new Euro things' I found inside, I missed the bit about the switch, until I came here. But then I didnt' have the car for much longer and never really got to get used to the 'switch'. Oh well.

[blutopless2]

just a query here.....

the ability to disconnect it's clutches when no engine effort is required. This occurs when the brake pedal is depressed (e.g. at stop light) and also when driving on a straight road when no pedal input is detected. When braking the clutches do not disengage unless the car is at a complete standstill.

The fuel injectors are also cut when no pedal input is detected also saving fuel. It is easy to see when you have the "instantaneous" fuel consumption figure in your MFD showing - it will be 0.0 when you take your foot off the pedal whilst moving.

If these two things happen at the same time... clutches disengage effectively putting it in neutral AND fuel injectors cut....
wouldn't the engine stall???

[Corey_R]

Yeah - when I read that at first I got all confused over it too. I guess it depends on terminology (which I'm not particularly sure what it is). Like when you put your foot on the clutch pedal, is that engaging the clutch, or disengaging it?

Anyway, I think what he means is that the DSG, unlike an auto, can do the same thing that a person driving a manual can. If the car is in gear, and foot isn't on the clutch pedal, and you're 'coasting', as long as the revs are high enough the fuel supply can be turned off because the motion of the car is enough to turn over the engine, thus using 0 fuel.

[MurphyTheElf]

The live fuel economy meter supports this. If you lift your foot off the accelerator when moving forwards, the economy drops to 0.0l/100km. The engine is being turned over by momentum. At standstill, however, the meter changes from l/100km to l/hour - fuel is again being used to keep the engine running.