Chipping (a nerds theory)

[chisler]

at the risk of sounding stupid and getting flamed, I would like to throw my chipping theory out in the air anyway.

when overclocking computer parts i.e CPU's, graphic cards, the extra power generates more heat, so you also have to invest in a better cooling system. Once you get the temperatures to acceptable levels everything is normally ok.
a really good cooling system, is particualy important when you attempt to overclock the latest, fastest, and most expensive computer parts.
but if you get a computer part which dosn't have the greatest speeds, overclocking is generally as simple as changing the settings to a higher speed, This is because computer manufacturers simply underclock the same product to target different market segments.

I was wondering if car manufacturers do the same thing?
alot of times when a car is released, a more powerful model of the same car is also released, normaly called a sports edition or something, which seems exactly the same, except it has fancey seats, spoilers, rims, and more power.

do you think car manufactuers just change fuel delivery, turbo, injection timing settings, to meet different market segments?
can buying the lower model car and then chipping/rempapping it to the higher model be a simple care free affair? and end up being exactly the same as the higher model?

just to note, I've already brought the higher model of my particular car, so too late for me if true

and just incase its not true, I'll finish with a funny little emote

[h100vw]

at the risk of sounding stupid and getting flamed, I would like to throw my chipping theory out in the air anyway.


I was wondering if car manufacturers do the same thing?
alot of times when a car is released, a more powerful model of the same car is also released, normaly called a sports edition or something, which seems exactly the same, except it has fancey seats, spoilers, rims, and more power.

do you think car manufactuers just change fuel delivery, turbo, injection timing settings, to meet different market segments?
can buying the lower model car and then chipping/rempapping it to the higher model be a simple care free affair? and end up being exactly the same as the higher model?

One car that I can think of, that has been software restricted, in the sense you are talking about is the Mini One, which can be upgraded to Cooper power with software alone. The rest of the car doesn't look like a Cooper obviously.

Some Mk4s Golfs in Europe came with a K03s turbo and 150hp, they could be chipped to produced the same power as a chipped 180hp base car.

Power and trim levels are set to fill market positions as you suggest. Standard issue equipment varies with the market, G60 GTIs for example came without electric windows in Germany where 16V GTIs in the UK all had them.

Sunroofs are another example of an extra in some markets and standard equipment in others.

Gavin

[RhysQ]

take the Polo GTI and Polo GTI Cup Edition. One has 150bhp (GTI) and the other 180bhp (GTI Cup Edition), just with a simple remap. That involves upping the boost and fuel delivery etc.

[Revo Kev]

They do this a lot, gives them more scope with the product lifecyle and allows them to 'fit' in models where they want them.

Golf MkIV DBW VVT 150 and 180 engines were identical, the software was the only difference in regards to power output... there were other differences though; 5 - 6speed boxes etc, etc.

Newer 2.0ltfsi K04 cars: the S3, Cupra, TTS, Edition30/PirreliEd all have the same spec engines but with differing factory power outputs.

In the UK SEAT weren't allowed to sell the Leon Cupra4 as it would have had too much effect on the S3/A3 quattro sales.

However you've then got the other side of it; the MKV Gti is a higher compression smaller turbo engine to the MKV Gti Edition30 (injectors are also different!).

Overall you typically find the cars are tuned to fit in their intended 'marketing' slot within the group and there is more potential (even from the factory) in them!

[anarchycamp]

Another point with this is that manufacturers have to allow for the fact that fuel is of different qualities throughout the world and find a balance between performance, fuel consumption and engine wear.

[mikepologti]

one website can answer all of this. this website covers computers, automotive and just about anything with pcb in it (ie just about everything)

https://www.hackaday.com

[KTL]

one website can answer all of this. this website covers computers, automotive and just about anything with pcb in it (ie just about everything)

www.hackaday.com

nice, I really enjoyed reading this site.

[Big Yellow]

the new tiguan is an example of this - the two PETROL turbo models. one has 125kw and the other 147kw even though they have the same turbo, same block, same everything engine wise.

[gavs]

Another local example is the Alfa Romeo Brera. It's V6 engine is identical to the Holden HFv6 engine but it's piston stroke is reduced to give it a higher redline and it's (i think) 3.2L capacity.

On of the guy's in my office was one of the powertrain engineers at Holden during the development of this engine and just before he left, they were getting figures around the 290kW mark, naturally aspirated and with stock internals with good reliability figures. This was a 60kW increase on software alone, the other 40kW came from a freer breathing head design they bolted on.

Remember that car manufacturers are working on the cars right now that will reach the market in 5yrs time, so with the same engine internals etc, would the consumer be happy with the same power as 5 yrs ago?? Look at HSV and that LS1 engine and how it started life at 250kW and finished at 300kW on software alone.....

[Pullstarter]

the new tiguan is an example of this - the two PETROL turbo models. one has 125kw and the other 147kw even though they have the same turbo, same block, same everything engine wise.

They can both be chipped by APR to 190kw too, 125 is a bargain

[adzy]

From what I have found over the years, when we see a diferent model come out with 10 - 30 more kw than it's predecessor, the gains are acheived most of the time by comprehensive hardware upgrades to the engine and rarely just 'software' updates alone.
For example; look at the F6 Typhoon vs the XR6T or the GTI vs the Pirelli. You could easily acheive the higher numbers of torque and power with tuning and extra psi, though the manafacturers will upgrade rods, compressor and turbine housing A/R ratios, valve springs etc. as the engine must still be reliable over the long term.
However I have (rarely) seen the opposite, mainly with models which make more power over seas and they are then suffocated for our market mainly due to our emmisions laws. In this case the simple software update releasses the cork from the cars backside with no hardware needed in order to maintain reliability.

[gldgti]

Another local example is the Alfa Romeo Brera. It's V6 engine is identical to the Holden HFv6 engine but it's piston stroke is reduced to give it a higher redline and it's (i think) 3.2L capacity.

On of the guy's in my office was one of the powertrain engineers at Holden during the development of this engine and just before he left, they were getting figures around the 290kW mark, naturally aspirated and with stock internals with good reliability figures. This was a 60kW increase on software alone, the other 40kW came from a freer breathing head design they bolted on.

Remember that car manufacturers are working on the cars right now that will reach the market in 5yrs time, so with the same engine internals etc, would the consumer be happy with the same power as 5 yrs ago?? Look at HSV and that LS1 engine and how it started life at 250kW and finished at 300kW on software alone.....

just a point of interest - the LS1 started at 220kw and finished at 270kw. the LS1 in the GTS 300 has different heads, cams, valves, pistons and runs a MAF-less tune.

[adzy]

just a point of interest - the LS1 started at 220kw and finished at 270kw. the LS1 in the GTS 300 has different heads, cams, valves, pistons and runs a MAF-less tune.

Exactly