T5 Soft discs

[BrianJ]

I have done 60,000km in my kombi beach and told today by service person that the front brake pads have only 2mm left, and the discs are worn down and cannot be machined as they would be too close to tolerance. This entails a replacement of brake pads and discs at a meer cost of $AU1000, and I assume the back ones would soon follow.

This could keep you broke just in brake replacement alone.

Anyone else have any ideas on this situation.

Brian

[GUV]

Bendix

Use the Bendix DB1404 GCT in the future, they don't eat your brake rotors & don't dust your wheels. They cost about $105 trade price through Repco.
I cannot pick any difference in braking quality.
The only problem is that they don't make them for the rear.

GUV

[Tornado T5]

As a comparison, my pads were all replaced at the 45,000km service (12/11/08, discs were OK and machined. At the 60,000km service 2 months ago (19/6/09) pads are between 8-9mm and discs still OK.

[brad]

I'm surprised you got that many km out of them. You must be light on brakes.

If you are in SE QLD then maybe contact Jmac from this forum. He should be able to give you a price using OEM equivalent parts that will probably last longer.

You might also try one of the VW parts importers like Imparts (they do ATE components) or even think about buying of one of the UK, European or USA suppliers while the dollar is strong.

Traditionally, most of the German marques run soft discs and they require replacement every 2nd set of brake pads. I've had pretty good results using DBA disc rotors (but they might not have a replacement disc for your model).

Same with the friction material, aftermarket will probably give better results but may have some minor negative side affects like poor cold braking (maybe).

[Transporter]

Check the ridge (lip) at the top of the disc. If it is less than 1mm you should be all right and a new set of brake pads should do the trick. Of course if the dealer decide to machine them they need to be checked if they’re thick enough after machining (min th. 25.5mm). Machining is not necessary if they don’t have excessive run out (you would know that – the brake pedal would be pulsating under heavy braking when traveling downhill).

60,000km is very good, mine lasted a bit less and front rotors were still serviceable so I decided to replace them next time I need new brake pads.

You can buy brake discs cheaper, check the sticky

[brad]

Check the ridge (lip) at the top of the disc. If it is less than 1mm you should be all right and a new set of brake pads should do the trick. Of course if the dealer decide to machine them they need to be checked if they’re thick enough after machining (min th. 25.5mm). Machining is not necessary if they don’t have excessive run out (you would know that – the brake pedal would be pulsating under heavy braking when traveling downhill).

I've done that a few times too. I usually get the bastard file out & file the lip off. It's also better if you fit a soft pad, except usually soft pads can't take the heat & also wear out a bit quicker - you have to analyse the driving style. It works for me because I'm not hard on brakes.

Also, the disc rotor is like a heatsink. The more metal that is machined off, the less heat it can absorb & the brakes become less efficient & more liekly to warp or get hotspots (which also cause shudder).

Just looked at your sticky - DBA do make replacement rotors - they'd be my pick straight away, either in the street series or the 4000 range (both in plain finish). If you can get Ferodo TS/DS2000 pads to go with it

edit: at a guess, you should be able to get front rotors & pads for about $600 installed.

[Transporter]

Also, the disc rotor is like a heatsink. The more metal that is machined off, the less heat it can absorb & the brakes become less efficient & more liekly to warp or get hotspots (which also cause shudder).

Just looked at your sticky - DBA do make replacement rotors - they'd be my pick straight away, either in the street series or the 4000 range (both in plain finish). If you can get Ferodo TS/DS2000 pads to go with it

edit: at a guess, you should be able to get front rotors & pads for about $600 installed.

And for that reason I don't machine the rotors, always replace them

This morning I've ordered slotted rotors from DBA for my T5, since I refuse to wash my rims every 4-5 days. Now I have to find suitable pads and no more dust.

[brad]

And for that reason I don't machine the rotors, always replace them

This morning I've ordered slotted rotors from DBA for my T5, since I refuse to wash my rims every 4-5 days. Now I have to find suitable pads and no more dust.

I fond the ferodos are usually dusty. So are the Bendix Ultimate (and they aren't good pads either). Hawk Ceramics?

Get your rims powdercoated in a dark grey - then you won't notice the dust.

[gregozedobe]

Anyone else have any ideas on this situation.

If you don't totally trust your service person it may be worth finding out what the original specs are and the wear limits and doing a bit of measuring yourself. It isn't unkown for some places to be very "conservative" and suggest replacement of brake parts when it isn't really required yet.

Most people are (rightly) concerned that their brakes are in tip top condition at all times, so are quite easily persuaded to have expensive work done on their brakes much sooner than is really needed.

Not saying that is the case in this instance, but it has been known to happen

My Transporter has done 50,000Km so far, and on current wear rates may get to 150,000 or more before needing any brake work. Yes, I am very light on brakes as I do nearly all highway work, so the brakes don't get used much at all.

[Transporter]

BrianJ,
I forgot to ask, if your brake warning light came "on"?
If not just wait for the warning light to come on (you will hear the buzzer sound as well). When my indicator came on I've done another 20,000km until I heard metal-to-metal noise while braking which was nothing than top ridge that never touches the friction material of the pad coming into the contact with the rotor.
The brake pads wear out indicator is in the brake pad’s friction material (only on one side on each axle) and will always come on when you have much more than 2mm remaining, so maybe that mechanic who checked your brakes made a mistake.
If you want to turn that warning light “off” you need VCDS (Vag-com) or cut the wire as close to the brake pad and join the two wires together, to form contact again. However I don’t recommend doing it since you have to make sure that you have more than 2mm of the friction material remaining on each brake pad in all 4 wheels

[BrianJ]

Thanks for the repsonses everyone, and to Transporter, no the warnings has not come on, and what he was saying is that there is 2mm left before the sensor is reached, in fact there is probably about 10mm of material left!

My response to them was that I will run them for another 15,000km and decide at the next service interval, as the sensor is in the pad it will be replaced if it wears. From what I hear I may be able to get a lot out of them yet, and also I don't think the lip on the disc is anywhere near 1mm yet, so I will wait a while yet.

Brian

[Transporter]

in fact there is probably about 10mm of material left!

Brian

Good enough for another 50,000km than, you must be very gentle on brakes.

[brad]

If you don't totally trust your service person it may be worth finding out what the original specs are and the wear limits and doing a bit of measuring yourself. It isn't unkown for some places to be very "conservative" and suggest replacement of brake parts when it isn't really required yet.

It gets a bit hard to "do the right thing" sometimes. Generally, most customers don't want to make a special trip back to get there brakes done between services, so they get them done early. It doesn't help that there used to be some tech advice out there that considered that pads should be replaced once the friction material was less than the thickness of the backing plate. That was the policy at BMW in the '80s as they were one of the first mfrs to go onto variable/long services & you weren't seeing the cars every 3-6 months like other marques.

Brake usage between customers varies enormously. I've seen identical brake setups where driver1 goes through 4 sets of pads for 1 set on driver 2s car so it becomes a bit of a guessing game as to how many kilometres they might get out of the pads. Telling someone a definitive measurement such as 75% worn or have 3mm left out of 10mm invariably gets the reply "How many kilometres is that?" and you have to make a guesstimate again. If you tell them 10,000km & they go metal-metal at 9,000km then you are the worst bastard in the world - never mind the fact theat they neglected to tell you that they have just bought a caravan and have been doing a trip every weekend.

[Transporter]

Yeah, that's why a good mechanic will take the history of the car, driver's age, driving habits and environment onto the consideration and from that he will be able to tell how many km's is remaining on the brake pads.
In BraienJ's case the mechanic didn't check the brakes properly.

[gslrallysport]

I have done 60,000km in my kombi beach and told today by service person that the front brake pads have only 2mm left, and the discs are worn down and cannot be machined as they would be too close to tolerance. This entails a replacement of brake pads and discs at a meer cost of $AU1000, and I assume the back ones would soon follow.

This could keep you broke just in brake replacement alone.

Anyone else have any ideas on this situation.

Brian

Brian,

For an OEM spec (or even slightly better), we'd recommend an RDA rotor and Remsa pad (which includes your wear sensor) combo.

Prices for the T5 with 16" wheels as follows:
Front rotors $109 each
Rear rotors $109 each
Front Remsa pads $135
Rear Remsa pads $109

Remsa is the largest manufacturer of pads in Europe, and are rated at 650 degrees, whilst being a very street friendly pad, and come OEM in alot of performance European cars.

Regards,
Greg