Golf 118TSI vs. 103TDI

[Buller_Scott]

The 'stock' numbers 0-100 etc. for the TDI certainly don't seem to match the 'feel' of the car. Are there any roadtests out there with real world figures?

and they never will. all this wank about how slow diesels are etc etc based on seemingly NOTHING but official 0-100kmh times. yeah- because when you're doing drive days in the twisties, you spend a majority of the time launching from 0-100, and NOT rolling accelerating, i guess?

p.s. im not sure if drive days in large[ish] groups of cars without advising the police are illegal, and some of the cars might be running hub spacers, which are illegal, so i apologize if my post pertains to illegalities which are prohibited from discussion under forum rules

[Corey_R]

I have a current model Ford Focus Diesel in my garage. It's not my car, but the owner is not around atm, so I use the car semi-regularly to keep it in running order etc. Whilst it's obviously not of Golf quality, the engine is very comparable to the Golf 2L diesel - both having almost identical figures.

Having also been in a standard petrol Focus, the diesel is well and truly the pick of the crop. The power delivery is awesome, the fuel economy great. So when it comes to regular petrols vs turbo diesels, it's turbo diesel all the time! This is the same for most cars where they're available in an NA petrol and a similarly sized turbo diesel motor.

The thing is, compared to my Polo GTI - which is admittedly chipped, so it has the same ~320NM, but it then has 50% more power, the Focus just doesn't compare. My car has the "diesels great torque" from practically the same low RPM. But then it holds it for longer, and then has a peak power 50% larger and 2000rpm higher than the diesel's redline. Being such an old engine, the fuel consumption is just not even in the same league as the modern cars though.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is. Previously, diesel vs Petrol was a no brainer. Anyone "in the know" (which was not many people!) took the diesel. But the Golf has changed that. In the Golf, the petrol options are turbo charged, or turbo & supercharged. The fuel consumption is so close that almost no one will ever recoupe the difference in purchase price on fuel consumption. The power delivery, although featuring a different "curve", is quite impressive on both Golf diesels and Golf petrols.

I almost think that this thread is as pointless as a "which colour should I get thread". Drive both, pick which one you like. Be happy with what you have, and don't listen to what other people say. At the same time, don't put down what other people have chosen. We're all driving Volkswagens here, so we're already all of above average intelligence! .

So that's my message. We're all VW fans, embrace each other. Who cares what fuel you car uses

[pologti18t]

I almost think that this thread is as pointless as a "which colour should I get thread". Drive both, pick which one you like. Be happy with what you have, and don't listen to what other people say. At the same time, don't put down what other people have chosen. We're all driving Volkswagens here, so we're already all of above average intelligence! .

So that's my message. We're all VW fans, embrace each other. Who cares what fuel you car uses

Did you see the latest NRMA new car running costs?

Over the life of the vehicle (purchease price, depreciation, servining, fuel etc) it is the usually the diesel car that is more expensive to run per week than the equivalent petrol model.

Diesel-car ownership, traditionally more expensive than for petrol vehicles, closed the gap slightly, with the turbo-diesel Hyundai i30 hatchback costing just $159 a week, a $5 premium over the petrol-engined version and closing the gap by about 50 cents on last year

[Corey_R]

I didn't see the NRMA guide, but I figured this to be the case. If you like the diesel better, than I don't think $5 per week is going to upset you too much. The difference in initial purchase price might be more of a deterent though knowing that you won't be making up that cost over the long run.

[cameronp]

I didn't see the NRMA guide, but I figured this to be the case. If you like the diesel better, than I don't think $5 per week is going to upset you too much. The difference in initial purchase price might be more of a deterent though knowing that you won't be making up that cost over the long run.

Those "new car cost of ownership" comparisons always seemed a bit weird to me. If you're buying a brand-new car, you're already making the wrong financial decision, because the initial depreciation is so brutal. The cost calculations will vary a lot between different people and how you drive, too. Much better to just pick a car within your budget that you'll enjoy driving.

Not to say that cost and value-for-money is completely irrelevant, of course - if the 103TDI had been cheaper than the 118TSI rather than more expensive (as was the case in the Mk5), I might easily have gone for the diesel.

[Greg Roles]

Great post Corey.

Please allow for the weight difference between a focus sized car and the polo though!

I get what you say about a wider power curve, I must admit I was flown to the ACT for work a week back, and they hired me a Corolla for the day. I couldn't believe how the thing revved! A friggen Corolla!!! I actually enjoyed it.

SAD!

I'm loving the challenge of modding a diesel, given I've done 2-strokes, 4 strokes, rotaries, petrol turbo's and V8's thus far. For me, it's all about being different.

[Brian]

Did you see the latest NRMA new car running costs?

Over the life of the vehicle (purchease price, depreciation, servining, fuel etc) it is the usually the diesel car that is more expensive to run per week than the equivalent petrol model.

I'm just in receipt of the latest RACQ mag (QLD) which does a comparative cost of ownership thing.
To Quote " A small diesel car will generally cost around $15+ per week more than a petrol one"
I'm assuming this takes into account the depreciation costs for the premium you pay up front for the diesel car (in the case of a 120kW car ~ $6000) and the number of ks you do per year. On my usage of 10ks per year, the diesel would be dearer to run than the petrol.
Brian

[hoi polloi]

Agreed, there is little difference between running costs between 118TSI and 103TDI simply because the former is so economical to begin with...

In my case -

- the diesel is $2500 more than the petrol...
- the diesel does use slightly less fuel but the cost of the fuel varies from between slightly more and slightly less than premium unleaded (there are no cheap Tuesdays/Wednesdays running distillate)...
- I do like the way the diesel drives... I've not been one to explore the upper rev ranges of petrol cars I've owned - well not often
- I figure I'll get at least a portion of the extra $2500 purchase price back when I get rid of the car...

Insurance (for me) with the 103TDI is about $300p.a. less than for the 118TSI - In fact the difference between the 118TSI and the GTI for me is $30p.a. despite the GTI being more expensive...

- Anthony.

[Brian]

Insurance (for me) with the 103TDI is about $300p.a. less than for the 118TSI
- Anthony.

Interesting figure, Anthony, considering my yearly premium for my TSI (with RACQ) is $305. That would mean I could insure a TDI for $5 per year.
I've been had!!!
Despite that, I agree the diesel will be cheaper to run in the long run if you do the Ks.
Drive-ability is a matter of personal preference - me, I like the revs
Regards,
Brian

[cameronp]

Insurance (for me) with the 103TDI is about $300p.a. less than for the 118TSI - In fact the difference between the 118TSI and the GTI for me is $30p.a. despite the GTI being more expensive...

Yeah, I'm paying $200 p.a. more to insure the 118TSI than I was for my previous Focus XR5 Turbo with RAC WA. I was quoted only marginally more for the GTI than the TSI, and a couple of companies wouldn't insure me at all as an under-25 with a turbocharged petrol car.

[Corey_R]

Interesting figure, Anthony, considering my yearly premium for my TSI (with RACQ) is $305.

Holy crap... $305 total for comprehensive insurance?

Is there some catch there, like you work at home, and only do 1000km per year and have been a member for 60 years or something?

[Brian]

Holy crap... $305 total for comprehensive insurance?

Is there some catch there, like you work at home, and only do 1000km per year and have been a member for 60 years or something?

Hey Coreying,
Sorry, I lied, Ive just checked my accounting programme, my total comprehensive bill for the TSI was $312.41 counting credit card costs to pay it.
I am a silver member of RACQ (10 years membership) maximum no claim for life and Im 54 years old with no claims for 20 years. I also have 2 other policies with RACQ. (house and contents)
I dont have any restrictions on kms travelled etc etc
I was pleasantly surprised also as my previous hack (Commodore SS) used to cost me $750. I got a $500 refund when I bought the TSI
Regards,
Brian

[Corey_R]

I had my Polo GTI with NRMA in Sydney at ~$900. That's including Silver membership, Max no claim, and multi policy discount. I'm nowhere near as old, and I have no at fault accidents in over 5 years (though I did have a car written off within the last 2 years, not my fault though). Anyway, I'm now with Shannons cause NRMA wanted to put my policy up by 33% this year... pfft!

[Brian]

I had my Polo GTI with NRMA in Sydney at ~$900. That's including Silver membership, Max no claim, and multi policy discount. I'm nowhere near as old, and I have no at fault accidents in over 5 years (though I did have a car written off within the last 2 years, not my fault though). Anyway, I'm now with Shannons cause NRMA wanted to put my policy up by 33% this year... pfft!

Glad you are happy with Shannons, I have heard some negative reports from mates with them. Long as its good for you. After all, its where you get the best service for the price.
Brian

[Corey_R]

I've been happy with Shannons in the past after the first time NRMA screwed me over with increasing the premium by such a large % for no reason. I tried them due to the good reports from mates with them. Shannons are related to GIO, so any quality repairer that does NRMA and/or GIO will also happily be used by Shannons, requiring less work from me to get what I want