118TSI - General Discussion

[The One]

How much slower is the 103TDI compared to the 118TSI? Would it be an obvious difference?

The 103TDI is actually faster than the 118TSI, factoring in when you get the check engine light on the 118tsi with no compression the 103TDI blows it away. No power on freeway is not fun.

[Tobes_WIR35]

Yeah if you ask the VW service guys, they know the score. They know which cars have problems and which generally don't. Most of them will say get the diesel, it will go for 300,000 generally without any major issues. Even better, get the 6 spd manual. But the 6 spd DSG is still a pretty reliable transmission generally speaking

[popcorn]

If you want the most reliable vw combination, it'd be a diesel like the 103TDI and a manual gearbox. If I were in the market to buy again, I'd stay away from the 118TSI just because of the horror stories. Great car if it works, but with the amount of people reporting issues, I'd stay safe and avoid it. Save a little extra for a GTI or get a 103TDI and an ECU tune.

[Tobes_WIR35]

I am starting to look around for possibilities for my new car when my lease runs out next year. I was thinking of a Tiguan 4x4 diesel manual, until I found out they don't sell manuals anymore!

[tigger73]

I am starting to look around for possibilities for my new car when my lease runs out next year. I was thinking of a Tiguan 4x4 diesel manual, until I found out they don't sell manuals anymore!

Tobes the 4x4 Tiguan has the DQ500 "wet" 7 speed DSG which is the same gearbox that is used in the Audi TT-RS and Transporter. It's been designed for the high performance and heavy duty applications with a max torque of 550Nm. This is pretty much bullet-proof and completely different box to the DQ200 "dry" 7 speed which is used in the lower power Golf and Polos.

Yes manual is a safer option if you're going to hang onto it long term. That's why you'd buy a Mk7 90TSI manual. Otherwise you just need to get on the new car merry-go-round and upgrade every 3 years before the warranty runs out.

[Tobes_WIR35]

Tobes the 4x4 Tiguan has the DQ500 "wet" 7 speed DSG which is the same gearbox that is used in the Audi TT-RS and Transporter. It's been designed for the high performance and heavy duty applications with a max torque of 550Nm. This is pretty much bullet-proof and completely different box to the DQ200 "dry" 7 speed which is used in the lower power Golf and Polos.

Yes manual is a safer option if you're going to hang onto it long term. That's why you'd buy a Mk7 90TSI manual. Otherwise you just need to get on the new car merry-go-round and upgrade every 3 years before the warranty runs out.

Yeah I'm aware of the DQ500, I was more keen on a manual just for driving experience really... Been driving auto/DSG now for about 7 years so just thought of a change... that being said I do like the DSG so it's not a huge loss

[Rawcpoppa]

Tobes the 4x4 Tiguan has the DQ500 "wet" 7 speed DSG which is the same gearbox that is used in the Audi TT-RS and Transporter. It's been designed for the high performance and heavy duty applications with a max torque of 550Nm. This is pretty much bullet-proof and completely different box to the DQ200 "dry" 7 speed which is used in the lower power Golf and Polos.

Yes manual is a safer option if you're going to hang onto it long term. That's why you'd buy a Mk7 90TSI manual. Otherwise you just need to get on the new car merry-go-round and upgrade every 3 years before the warranty runs out.

Would be interesting to find out why VW's implementation of the DQ200 was so bad. I suspect it's down to the suppliers/poor design as opposed to an inherent flaw in dry clutch DSGs. The one common thing amongst the other VAG group DSGs that work is that they aren't made by LUK.

[Tobes_WIR35]

I think the other DSG's are made in house or in a partnership with Borg Warner? DQ200 is bought in crates by VW I think. Probably the last time they'll do that for a while!

[tigger73]

From my basic understanding, the DQ200 generates too much heat which it can't dissipate properly and ends up cooking itself.

This is made worse by how much the gearbox "rides the clutch" in slow speed traffic. If you're caught doing a lot of crawling the DSG will slip the clutch to keep everything nice and smooth, however this generates a lot of heat. With the gearbox running "dry" with only a small amount of oil there's not so much fluid to transfer the heat. To make things worse, the electronics are mounted right nearby and this ends up getting cooked along with the gearbox itself.

[Tobes_WIR35]

Interesting... sounds plausible. Do the wet DSGs have any sort of external fluid cooler?

[tigger73]

I don't think so but there's a lot more fluid which helps with heat transfer. The "dry" clutch design is trying to save on expensive DSG oil to try and reduce costs... but this then has had an impact on life of the unit.

[Tobes_WIR35]

Perhaps the heat dissipation properties of the fluid is part of the reason why it's more expensive than top shelf scotch!

[tigger73]

Yes it's liquid gold!

[Rawcpoppa]

From my basic understanding, the DQ200 generates too much heat which it can't dissipate properly and ends up cooking itself.

This is made worse by how much the gearbox "rides the clutch" in slow speed traffic. If you're caught doing a lot of crawling the DSG will slip the clutch to keep everything nice and smooth, however this generates a lot of heat. With the gearbox running "dry" with only a small amount of oil there's not so much fluid to transfer the heat. To make things worse, the electronics are mounted right nearby and this ends up getting cooked along with the gearbox itself.

Shouldn't this be caught in testing? The damn thing has been in production since what? 2007? 2008? Ford uses a dry clutch DSG as well and I don't hear owners complaining of transmission control unit failures.

[Tobes_WIR35]

Shouldn't this be caught in testing? The damn thing has been in production since what? 2007? 2008? Ford uses a dry clutch DSG as well and I don't hear owners complaining of transmission control unit failures.

Ford Focus, Fiesta, EcoSport warranties extended over dual-clutch transmission shudder

I had a Ford Focus dual clutch auto in America last year, the thing lost all power on the freeway and came to a clunky halt half way between Santa Barbara and Monterey. I left it for a bit, restarted the car, engine light on, limped it for about 100 miles to the rental desk at Monterey Airport waiting for it to die completely at any time... Not a pleasant experience.