Performance enhancement and warranty

[Corey_R]

I don't personally own a 118TSI, but both my MKV GTI and Polo GTI had APR tunes practically from the start of their life (~8k on the odometres on both cars). They've both been flawless in operation and both have been serviced by my VW dealer service centre without any question or comments about the fact that they've been modified.

My Golf GTI had stage II - It had a security lockout on the ECU flash though, so that would've been indetectable to the dealer, but it also had a full exhaust (turbo back) and so was obviously modified (full Oettinger bodykit and wheels too).
My Polo GTI has just the stage I flash, and a BMC air filter. I don't have the security lockout on the flash, so it is detectable by the service centre. No other mods though.

In fact, a VW service at a dealership in QLD even filled up my oil for free in my Golf GTI. I'd driven from Syd to Bris (checking my oil before leaving) and just as I was driving into Brisbane the oil light came on! The car only had 10k on the clock and so was obviously still in its 'using lots of oil' stage. I told the dealer principle I'm happy to pay for the oil, but he said that the employees enjoyed checking out the car too much to charge for the privilege!

So yeah - I haven't had to have any warranty work done, and obviously peoples views on tuning will vary from dealership to dealership, but so far my experience with VW in this respect has been very positive

[265coupe]

I'm sure that the reputable brands have done the hard yards in R & D. And no one should consider a tune from anyone who can't back the tune with good service.

But at the end of the day when you're standing at the service counter with your modded 118TSi being unloaded from the tilt tray with oil pooling underneath, APR or anyone else ain't going to be standing with you. You'll be on your own. One person against VWA. Do you really think there're going to listen when you plead "But they said it wouldn't hurt the engine..." And again, this is re 118TSi. I'm happy to hear about the APR results on your GTi and Polo. I wouldn't be considering one otherwise.

[obiwan]

So can't you just get APR to do the servicing anyway? Or don't they do that. If they did the mods, I think I'd get them to do the servicing.

[Corey_R]

Fair enough - but I'd just point out that so far we haven't had a single person with a failure who does have the APR mod in a 118TSI. It's only people with the factory tunes. Sure, there are far more people with factory tunes, but there have also been a fair few people get the APR one already.

[G-rig]

Re: Performance enhancement and warranty

Nothing stopping you going to an independent for servicing and you'll probably know who's working on your car and from experience you could get better service and prices anyway.

[Corey_R]

So can't you just get APR to do the servicing anyway? Or don't they do that. If they did the mods, I think I'd get them to do the servicing.

Sorry, I didn't see your post as you did it whilst I was typing mine.

I'm not sure whether Harding Performance in QLD do car servicing, but European Autotech in NSW do! So yes, you could get your APR work done AND your servicing done at the one place. For me the drive is a bit far to get my servicing done there too, so I've just gone to my local dealer which is very close to an office I can work from.

[G-rig]

I'm not sure whether Harding Performance in QLD do car servicing, but European Autotech in NSW do! So yes, you could get your APR work done AND your servicing done at the one place. For me the drive is a bit far to get my servicing done there too, so I've just gone to my local dealer which is very close to an office I can work from.

Mike Weber Prestige & Performance is just around the corner and does servicing on BMW, Audi & VW..

I go there for various work/services and no complaints whatsoever .

[265coupe]

Servicing and warranty repairs are 2 completely different things.

VWA would only authorise warranty repairs through their agent, ie authorised VW dealers/ workshops.

Nothing wrong getting your car serviced through an independant but come time for warranty repairs and it'll be your dealer you're lining up at. And no doubt they'll be having a good look at your service record. Remember, if they find an out (wrong oil, modded tune, missed service, non factory parts used) for a costly repair then they'll use it. Just good business to them. You may be friends but there is a bottom line. And already expressed by members in the trade right here. Profit, profit, profit!

[WhiteJames]

In fact, a VW service at a dealership in QLD even filled up my oil for free in my Golf GTI. I'd driven from Syd to Bris (checking my oil before leaving) and just as I was driving into Brisbane the oil light came on! The car only had 10k on the clock and so was obviously still in its 'using lots of oil' stage. I told the dealer principle I'm happy to pay for the oil, but he said that the employees enjoyed checking out the car too much to charge for the privilege!

Regardless of the mileage on my std unchipped MKV GTI, on longer trips to Jindabyne or Gold Coast, Queensland from Sydney - the GTI would use no oil or next to no oil the difference would be so marginal. That's checking the oil before leaving and on every fuel tank fill and prior to return. Last trip of 2,500km - 3,000 from Sydney to GC, Queensland which included day trips and mountain blast up Mt Tamborine in the Gold Coast Hinterland, didn't show any change on the oil dipstick.

Generally, for a variety of driving which inlcudes city start-stop, blast around the tight twisties and bit a suburban freeway, the std tuned MKV GTI that was gently run-in would use an average of 50ml/1,000km. Longer trips had this down to pretty much nothing.

Cheers

[G-rig]

Servicing and warranty repairs are 2 completely different things.

VWA would only authorise warranty repairs through their agent, ie authorised VW dealers/ workshops.

Nothing wrong getting your car serviced through an independant but come time for warranty repairs and it'll be your dealer you're lining up at. And no doubt they'll be having a good look at your service record. Remember, if they find an out (wrong oil, modded tune, missed service, non factory parts used) for a costly repair then they'll use it. Just good business to them. You may be friends but there is a bottom line. And already expressed by members in the trade right here. Profit, profit, profit!

That's true but they would have to prove the oil/work was at fault, and good independents would use the right oils.

It's still good to have a nice relationship with the dealer for warranty repairs/RATTLES in the first year or two but they aren't magical fairies doing a much better job.

[Corey_R]

Regardless of the mileage on my std unchipped MKV GTI, on longer trips to Jindabyne or Gold Coast, Queensland from Sydney - the GTI would use no oil or next to no oil the difference would be so marginal. That's checking the oil before leaving and on every fuel tank fill and prior to return. Last trip of 2,500km - 3,000 from Sydney to GC, Queensland which included day trips and mountain blast up Mt Tamborine in the Gold Coast Hinterland, didn't show any change on the oil dipstick.

Generally, for a variety of driving which inlcudes city start-stop, blast around the tight twisties and bit a suburban freeway, the std tuned MKV GTI that was gently run-in would use an average of 50ml/1,000km. Longer trips had this down to pretty much nothing.

Cheers

I know - and yet, I'd be able to find several posts on this forum which state the same experience that I had. So what was the point of your post exactly?

[WhiteJames]

The OEM ECU is generally tuned by Volkswagen for best mix of economy/power/reliability/drivability. Why mess with a good thing?

Cheers.
WJ

[obiwan]

Mike Weber Prestige & Performance is just around the corner and does servicing on BMW, Audi & VW..

I go there for various work/services and no complaints whatsoever .

They are literally just around the corner. I work in Coorparoo and drive past them everyday (not that I knew that's where they were till now). I could drop the car off and walk to work in 1 or 2 mins tops.

[Guy_H]

Does anyone know the actual failure rate of 118 twinchargers?

The best we can guess is there are possible 9,500 twincharger cars delivered in Australia (info from my friends at the dealers), and I have heard of 5 failures total (maybe its double or 5 times that), so that is approximately
.025% engine failure rate?

And also the type of failure too, seen several with the "piston failure", but don't know if this accounts for all the ones reported?

From what I understand, all these have been standard cars, not modified in anyway.

Our modified cars sample rate is much smaller, we only have less than 100 twinchargers modified & zero failure rate.

Oh, and if its any help, the MKV twincharger has had up to 11 software revisions from Volkswagen (you can check on Erwin with your chassis number - gotta pay unfortunately), so it seems that VW have been evolving the software for a few years now...

Anyway, if damage is proved to be caused by a tuner or aftermarket service or non factory device, the tuner has to stand beside the product & service - pretty simple & covered under consumer law.

Of course you as the consumer always has to make the decision based upon risk & benefit, for some people, modifying cars is a risk, so thankfully there are a lot of people who want "more" from their vehicle & this is why the tuning industry exists!

[Guy_H]

On Aftermarket servicing:

Here is what the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission had to say about car servicing and statutory warranties on new vehicles:

"A common concern for new car buyers is their right to have someone, other than the dealer, service the car without putting warranties at risk. Judging by the large number of calls received by the ACCC many buyers are uncertain.

To put the record straight, dealers cannot declare a warranty void if the buyer has the vehicle serviced by someone else. The buyer, however, has an obligation to ensure that the selected service centre employs qualified staff, that servicing matches manufacturer’s specifications and only genuine or appropriate quality parts are used. If the centre implies that it can perform genuine servicing but falls below expectations then the customer has rights and remedies against it regardless of staff qualifications.

Where a problem arises (other than in servicing) and it is covered by the warranty, the vehicle should be taken to the dealer for repair.

Under the Trade Practices Act dealers cannot limit their warranty obligations or claim the warranty is void if the vehicle is serviced by someone other than the dealer or its agent. The statutory warranty applies to new and second hand cars. A consumer expects a second hand car to run effectively without repairs although, depending on price and age, it may not be expected to last as long as, or perform to the same standard as a new car. The warranty does not apply to cars sold for spare parts or one bought at an auction. At auctions the seller’s only obligation is to give clear title with no legal restriction on ownership.

The Act prohibits anti-competitive exclusive dealing which can involve a business attaching conditions to the sale of goods thereby restricting the buyer’s freedom to choose who they deal with; in the case of a vehicle, who will service it. One particular type of exclusive dealing is third line forcing when the supply of a good is conditional on the purchaser acquiring other goods from a third party. In the motor trade an example would be the car dealer directing a customer to a particular finance company to raise the purchase price.

Third line forcing is unlawful.

A dealer may offer consumers “express” warranties as a way to attract sales by showing that they stand by their vehicles. Express warranties do not override statutory warranties in any way. They may be given on the basis of “money back, no questions asked” or there may be conditions attached such as regular servicing or time limits on claims. A consumer may void an express warranty if, for example, the car is fitted with non-genuine parts. This is something to check before purchase.

If a manufacturer, retailer or service provider chooses to give a voluntary express warranty then the law requires that they honor it.

The car industry is not the only part of commerce where there is some confusion about warranties and refunds. There is widespread misunderstanding by both buyers and sellers of the real nature of warranties and the difference between statutory and extended warranties.

The statutory warranties entitles the purchaser to seek a refund, compensation, repair or replacement if the goods are faulty, fail to do the job intended or do not match the sample shown or have hidden defects.

Some retailers encourage consumers to buy an extended warranty offering additional benefits for extra cost. Consumers should check that the protection offered is more than that available under the statutory warranty.

Remember you are not entitled to a refund if you change your mind or discover the product is cheaper elsewhere".

By Professor Allan Fels, (former) Chairman of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission.