Question: How does air ride suspension go in terms of handling?

[Vr6_Dog]

I posted some pics of this R32 on air ride in the MkIV section recently. Looks great but can u still drive these things hard even when they are set to an average height.
So Air ride or airbags whatever you call it, exactly how good is it? Is it only intended for show cars and as gareth_oau said in my post, just for for pimps?



My post in MkIV section:

http://www.vwwatercooled.org.au/newforum/upload/showthread.php?t=9234&page=6

[DaveMack]

Think I've seen a post on here where some US tuners put Air Rides in a Chrysler 300C and took movies of before & after to show handling characteristics ... looked like a positive move on that car.

These are always good for a giggle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sxf-0hTot1g&feature=related

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=4xDx3An8apQ

Don't know what the thread was ... but "Search" is your friend.

Cheers,

Dave

[Spyda]

I have talked to the guy from cali customs in melbourne, he insists that the handling remains the same as standard due to the dampers or something being the same, the only difference is that u can sit the car on its tits.
Thats coming from him.
I would personaly thing that a sports car would loose its sports suspention when gaining the ability to touch the grownd with the sump.

[rayray086]

Interesting topic but one I think that won't go anywhere as they're not very popular yet on performance cars (in Australia anyway) so there will be a lot of misinformation thrown around. I think you would put money on air suspension if you wanted the luxury of being able to adjust your height without getting out of the car. I've never been in a car with air before so I can't contribute anything worth taken seriously, but I have read a few threads and articles that some air-ride systems are starting to rival those of conventional cupkits and coilovers in terms of handling performance. If anyone has the latest PVW (December issue), there's a red Mk2 Rallye fitted with air suspension, and the owner claims "it handles better than his previous set-up" (something along those lines). IIRC, he had the air system sitting on Koni struts.

IMO, it's the best way to achieve the perfect stance (pics posted by Alex definitely proves this ), and still be able to drive around your local car park.

One question while on this topic - is "air-suspension" the same as "hydraulics" that we see in pimpmobiles?

[Spyda]

One question while on this topic - is "air-suspension" the same as "hydraulics" that we see in pimpmobiles?

Nope. Hydraulics are more powerfull, reqire alot more power and more pumps. Its a totaly different set up and is much quicker and powerfull, designed to make the car bounce.
Air is just bags the fill with air to raise the car and then lower it, maby a bit of bounce if you can do it right but its alot more simple and inexpensive.

[No457 Snowy]

A couple of other things just to keep in mind as well, are that it's well documented a MK4 can only be lowered about 20 - 30mm from stock before handling is actually worse, due to the geometry in the VW suspension design.

The other thing is that more than 30mm is actually illegal according to the RTA and the follow-on from that is that your insurance is at risk, especially with something radical like an air system, which may cause an assessor to look a lot harder than he normally would if you are involved in an accident where "loss of control" is an issue.

Just food for thought.


Snowy.

[The_Hawk]

I have wondered about the insurance issues...

Since air bags can (and will) lower your car further, would the insurance company believe that you always drive at an appropriate height and were doing so in an accident?

I think that would be the big question I would ask before considering air ride. Afterall, when you park it, it will be on it's guts right??

[Lorenz]

Air bags do come in some cars standard (ie Nissan Cima's and imported Lexus/Toyota Cressida's) and do feel quite normal to drive on and handle fairly well for a boat!

It is possible to get them engineered if put into the car as long as it wont allow the car to be set to an illegal height. If you want your car to handle well, you would be alot better off with a set of decent coilovers, which alot of the time will allow you to lower the car to a similar height as the airbags could aswell. Would also be a cheaper option!

When you park the car, you can set it what ever height you like so it wont always be on its guts. IIRC, some of the old Citroens also came standard with airbags in the rear, and when you parked and turned the car off it would lower the ass end pretty damn low (looked kinda stupid but pimp!).

[balkanac]

I had a Soarer with factory airbag suspension and it handled nicely and was comfortable. I had a height controller in it and i could make it look like a 4WD or lower it almost like the car in the photo. It was pretty nice.
Airbags didn't last very long though, they were 15 years old at the time and they needed replacing. Toyota wanted $6500 to replace them!! I sold the car like that

[Jarred]

Most of the time when you park an air bagged car, you tend to let all the air out of the bags, to reduce wear and tear on the bags. and you have to drain the system every week i think too.defiantly doesn't have the capabilites to handle anywhere near as good as coils. the ony reason i'd get bags if I built and old school cruiser, ie and old falcon of something like that, cause they handle bad enough as it is, so you may as well look pimp while going slow...

[ScienceVR6]

but don't several sporting mercedes run air ride?

easy to make it handle better while on air, just use good dampers, and good sway bars. You might get more body roll, if the air ride is set up wrong, ie no anti return valves, but sway bars can fix that too.

[WABIT]

from what i have heard, air ride has improved dramatically

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3596317

check this out for good measure

wabit

[Shteifen]

just wondering how much the average airbag system costs, installed for say a mk3 golf vr6?

[WABIT]

about 3 to 5k mate

dom

[VR32]

It's not overly expensive round 2k it's getting the system engineered witch can be the nightmare, almost went down the path of an old skool merc and shoving it on airbags wwaaaaayyy before getting my r32
http://www.airide.com.au/
These guys are some of the best for airbags in australia, air struts are the way to go though no need to chop and change suspension just bolt straight in! Difference between hydraulic and air is just that; air suspension uses air to inflate bags raising the car whilst hydraulic uses fluid and alot of batteries.