DSG woes in The Age

[Diesel_vert]

On the face of it, it would appear there is very little to link this particular incident with the issues experienced by owners of vehicles equipped with a DSG.

However, notwithstanding how the article was written, it wouldn't be fair to say that it diminishes the experiences people have had with their vehicles, because there have just been too many posts and instances on this forum (let alone worldwide) to dismiss the DSG issue as insignificant.

[RoknRob]

Re: DSG woes in The Age

I am delighted that Fairfax are willing to publish an article, which is so critical of one of their advertisers. I have a 2008 Passat with a rubbish DSG.

If you read the comments in the article, you will see that many people have had near misses in their VWs. I have concerns about safety but I am frustrated by VW selling a crap DSG gearbox and then ignoring their customers.

I hope this article will push them towards fixing the faulty DSGs. Ideally, a Government body would investigate and force them to.

I will be dumping my VW as soon as I get my DSG issue resolved.

Hear, hear.

Regardless of the quality of reporting, the fact that it was front page news, and the sheer number of comments... I doubt VAG can ignore it. This appears to be a big PR disaster.

For the record, I am over 40, a family man, drive sensibly, and, sadly, prefer NOT to have my kids in my car, because I too have had "false neutrals" with complete loss of power. In two separate cars, I might add.

[spikeyboy22]

We have a update people news just in...

Government orders probe on VW 'faults'

[JonP01]

Well so far, I've seen 2 useful comments in this thread....

My point? Don't comment on sh*t you don't know about...

I can't speak for others, but in my opinion, the manner in which you conduct yourself on these forums is unbefitting of any member, let alone one with super moderator status.

[cappuccino]

I have a Polo 77TSI 7SPD DSG 2012.5 (manufactured Aug 2012) and within the first 3000km I had two cases where limp mode kicked in at the lights but not while at speed. error codes was misfirein cyl 4.

VW Denlo Parramatta did a software update TPI 2031645/3 and I have since not had any issues, currently at 7,500km
I'm actually having my 7,500km health check 1st june at 8.30am, i'm going to bring this news up with them, not sure what to say, any ideas?
I'd like to know what this software update actually does?

Apart from getting rid of the car, which i'm not considering, realistically, not viable option financially and not enough information is out about what is going on. People have died in Totoya, Honda etc faults and all of the sorts, just sadly the risk of driving. Frankly, its because of the computers, which is in all cars these days, unless I get a 1990's car with all mechical controls i dont see how you can avoid. i upgraded from such a car and just as likely to die from the lack of modern crash equipment, im sure it would be a zero encap rated car today!

id like to hear from non VW mechanics who can explain technically what the issue is and the cause rather than consumer reports. I feel understanding an issue provides logical ways to deal with it and make decisions.

other than that, the drive has been perfect, no issues with DSG or anything else, im just hoping the software update has resolved the issued permanently, which is why id like to know what causes the limp mode and what the update does.

as a programmer, my thinking is:
1) the software was written to put car into limp mode on any detection of a misfire (2 misfires in my case)
2) misfires happen in engines all the time as normal functioning, you cant get 100% denotation 100% of the time, unless it is misfiring on every cycle. one or two misfire out of a million denotations is not a problem (from what i read)... btw, my old non computerized car, you can tell when there was a misfire or knock back, drove fine, but not pesky computer to force limp mode.
3) the software update increases the amount of misfires that can occur in a row before going into limp mode, more tolerance in other words

pure speculation, but would like insider knowledge? there must be a mechanic somewhere who has an idea

on ipad forgive the typos btw

[pologti18t]

W I was accelerating when I lost everything, all drive, all gears, all brakes except the handbrake which in the 3-4 seconds of nothing, I didn't reach for. Now before any of you get on your high horses about 'I would have slowly applied the handbrake...' W

Why did you lose brakes if the engine was still running?

[JonP01]

which is why id like to know what causes the limp mode and what the update does.

I am curious about what conditions need to be met as well. The only time I have experienced a misfire was when my car was fairly new, but I suspected I had a dodgy batch of fuel. I waited till the tank was near empty and then started filling it at a Caltex that was newly built and had heavy through traffic (as opposed to the very old BP recommended by the dealer and which does not get anything remotely approaching the customer levels that my Caltex does). Since then (8 months now) I haven't had any issues.

[Transporter]

Why did you lose brakes if the engine was still running?

He didn't lose them completely just vacuum booster after several pushes of the brake pedal. I wonder how people manage when they get the puncture at the front wheel, I remember once, I almost lost control while driving my T5 when I punctured front tyre and all air came out suddenly, almost wiped off the bus stop full of people waiting there. The puncture is more common than the DSG fault or injector fault, now what, what we should do about it?

What I'm saying is that the car can stop suddenly or the driver can lose control when many things fail, sure the recalls can help, but it will not void the next component failure or the tyre puncture from happening. As long as you drive the car or walk across the street there is always risk involved.

[nomadx38]

I have had the false neutral twice when I first got the car (but none since the update was put on at 22,000km - im now at 50,000km) and in all it wasn't that bad.

Like anything you need to be prepared to deal with a situation. All it does is give no drive which is like taking your foot of the pedal, quite manageable. The misfire and subsequent disabling of cylinder 1 was more nerve racking because I was going up a hill and trying to drag a 1 ton car vibrating like hell up a 45 degree incline at reduced power is not fun...BUT there is a big difference between what's happening here.

The limp home mode (yellow lights) only appears for engine faults NOT gearbox faults which shows how crap the article is. By the sounds of it VW have a problem with the DSG, coilpacks/ignition cables and injectors - all of which are different problems not just DSG related.

having a blowout on a trailer or even a car is far worse than loosing forward momentum that's for sure so in all I'm "less" concerned...

And Gavs case was different again - something I'm sure most DSG technicians haven't seen before. Most DSG faults result in neutral been engaged (clutches released) and you slow down...but Gavs was different. One of his clutches was jammed ON, very strange and yes I would say that would be quite scary becuase your trying to brake and its constantly pulling!!!

[gavs]

DSG woes in The Age

I can't speak for others, but in my opinion, the manner in which you conduct yourself on these forums is unbefitting of any member, let alone one with super moderator status.

Well that's your opinion. In my opinion, people who don't know what they're talking about shouldn't get on their high horse making comments that they don't understand. As I said, I have experienced this first hand so I believe that unlike the 95% of people here making comment about the situation, I can make a fairly accurate comment of the situation.

You have a manual 77tsi, the second least error riddled of the models. You don't new to worry about oil consumption, fried pistons, dodgy clutches, bogus mechatronics, rooted timing chains etc. you are lucky in my opinion, you didn't just see your partner drive off down the street as I just did, worrying if she will actually make it back, that in the 5km to the shops, if the gearbox will just die again. As RoknRob said, I too actually avoid taking anyone in my car now, I don't want to take the risk of them coming to harm. It is that serious an that much of an emotional decision for me, so I am sorry if you found offense in what I said, but emotion is what makes us human, the caring for each other so as not to put each other in harms way and unfortunately I am at the point that any time someone other than myself gets into that car in my driveway, I worry about their safety. This is exactly why I have contacted the department of transport and infrastructure in Canberra and was willing to go to court on my own to fix this wrong.

People seem to be forgetting 2 major factors here, regardless of their own opinions.

1) those of us who have had to deal with VGA at a higher than dealership level all have the same experiences, they treat their customers and the general public like fools and second class people. They would rather just run and hide in their offices than actually return a phone call or email.

2) a woman died. You all seem to be forgetting that.

Pologti18, I even lost the radio, I remember because the night before I had bought a new misfits cd after it was consumed by a 13 month old as a toy! All I can guess is that the OBD and ecu went into melt down for that 3-4 seconds trying to work out what the hell to do, then it all suddenly worked again with a buzz to the redline... The car stuttered and shook then, well the rest is history...

[Golf7]

Just wanted to say one thing... Through my 2 cents... I am so appalled at the fact that the DSG transmissions are not performing as well as they should and I must say that soooo many people can't possibly be wrong about them. However, there are lemons everywhere and the article was written about a lady who was driving to Adelaide when suddenly the engine did not produce enough power to keep the car rolling at 110km/h. It was so overly dramatised, such poor journalism... I got a statement last night sent to all journalists regarding the Fairfax ordeal. Explained everything quite well. You can find it below. However, once again I must stress my disappointment in VW and their Australian counterparts for producing vehicles which may potentially be defective and then moreover not doing anything about the issues with their cars. I would be fuming if I had a Mk.5 Golf with a DSG that needed to be replaced for close to 5 grand.

It was an issue at the point of boiling over and Fairfax just decided to let loose... They don't have a good relationship with VWA...

Volkswagen Group Australia Response to Fairfax

The coronial inquest regarding the death of Ms. Ryan is still ongoing, we will not comment on the investigation, except to say that we are cooperating fully and the assertion by Fairfax that Ms Ryan’s death appears to have been caused by sudden deceleration is incorrect. There has been no finding of this nature by the Coroner.

There is also no correlation between the inquest, and the customer reports presented in the media regarding issues with diesel engines and DSG transmissions.

The vehicle at the centre of the inquest is equipped with a petrol engine and a manual transmission. Neither of the customer's interviewed for the story has a vehicle fitted with a DSG transmission either.

[alexaescht]

DSG woes in The Age

All I can say after hearing Gav's and other member's stories, is I'm really lucky that my sister hates car shopping – if she was there when mum and I chose the car she would have pleaded for a DSG Polo, but mum really wanted her to be able to drive a manual so that's what we got.

She drives almost 200 km a day to Bundoora for university and to Melbourne for her choir, all on busy freeways – be it the Monash or Eastlink. Knowing that it is highly unlikely that anything will go wrong with the gearbox or engine makes us feel safe every time she drives somewhere. The car has now clocked over 67,000 kms and nothing has gone wrong. Nothing.

We bought the Megane so that I can learn in it and when I turn 18 it will be passed over to me. Originally we were going for the Diesel (dCi), but after driving it, the DSG (or EDC in Renault speak) didn't feel right and mum really hated the way it drove. Renault Australia don't offer a manual gearbox with the dCi engine for some reason, so we had to opt for a petrol and our local dealership happened to have a manual Sport Edition, so we bought that.
While no one is certain of the failure rates of Renault's Getrag EDC, I now feel a hell of a lot safer knowing I will be driving a plain and simple, but more fun, manual.

[Golf7]

Exactly!!!

And if you run into the back of a vechicle, it's your fault, there is no defence, hence truck driver is likely to be at fault

I've been on the motorway and had a sudden tyre blow out
I just pressed the hazard button and coasted to a stop
I was busy controlling the car and watching the traffic behind me
but I was not overly concerned

These comments are just emotive and sensational reporting

You sir have hit the nail on the head! I feel disgusted by their lack of understanding, professionalism...

[GippsCC]

I must admit I scratch my head over the sudden "crisis" reporting on VW cars...

All I can say is that I owned a MkV TDI Golf with a six speed DSG, which I drove for seven years, and I never had any problem (well I did have the engine conk out once, when I let my fuel run *way* too low - the red fuel light having been on quite a while, which required a tow to the dealer to reset the engine management unit but that's pretty much my own fault!).

From my read of things, there seems to have been an issue with the seven speed DSG gearboxes at some point, but it didn't stop me buying another VW (a CC).

I did find it strange though, in one of the media reports, some guy saying how he though his Volkswagen was a "death trap" and yet it was clear he was still driving it. If I came to such a conclusion, that's the last thing I'd do - surely you'd sell your car quick smart and never go VW again! If you felt your life was on the line every time you drove your VW, the last thing you'd do is get back into it - I wouldn't.

I'm inclined to consider the current bru-ha-ha as a bit of a beat-up, especially as has been pointed out Newtonian physics does require a fade of speed rather than an immediate halt should a car travelling at 100kms or thereabouts lose propulsion from the engine (so unless you are sitting right on someone's bumper, or aren't observing the road, any car slowing down - brake lights or no brake lights - can be observed and avoided).

[Umai Naa!!]

I wonder that as well.

Especially when you occasionally see the odd car with all sorts of slander against the manufacturer crudely written across the back of them.