No manual GTI was the dealbreaker

[Corey_R]

I'm not saying for a moment that DSG with paddle shifters won't be FASTER when hustling along - I'm saying it won't be as FUN when not trying to drive flat out (ie most of the time).

And the DSGs I have driven can get confused in stop start traffic making for jerky progress. Maybe the Polo GTi will be programmed better for crawling along.

I don't mind doing lots of shifts so a manual in traffic has never bothered me

The DSG gets confused by the drivers input to the throttle...
Once you've had the car for a while, many drivers (particularly traditional manual drivers rather than traditional auto drivers) can adapt and learn how much throttle is needed for a particular situation, and the DSG adapts somewhat too.

Therefore you can still enjoy smoothness when not driving flat out, and be faster when driving flat out.

It's also my experience (at least with the 6sp DSG in a MKV Golf GTI and MK6 Golf R) that updated ECU giving more torque down low can provide a smoother DSG experience too.

[kaanage]

Maybe mine never adapts properly because I'm not its normal driver.

[RoknRob]

Corey was suggesting that (mainly), it's the driver that needs to adapt to the DSG. Once used to it, your daily crawl can be a smooth experience. I hope... In fact, I'm counting on it!!!
The only time I hate my manual is during the daily crawl... and my left hip ain't so pleased with it either, anymore! (Yes, yes, Middle Age is just around the corner, RoknRob...)

[Mi16 Man]

.....Just curious as to how many of you decided not to get the GTI for this reason (or am I the only stubborn one out there), and for the GTI owners, would you have gone for the manual if it was an option?

I am driving a Mk6 Golf GTI manual for this exact reason. Plus, the Golf was only $42K driveaway versus 1yr++ wait for a specced up $37.5K Polo GTi (CW 5dr).

[mfl]

I am driving a Mk6 Golf GTI manual for this exact reason. Plus, the Golf was only $42K driveaway versus 1yr++ wait for a specced up $37.5K Polo GTi (CW 5dr).

+1 , I ruled a few cars, because no manual available.

[kaanage]

Corey was suggesting that (mainly), it's the driver that needs to adapt to the DSG. Once used to it, your daily crawl can be a smooth experience. I hope... In fact, I'm counting on it!!!

Well, I have been adapting to it and it is GENERALLY smooth but when you need to do something it deems a little odd (like tramping on the gas to stop that fuçkwit from cutting in to the 1.25 carlength space between you and the next car) it can shift in a contrary manner. The other situation that quite a few people have found the DSG not behaving well is when trying to accelerate hard to turn out from a turn lane if creeping up and momentarily stopping just prior - it can pause in a frustrating (and sometimes dangerous) manner before engaging drive.

[Corey_R]

Yeah... don't stop! And if you MUST stop, then wait until the next available gap.

This is what I mean by you adapting. If you're coming to the corner and you've looked and a gap will be there to merge, then slow down a bit earlier so that you don't have to completely stop and so that you can already have some load on the engine when it is time to accelerate out into the lane. If the situation prevents you from doing that, then come to a complete stop, and wait until the next break in traffic where you can turn into the left lane safely. Remember also that if you are stopped that you can tap the accelerator while your brake is still engaged to "pre-engage" the clutches and accelerate off quicker with less delay. Additionally (at least with the Golf R) if you put the car into S or M then the idle jumps from 800 to 1300rpm so that the stand-still delay is reduced anyway.

[apples]

If I do get my car in time for the Vic Cruise, perhaps you GTI owners will swap cars with me for half of the cruise so I can see what I'm missing out on bahahahahahahaha

[blutopless2]

if you are experiencing jerkiness from a standstill or surges at low speed then get the dsg looked at... most likely it is at fault and not the driver... unless you are on and off the go pedal then of course it will get confused.
while I think the dsg is ok i would prefer a manual. My wife is the same.

[pologti18t]

Strangely I had no problems with the DSG when I did test drives in a Polo GTI (i have always had manuals). I drove it like an automatic car, which essentially it is. It's "brain" certainly isn't any smarter than the better torque converter auto boxes out there.

If you go stompting on the throttle in an auto car the gearbox will go ballistic thumping through gears. SMoothness with the throttle will reward you.

I also couldn't sense the near-death delay people spoke of. Came to a T intersection on a hill. Came to a stop. Break in traffic, foot off brake (i didn't use the handbrake) and onto throttle. Car takes off smoothly with no more delay than letting the clutch out in a manual car.
I even tried reverse parking with no issues.

The only thing that annoyed me was when the DSG was in "S" it seemed to hold onto gears for far too long even if you came off the throtte. Too hyperactive except when you are really fanging it up a mountain pass.

[gavs]

There is an easy solution all all these supposed problems, drive it like the clutchless manual gearbox that it is so YOU as the driver can dictate what gear and when, pretty simple to me. You still change gears, you just don't have a foot pedal and an H pattern gearbox, you either use the gear lever or the steering wheel paddles, that's what they're there for.

[GTI JOE]

Yes... well said....mmmmooooooohahahahahahaha

C'mon guys get over it, DSG is the evolutionary next stage in technology. Stick shift is overrated

[Corey_R]

if you are experiencing jerkiness from a standstill or surges at low speed then get the dsg looked at... most likely it is at fault and not the driver...

It could be a mechanical fault. But the reality is, it's been the customer more than it has been the mechanicals (at least based on this forum's experience, and considering we're all enthusiastic to get online and discuss this stuff, I'd have to think that we'd be even less pointed towards the customer than the general public).

I drove it like an automatic car, which essentially it is.

That's very untrue. "Essentially", it's two traditional manual gearboxes strapped together, with the shifting and clutch operation controlled by a mechatronics unit. (That is the mechanical and technical reality of the DSG). Whilst you could say that part of the mechatronics (the electronic "brain" part) is similar to that of an auto, the rest of the box bears no resemblence from a mechanical standpoint.

There is an easy solution all all these supposed problems, drive it like the clutchless manual gearbox that it is so YOU as the driver can dictate what gear and when, pretty simple to me

Yes and no. Whilst when driving spiritedly, you're correct, when crawling along in traffic, driving in M is actually not as smooth as using D. It's simply not possible to be as smooth as D actually. The reason is, when you put it into M, the idle revs increase, and also the minimum shift points change.

For example, in my Golf R, if I'm crawling along in traffic, the car will be in D2 from as low as 4km/h, using the torque of the engine and a single gear until it gets to around 22km/h when it changes into 3rd. If you're in M, it won't let you change into 2nd until you're doing around 17, because M is oriented towards "sportiness", if you're pottering in traffic, you usually cannot have enough load on the engine to make it a "smooth" change either!

So certainly, for "stuck in traffic" driving, learning how D operates in your particular car, and making small adaptations to that, is essential for smooth driving. But in that sense, it's no different to driving a traditional manual in one make/model, then jumping into another manual make/model and adjusting to it's different gearshift and clutch operation.

[pologti18t]

That's very untrue. "Essentially", it's two traditional manual gearboxes strapped together, with the shifting and clutch operation controlled by a mechatronics unit. (That is the mechanical and technical reality of the DSG). Whilst you could say that part of the mechatronics (the electronic "brain" part) is similar to that of an auto, the rest of the box bears no resemblence from a mechanical standpoint.

i know it's not a conventional idea of an automatic... BUT it is the VW automatic option for several cars in its range. In essence the driver doesn't have to use a clutch or change gears themselves to move forward

If you dropped joe blogs into a VW with DSG and asked them to drive it they would say its an automatic.

[Corey_R]

I understand. But it is joe blog's expectation that it will drive like every other automatic which they've been in which ultimate leads to much of the customer dissatisfaction in the DSG (where there are no mechanical faults involved).

This is the Polo forum and the DSG is very new to this range. But in the Golf forums where the DSG has been available for 7 years now, there is case after case of this where once it's been explained and people have adapted their driving, they have then been satisfied and even come to love the DSG... for better or worse, it just needs a slightly different approach