Exhaust Manifold

[noone]

This is a continuation of a discussion in VWindahouse's (Anthony's) red devil build thread after he installed the manfold and some other parts (link here)

There are 2 main options for the Polo (I'm sure there may be more)

JBS

ATP

I'd be interested to see what the ATP unit can be had for as a part of the next group buy from ECS (stick'yd in the Mk4 section), I think the JBS unit would likely have been better engineered / designed, but it is also likely to be considerably more expensive...

[Plautos]

I think the ATP manifold is the best choice.

I don't know the JBS manifold, never had one in my hands, but I can't see any benefit that justifies the extra cost.

[whiteVR6]

Have you considered a Kinetic Manifold?

[noone]

Have you considered a Kinetic Manifold?

I had not.

here is a link to the product

here is a link to an article with dyno's on the kinetic unit.

THS manifold

HIMNI racing manifold

APR make one as a part of their stage 3 kit, but cant see it sold separately.

[whiteVR6]

well if your interested i have a Kinetic manifold avaliable
$400
your located in sydney i see so delivery is not a problem

[h100vw]

Obviously this a discussion that could go the same as chips.....

For comparison look at the power increase of the JBS and Kinetic in the plots provided. I haven't looked for plots of the other manifolds. There were more mods done to the Kinetic car, the JBS one had Custom-Code phase 1 and nothing else.

http://jbsautodesigns.co.uk/product/2892/cast-18t-k03-oem-upgrade

http://www.eurotuner.com/techarticles/160_0701_et_volkswagen_mk4_gti_18t/photo_08.html

The Kinetic looks better than the ATP that cracked on my A3. I can see from the photo that the casting is thicker where mine went.

Gavin

[philthy]

Obviously this a discussion that could go the same as chips.....

For comparison look at the power increase of the JBS and Kinetic in the plots provided. I haven't looked for plots of the other manifolds. There were more mods done to the Kinetic car, the JBS one had Custom-Code phase 1 and nothing else.

http://jbsautodesigns.co.uk/product/2892/cast-18t-k03-oem-upgrade

http://www.eurotuner.com/techarticles/160_0701_et_volkswagen_mk4_gti_18t/photo_08.html

The Kinetic looks better than the ATP that cracked on my A3. I can see from the photo that the casting is thicker where mine went.

Gavin

Kinetic car looks like it has some thing wrong with it with those dips... other than that the manifold does SFA

[h100vw]

It would be nice if we had one to test but who is going to buy one just for the sake of it??

Gavin

[mikepologti]

nice topic guys , i too as you know am shopping for a manifold. has anyone got a data sheet that shows potential flow through each mani? i have scene one in my many forum trolls , but it was devoted to the 1.8t in general ill see if i can dig something up tonight while at work.

[h100vw]

There's info on the JBS manifold in this post.

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showpost.php?p=2423048&postcount=55

Gavin

[mikepologti]

wow there impressive figures, some of those flow increses were up 30-40 %

[noone]

Yeah, I'm not convinced by the dyno's.

The power does not seem to be much of an improvement with either of the mani's with dyno's provided until after 4000 rpm.

Its pretty difficult to determine what that would feel like on the road....

I guess it does come down to pricing at the end of the day.

[noone]

I've been looking for any info on the TT, Polo, Mk4, etc for gains by changing the exhaust manifold only. I cant find anything that supports it being worth while with the standard turbo.

I'm sure Anthony's car is pulling better if he says it is, but with a new clutch and flywheel, how could you tell what difference is coming from where?

Love some input from anyone else... especially if you find something supporting or deterring the change.

[pogo_55]

I've been looking for any info on the TT, Polo, Mk4, etc for gains by changing the exhaust manifold only. I cant find anything that supports it being worth while with the standard turbo.

I'm sure Anthony's car is pulling better if he says it is, but with a new clutch and flywheel, how could you tell what difference is coming from where?

Love some input from anyone else... especially if you find something supporting or deterring the change.

I agree. I really wish Anthony had made the changes independantly, so that it would have been more obvious where the increase came from. My bet is on the clutch (well lwfw to be exact) as the source of most of the power increase. I have backed up my mouth by ordering one through jmac. It is also cheaper than the manifold, well maybe, as it costs a bit to get it fitted. There has also been instances of the after market manifolds cracking, ask Mr Harding or H100vw.

[VWindahouse]

I've been looking for any info on the TT, Polo, Mk4, etc for gains by changing the exhaust manifold only. I cant find anything that supports it being worth while with the standard turbo.

I'm sure Anthony's car is pulling better if he says it is, but with a new clutch and flywheel, how could you tell what difference is coming from where?

Love some input from anyone else... especially if you find something supporting or deterring the change.

Hey Noone, IMO having heavily modded a coulpe of NA cars in the past including a facelift model Toyota Corolla Sportivo. This NA screamer came with 141kws from a 1.8L engine from factory and I added mods one by one all with the goal of more air flow - more power in mind and the Dyno didn't lie. Firstly started with HPC coated CAI then added a poly intake manifold gasket to keep intake temps even cooler. Then HPC coated exhaust manifold then a cat back with hi flow cat. The CAI gave good HP gains and with the exhaust but suprisingly the big increase in torque came from the exhaust manifold.

Now I totally understand we are comparing 2 totally different cars but from the feel of the Sportivo V's the Polo when the manifolds were added I can honestly say I believe the exhaust manifold has given the Devil plenty more torque the same as with the Sportivo. I loved being smashed into the back of my seat before with the Polo but now it really feels like a larger engine that's not taking any prisoners.

And I know the opinion from some of the crew that attened the last Dyno day and saw both Shanes white weapon and mine on the Dyno, is Shanes with the same mods and Custom Code phase II, except the LWFW which is the reason Shane pulled better numbers. But some may not know that Gavin only loaded phase II an hour or so before my Dyno run and we did not have a chance to hit some freeway onramps and flatten it to get some quality data logging done with the laptop. And therefore the timing was not adjusted until late that night. IMO the greatest power increase in this entire journey did not occur until then. So I really do believe on that occasion the difference was not the LWFW.

So has the LWFW made a difference?? Yes! (please read my review on the build up thread) But unfortunately I can't prove it gave more or less power than the manifold but what I can tell you is the mods I have done to date all work in perfect harmony and will behave completely stock if that's the way you want to drive it, but when you wind up to redline from 1st to 5th it is an animal considering it still only has a KO3s!

And anyone is welcome to give it a spin who is in two minds about what direction to take their Polo's