Another DSG failure

[gregozedobe]

Sorry DSG enthusiasts, I believe in the old adage about smoke and fire.

It must be so annoying reading so many reports by actual DSG owners about the issues they are having with their gearboxes. If they would just shut up everyone could just cruise along believing all DSGs are perfect.

And why aren't the manual gearbox owners writing dozens of posts about all the problems thay are having with their equally unreliable manual gearboxes ? It makes the DSGs look so bad by comparison, it is just so unfair.

And soon after the widespread "Urgent Safety Recall" (faulty sensors and/or software) for DSG equipped VWs ands Audis it seems DSGs are so good VW in America have just announced a special 10 year/100,000 mile warranty for DSGs in "some" VWs.

This time there is a problem with some bush wearing out which can lead to jerky gear changes. They are developing a special diagnostic tool and a repair kit for those cars that need the fix.

http://www.golfmkv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=109203

[dazag]

I haven't heard anything bad about the Manual boxes, other then the people who "flash the ECU" for more performance end up having to do some "clutch" repairs, but then again i wouldn't imagine these drivers taking it easy either.

I've given the DSG a good work out so far and hasnt missed a beat, and i bet you that the Wheels magazine guys haven't been soft on their long term test car either. Still havent heard any "facts" if it was a clutch failure or a gearbox failure and what was the cause of it?? what model was it again, and it's build spec??

Yeah I agree on transmission places not knowing much about the later high spec type transmissions - no Transmission place was willing to go anywhere near my Mercedes Vito Auto Trans when it went into Limp mode for no obvious reason - which ended up being a water contaminated plug that corroded over time. The electronic control on these new generation transmissions scares the normal trans business enough not to touch them in most cases. but i am generalising there......

[backdoc]

I had a v5 r32 with dsg box and hammered the sh*t out of it and it didn't skip a beat for 30000km.

Just ordered a rs wagon with dsg and I can't wait. It's a great transmission, but like any high end mechanical items there is always going to be more chance of something going wrong, but so what. If it is it'll happen under warranty.

And don't worry all you owners of manual boxes, please don't feel sorry for us as we will be quietly enjoying our superior accleration and fuel economy

[gregozedobe]

...... Still havent heard any "facts" if it was a clutch failure or a gearbox failure and what was the cause of it?? what model was it again, and it's build spec??

Accoding to the Jan 2010 issue of Wheels: " Questions were asked about the cause of the failure but the only detail proffered was that it was due to the premature wear of a bearing on the transmission output shaft. The lack of specifics leaves many questions unanswered." That sounds like the worn bush problem I mentioned in my earlier post. In the same mag it says they got their FL Octy wagon in June 2009 and it has a 7 speed DSG.

And don't worry all you owners of manual boxes, please don't feel sorry for us as we will be quietly enjoying our superior accleration and fuel economy

So I guess your particular example didn't suffer from the significant delay in moving off from a stop that I noticed in 3 of the 4 different DSG equipped cars I've driven ? The Golf Pirelli was particularly noticeable, you'd take your foot off the brake, press the accelerator, then after about 1/2 second or so the car would start to move (and a bit slowly at first). I found it quite disconcerting, and quite at odds with the speed of gearchanges etc once you were on the move.

I prefer to be totally in charge of the clutch and gearchange activities, I find my driving more satisfying that way. However, I have no problem with other people preferring autos or computer controlled manuals, just so long as they don't insist that I have to follow their taste in gearboxes. If I drove in lots of heavy traffic on a regular basis I would probably have bought a DSG myself.

Well, if you are going to make that sort of claim, have you done any proper calculations to figure out how long it will take for your "improved" fuel consumption to pay for the extra cost of the DSG ? I imagine it will be quite some time before you are actually ahead in $$$ terms.

[backdoc]

I'm fortunate enough to be able to drive a variety of sports cars from time to time on the track so don't get too worried. I still get to enjoy manuals as well as sequential shift and of course the twin clutch jobbies. But my only interest is speed and efficiency. Giving myself the warm inner glow of making such claims about the satisfaction of changing gears manually unfortunately comes second

[gregozedobe]

I'm fortunate enough to be able to drive a variety of sports cars from time to time on the track so don't get too worried. I still get to enjoy manuals as well as sequential shift and of course the twin clutch jobbies. But my only interest is speed and efficiency. Giving myself the warm inner glow of making such claims about the satisfaction of changing gears manually unfortunately comes second

Hey, what you prefer is what I prefer and what I prefer is what I prefer It would be a boring old world if everyone liked exactly the same thing (although I did notice you have ordered an RS wagon - nice choice )

Just out of interest, how much have you driven a DSG Octy on the track (actual racing, not driver training or PR days) ? Did the DSG gearchanges add that much to the track driving experience (or subtract that much from your times) ?

I don't drive on the track at all, and I find for most of my driving I mostly change gears relatively slowly anyway, the drive is smoother that way.

I hope you aren't relying too much on VAG's "official" fuel consumption figures, as they seem to vary a lot (maybe according to which copywriter was on duty that week ? )

[K1W1]

And don't worry all you owners of manual boxes, please don't feel sorry for us as we will be quietly enjoying our superior accleration and fuel economy

That statement confuses me.
Every piece of Skoda literature I can find where there is a manual vehicle and an the same vehicle with a DSG shows the manual as having a slightly higher top speed and a marginally better fuel economy. Are you saying that in the real world the roles are reversed?

[dazag]

That statement confuses me.
Every piece of Skoda literature I can find where there is a manual vehicle and an the same vehicle with a DSG shows the manual as having a slightly higher top speed and a marginally better fuel economy. Are you saying that in the real world the roles are reversed?

Ha ha ha, and i could start the petrol/diesel debate by saying, "you petrol owners enjoy your exhaust note, I'll enjoy my better economy and superior towing torque" ha ha ha
It does sound like a **** throwing fight in here doesn't it. ha ha ha everyone wanting to protect their reason for buying a certain configured Skoda.

Diesel Skoda's would be better fitted with the DSG ( due to the short RPM range, meaning a lot more gear changes compared to the petrol variant - especially in traffic)
Petrol Skoda's can have either (due to the broader RPM range) but I would say more fun with a manual and apparently more economical with the manual fitted.

Mmm time to go for a quick drive and get some more video footage to finish off this video clip I started.............

[backdoc]

That statement confuses me.
Every piece of Skoda literature I can find where there is a manual vehicle and an the same vehicle with a DSG shows the manual as having a slightly higher top speed and a marginally better fuel economy. Are you saying that in the real world the roles are reversed?

Incorrect of me.........again

I've dug myself a big enough hole already. Accleration is better and that's all.

I don't plan on driving this car on a track and I think that is why there is more appeal with the dsg box for commuting around town.

But hey, Im not suggesting the dsg box is the must have item. I think it's great, but I understand that alot of people will always prefer the manual.

I just don't get why some people feel the need to lay into the dsg box. They don't own one and all they're going on is heresay and a couple of examples of broken tranny's. So what! Doesn't mean it's inherently flawed. There are thousands of these things out there so some are bound to fail.

If double clutch gearboxes weren't the way forward then why is Ferrari realeasing the 458 Italia without even a manual option?

[Golf Houso]

Why not just buy a car new, get an extended warranty on it and sell it with 6-8 months of the new car warranty on it

[gregozedobe]

I just don't get why some people feel the need to lay into the dsg box. They don't own one and all they're going on is heresay and a couple of examples of broken tranny's. So what! Doesn't mean it's inherently flawed. There are thousands of these things out there so some are bound to fail.

I don't always "lay into the DSG box", but I do feel the need to provide a bit of balance when some people constantly claim they are superior in every way to a manual box and refuse to acknowledge that some DSGs do have their problems.

There is no doubt in my mind that VAG DSGs are significantly less reliable than the VAG manual equivalent gearbox - that is why there are so many different owners starting threads in this forum discussing DSG 'issues'. And it isn't just "a couple of examples" eg just how many mechatronics have been replaced for forum members ? And then there are the various recalls/campaigns that VAG has initiated on sensors, bushes and software bugs. I don't see anything like this for manual gearboxes.

If we all had to own a particular variant/model before we were allowed to comment or mention things we have experienced or read then everyone would have to restrict their comments rather a lot. In this case you wouldn't be allowed to say anything in this thread either, as you don't own a DSG equipped Skoda (yet)

If double clutch gearboxes weren't the way forward then why is Ferrari realeasing the 458 Italia without even a manual option?

A cynic could suggest that profit could be a significant factor - it allows Ferrari to charge even more for every single one they sell.

But if we are going to introduce non-VAG double clutch gearboxes into the discussion I could ask if you are aware that Nissan is refusing warranty claims on the box of the new GTR if the owner is foolhardy enough to actually use the Launch Control feature too many times ?


Anyway, I hope you enjoy your new Octy when you get it, and that you have zero problems with it (gearbox or otherwise). Mine is great, and I've had no manufacturing issues at all so far (touch wood) Are you getting a TSI or TDI ?

[backdoc]

TSI. And dsg technology as been around as a mainstream product for less than a decade versus the refinement of the manual box for the last century. I'm certainly not suprised that there are many more problems with the dsg box. I think if anyone purchased a new car expecting zero problems is likely to be left disappointed. I just hope I don't get stranded with a dud tranny

Oh and I don't think the Ferrari decision is cost motivated. I believe it was either with the California or 430 (sorry can't recall) the manual option had a less than 3% take up, hence their decision to drop it.