Can passengers exit locked vehicle without keyfob?

[ProspectiveOwner]

Hi

As the username suggests, I'm considering a new Passat - the 125TDI Wagon to be precise. In fact, I got so far as price negotiations with the dealer before my wife raised a query that seems harder to answer than it should be.

Her scenario is this. What if she wants to leave passengers in the car for a short period (eg while she runs an errand) but also lock the car so nobody can enter/carjack.

If the car is locked, can passengers get out? Does the "unlock" button work at all times or does she need to leave the key fob in the ignition. If so, how does she get back in without the passenger having to press unlock? Is a second keyfob the answer? I have read somewhere that there may be a key inside the fob she can use for old fashioned manual entry but keep the fob in the ignition for passengers.

Our mid 90s Falcon has no such issues - the internal door handles simply override the locking.

I really like the car, but this could be a dealbreaker for her. It seems to me there should be a simple solution. Any help gratefully received - thanks in advance

[RichPassat]

The quick answer is yes and no!

If you leave the car and press the lock mechanism on the fob it will activate the deadlocks and alarm (if fitted) thus denying access into and out of the car. The internal lock/unlock switch does not work either.

If you press the lock mechanism on the fob twice it will actually lock the car but disable the deadlocks which will not allow access from the outside but allow the doors to be operated to get out. BUT!!! it will activate the alarm (if fitted) and if someone leaves the vehicle through a door that door is unlocked and can be accessed again where as the other doors remain locked from the outside.

Confused - well I was so I tried it and it works. this is straight from the manual (bible/encyclopedia)

Rich

[Jayse]

Hey PO,
Couple of points to consider with your dilemma/query?

If the car is fitted with the factory alarm then locking the car, via the keyfob, while passengers are in it will most likely set it off via internal sensors (found this out the hard way on a trip we took to Sydney over Xmas when the wife was asleep and i stopped to get petrol..poor thing got the fright of her life).
Why would your wife leave the keys in the ignition? If it's to listen to the radio, all the passengers have to do after the ignition is turned off is press the radio on/off button (volume button) and the radio/hdd/cd can be used.

My suggestions would be for the passenger/s (if they are adults) to reach over to the driver's side door and press the internal doorlock button. This can be opened from the outside by your wife with her keyfob when she returns to the car.

The key inside the fob is really meant as an emergency way of getting in. The dealer told me you could use it when you go to the beach and don't want to carry your keyfob in the water etc, but to get to the keyhole you have to take off part of the door handle which if you do repeatedly, will not sit properly or not connect back at all to the door handle. Check this thread out for more on this function. http://www.vwwatercooled.org.au/newf...ad.php?t=31741

Cheers,
Jayse.

[richdave]

Seems to me that the locking methodology is flawed.

Under all circumstances the car doors should be able to be unlocked from inside the car.

I sometimes get out to pump fuel or get a paper etc. and leave passengers in the car... I used to always lock the car doors but now after reading this thread and confirming the findings, I don't.

I now insist that the passengers do it from the door lock button which is "conveniently" located on the drivers door

[Rocket36]

It's a simple answer.

Lock the car with the fob - deadlocks also engage (no unlocking from inside the car). Press lock button again and the deadlocks dis-engage but car stays locked (doors will open from inside but not outside).

It's a great setup designed so theives can't smash a window and then open a door but also allows for people to be safely locked in the car at the servo etc.

[Maverick]

Seems to me that the locking methodology is flawed.

Under all circumstances the car doors should be able to be unlocked from inside the car.

Why? So criminals can break in and have easy access to steal the car and your belongings?

I sometimes get out to pump fuel or get a paper etc. and leave passengers in the car... I used to always lock the car doors but now after reading this thread and confirming the findings, I don't.

I now insist that the passengers do it from the door lock button which is "conveniently" located on the drivers door

If you had RTFM you would note that they discourage this practice and explain the workaround as rocket pointed out. There are lots of other features like this that are explained in the manual and it's well worth taking a few hours to read it and understand the features of the car.

[richdave]

You are entitled to your opinion as am I. I think the logic is flawed...

The VT Comode had a "deadlock" but you had to press twice to activate it, not twice to deactivate.. There is no visual or audible way to determine what the car has actually done unless you carefully listen to the lock mechanism activate so "I" choose to operate in a manner that makes ME certain that the kids and wife can get out if things go pear shaped while I am paying for the fuel...

BMW don't disable the "lock" button on the dash (well at least in the one my wife has). Her car was broken into... they didn't open the doors after they broke the window, they just reached in and took what they wanted anyway... deadlock or not, the phone, GPS or whatever will still be GONE.

If a Pro thief wants your car nothing will stop them and the immobiliser will stop the amateurs so again the deadlock theory does not hold water IMO.

Getting out of a car in an emergency should have priority over contents safety IMO anyway.

[Maverick]

The VT Comode had a "deadlock" but you had to press twice to activate it, not twice to deactivate.. There is no visual or audible way to determine what the car has actually done unless you carefully listen to the lock mechanism activate so "I" choose to operate in a manner that makes ME certain that the kids and wife can get out if things go pear shaped while I am paying for the fuel...

If you're leaving someone in the car have them press the button and unlock the car with the remote on your way back. Realistically you don't fill up with the family in the car every day.

Put a rescue hammer or rescue keyring in the glovebox if you're that worried for their safety so they can smash a window to get out. If you're so concerned about safety what will happen if the car is submerged in water and the electrical system has shorted out and the doors stay locked and the windows won't wind down?

BMW don't disable the "lock" button on the dash (well at least in the one my wife has). Her car was broken into... they didn't open the doors after they broke the window, they just reached in and took what they wanted anyway... deadlock or not, the phone, GPS or whatever will still be GONE.

If a Pro thief wants your car nothing will stop them and the immobiliser will stop the amateurs so again the deadlock theory does not hold water IMO.

Actually it's a combination of security features that WILL stop the pro thief. It's been proven time and time again that deadlocks play a large part in stopping car theft as part of the security system.

BTW modern BMW cars DO deadlock and leaving items visible in your car is asking to be broken into.

The only way to steal most VAG cars is with the key or on the back of a flat bed truck. Deadlocks are the first part of the defence because they make it nearly impossible for the thief to get to the wiring (not that it would help them much anyway).

More and more cars are being fitted with deadlocks for this reason.

"Case Study: Electronic Deadlocks on GM-H's Commodore
When it was Australia's top selling car in the early 1980s, the Commodore was also the top target for thieves. Representations from the NSW NRMA led GM-H to reinforce its door locks on the superseded VL Commodore and introduce improved systems, including the double-sided keys on their new VN model.

GM-H is now fitting an electronically-operated deadlock system as standard equipment in their top-line Commodore, the Calais, which retailed in 1989 for $31,265 and as an option on the $20,014 Executive and the mid-range $24,781 Berlina (The Weekend Australian December 3-4 198. The Calais' standard equipment also includes an elaborate Italian-made Cobra alarm that activates a siren, the horns and turn indicators when it detects a forced entry through the doors, windows, bonnet and boot lid.

The deadlocks, similar to those in widespread household use, are triggered by a battery-powered, matchbox-sized sensor emitting UHF signals, and have a special anti-theft setting in which a high-tensile steel bolt drops into the lock housing and freezes the mechanism.

The system, which prevents all four doors being unlocked on the inside even if the windows are smashed, incorporates an impact sensor that automatically releases the locks in a collision. It was rated as impregnable by the British Consumers Association, which employed a security expert to test 60 cars using implements commonly used by thieves. The expert took only seven seconds to break into most cars, but failed to by-pass the electronic deadlocks after an eight-hour attempt."

Getting out of a car in an emergency should have priority over contents safety IMO anyway.

Is it safe to deadlock someone in the car? NO. This is clearly stated in the owners manual along with recommendations on how to deactivate the deadlocks. If the deadlocks required an extra step people would fail to use them negating their benefits.

[passatpout]

Why? So criminals can break in and have easy access to steal the car and your belongings?

Nope, so passengers can get out in case of emergency, either within or outside the car. I've seen a fairly new Forester get destroyed by fire after the fuel line popped off 4 minutes after refuelling.

I'm also one of the strange ones, I'm not really too concerned with material goods as long as my family and myself are safe. I'd rather see my car get stolen that my family caught inside it if it caught alight or was in a crash.

If you had RTFM you would note that they discourage this practice and explain the workaround as rocket pointed out. There are lots of other features like this that are explained in the manual and it's well worth taking a few hours to read it and understand the features of the car.

If you'd read his first post, you'd have seen he had RTFM and even called it the "bible/encyclopaedia".

[nting]

IMHO, I understand the deadlock setup now and will always press twice if there are people still in the car. I will need to explain this to the wife too...

Personally I hate the fact that the door lock/unlock button is on the drivers side only. On many occasions I have driven somewhere with the wife, got out of the car and left the keys in the car/car running. My wife has to reach over to the drivers side just to lock the car. This might sound fine to some of you (those who feel VAG can do no wrong), but my wife is heavily pregnant right now and this is not a very practical thing to do. What was so hard with having the door lock/unlock button in the centre console? Why is it solely the domain of the driver when he is in the drivers seat? For practicality/safety, the button should be in a more accessible place.

As I mentioned, this is my humble opinion. Please excuse me while I place my fire retardant suit on now for all those who do not agree with me. Apologies in advance.

[Maverick]

Nope, so passengers can get out in case of emergency, either within or outside the car. I've seen a fairly new Forester get destroyed by fire after the fuel line popped off 4 minutes after refuelling.

Once again we come back to the locking of people in the car when the manual clearly warns you against it and tells you how to get around it and allow those inside the car to get out if you do.

How would a fuel line that wouldn't be under pressure at the time would pop off 4 minutes after refuelling without the ignition being switched on and the fuel pump running?

I'm also one of the strange ones, I'm not really too concerned with material goods as long as my family and myself are safe. I'd rather see my car get stolen that my family caught inside it if it caught alight or was in a crash.

You might change your mind if a stolen car t-boned you at the lights, do you think that someone who will steal a car gives a damn about the safety of anyone on the road?

If your family were deadlocked in the car and it caught fire only one person would be at fault. The manual makes this clear and anyone who doesn't read the manual has only themself to blame.

As I mentioned earlier if you're that concerned about your family being trapped in the car you should have a rescue hammer, there is no excuse for not having one and they are mandatory in some European countries and you can get ones that fit on a keyring and even a child can use them to smash a window.

And if the car crashes like all VAG cars the car will unlock the doors, switch off the fuel pump, turn on the interior lights, turn on the hazard lights and call for help if your car is fitted with a suitable equipment (not available in Australia).

If you'd read his first post, you'd have seen he had RTFM and even called it the "bible/encyclopaedia".

Actually if you read his post he said after seeing this thread he has now stopped deadlocking his family in the car

I sometimes get out to pump fuel or get a paper etc. and leave passengers in the car... I used to always lock the car doors but now after reading this thread and confirming the findings, I don't.

I now insist that the passengers do it from the door lock button which is "conveniently" located on the drivers door

[gregozedobe]

Personally I hate the fact that the door lock/unlock button is on the drivers side only. On many occasions I have driven somewhere with the wife, got out of the car and left the keys in the car/car running. My wife has to reach over to the drivers side just to lock the car. This might sound fine to some of you (those who feel VAG can do no wrong), but my wife is heavily pregnant right now and this is not a very practical thing to do. What was so hard with having the door lock/unlock button in the centre console? Why is it solely the domain of the driver when he is in the drivers seat? For practicality/safety, the button should be in a more accessible place.

It depends on where the interior designers want to put the control button for locking. In my Transporter (VW) it is on the driver's side door, but on my Octavia (Skoda) it is located on the centre console behind the gear lever (ie right where you would prefer it). I agree with you, having it in the centre of the car means passengers can also reach it, and it isn't much more difficult for the driver. It is also slightly cheaper to buld in the centre, as LHD and RHD vehicles can be the same.

[Maverick]

It depends on where the interior designers want to put the control button for locking. In my Transporter (VW) it is on the driver's side door, but on my Octavia (Skoda) it is located on the centre console behind the gear lever (ie right where you would prefer it). I agree with you, having it in the centre of the car means passengers can also reach it, and it isn't much more difficult for the driver. It is also slightly cheaper to buld in the centre, as LHD and RHD vehicles can be the same.

It's also for technical reasons, the door controllers control everything to do with locking the doors etc and these are mounted in the doors. To move the control to the center console would require a dedicated location for a switch, extra wiring, extra connections and so on.

It MAY be possible to purchase a LHD drivers door handle with the lock/unlock and operate it from the passanger seat as well and you could also run a switch yourself from the drivers door. I'm not sure if the controller on the left hand door will lock/unlock the doors when in RHD mode but there is no reason why it shouldn't.

[nting]

Thanks for the info greg. Every once in a while I think about the Octavia and why I maybe should have gone that way instead. Don't worry Passat drivers, I still love my car. Haha, but this is a small but pleasant win for the Skoda. VW, pay attention! I paid more for you, you should be doing things better! Even the little things. My wife is a paranoid sort and always likes to lock the doors, so this is something that we would have appreciated. Oh wells.

[Treza360]

Also ask your dealer or someone with VAG-COM or if it's available in the menus, enable the beep for when your car locks that way each time you press the lock on the remote you will hear yourself press it and know exactly where it's at.
Too easy (unless you have a Polo where it's so freaking loud it makes your ears bleed).

Pressing the button once to deadlock and twice to lock without deadlock and alarm makes perfect sense. The vast majority of the time most people will be wanting to lock the car in the most secure way. Therefore the quickest, easiest and most natural way to do this is to press the button only once.
Also if I'm leaving my partner in the car I always leave the keys in the car with her so that way she can still wind down the windows or turn the fan on and get some air coming in. It's really not that hard to reach over and press the lock and unlock buttons (unless you have an original H1 Hummer that is).

Finally I'm always very happy reading reports that modern VWs since the MkIV have topped nearly all surveys for vehicle security and being the hardest to steal.

Cheers,
Trent