BSR Tiguan TDI tune

[olski1]

I was offered a BSR TDI tune by my mechanic today. I have been considering tuning since the warranty has expired. I have over the years been keeping an eye on the different tunes (bluefin, DNA, Oettinger etc.) but haven't been able to find much on this one.

The figures they are quoting on their website are significantly higher than the other ones on the market. I am worried if I was to go with this one, the DSG would need a separate tune as well. If the quoited figures are correct, then I can imagine it might by quite Jerky when around town. Surely, my engine isn't suitable for those sorts of gains.

Anyone have any thoughts or experience with the TDI BSR tunes?

Volkswagen Tiguan 2.0TDI 140Hp 2008-2014 Stage 1

[Sanman]

The power gains on the diesel have never been enough to spend $1-$2k in my opinion.
This BSR one gives 47Hp, or about the difference between the standard Tiguan 103kW and the currently offered 130kW diesel.
I would like to know how VW gets this increase, as if it is through tune (not a larger turbo) then I would be expecting any chip tuner simply to copy this

[tigger73]

Their diesel tunes for the Tiguan look a lot more impressive than the petrol ones.

I haven't heard of BSR, though these days there's a number of rebadged tunes going around. If you look at the wide range of cars they tune it's almost certain that they are just reselling someone else's tune.

Plus the fact that they already have a tune for the 2016 Skoda Superb 140TDI... which has only just hit the streets here this week.

[dinot81]

I think that even VW uses software for power increase when you compare 103 and 130TDI. Lots of European manufactures offer for example a 2L engine with 3 different power output versions. In Europe, VW offered a 2.0l TDI version with 81, 103, and 130kw. The older 1.9tdi was even offered with 6 different power output versions but did admit that the 3 higher spec versions had stronger engine components and blocks compared to the 3 with lesser output.

ABT Sportsline which is the best known for VAG (https://www.abtsportsline.com.au/) cars tuning, here in Oz offers a chip upgrade for the 103TDI to 125kw and 360Nm for $2690 and these are DIY tuning, you can do yourself at home in less than 30 minutes. Just connect the tuning chip and job done. ABT will offer a warranty on cars which replaces manufacturer warranty in case of modding cars.

But again, question is whether is worth it and any impact on DPF???

Regards

Dino

[lasholm]

BSR develop their own software here in Sweden and they are also involved in Koenigsegg software.

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[olski1]

Thanks guys,

I have dealt with BSR before and have always thought they had a pretty reputable image. The tune suggests a peak power gain from 103 kw to 140 kw! which is substantial. The torque likewise is from 327Nm to 431Nm which is substantial, but pointless seeing the DSG is limited to 350Nm.

For $900 Aud this seems like a good deal to me with 1 year parts warranty as well.

[dinot81]

According to german version of the Tiguan brochure, DQ500 DSG will withstand max torque of 600Nm. This is a pic of the current brochure, no English version available or could not paste into translate. Looked at VW UK, no info about DSG available.

[tigger73]

Yes DQ500 7 speed DSG in Tiguan is a stronger box than what is used in Golf R and GTI. You won't get anywhere near the limits with a stage 1 tune. Even Guy H's Frankenmumster Stage 3 Tiguan used the standard DQ500 gearbox without any uprated hardware/ internals (though did run new software).

[Transporter]

Yeah, just don't expect super long life from your car, get rid of it in an appropriate time and let the second owner worry about the cost of repairing the DSG. I've seen a few Golfs now which had the stage 3 with and a bit over 100,000km done with DSG in a need of repairs.

[Greg Roles]

I think that even VW uses software for power increase when you compare 103 and 130TDI. Lots of European manufactures offer for example a 2L engine with 3 different power output versions. In Europe, VW offered a 2.0l TDI version with 81, 103, and 130kw. The older 1.9tdi was even offered with 6 different power output versions but did admit that the 3 higher spec versions had stronger engine components and blocks compared to the 3 with lesser output.

ABT Sportsline which is the best known for VAG (https://www.abtsportsline.com.au/) cars tuning, here in Oz offers a chip upgrade for the 103TDI to 125kw and 360Nm for $2690 and these are DIY tuning, you can do yourself at home in less than 30 minutes. Just connect the tuning chip and job done. ABT will offer a warranty on cars which replaces manufacturer warranty in case of modding cars.

But again, question is whether is worth it and any impact on DPF???

Regards

Dino

Having run a similar power level chip on my 103kw Yeti ( same engine ) for 20,000kms now, the piggyback boxes, the current 4 channel ones at least, do have an impact on soot production and the DPF regeneration frequency. It's nothing major, but the truth is piggybacks are a cruder, "lower resolution" form of tuning compared to an OBD flash tune, where a ton more parameters can be accessed, and controlled in much finer detail. The end result of any 3-4 channel piggy is more soot than stock, and it's been my experience it regens about every 600kms as opposed to 800kms generally. The obvious downside to a flash tune is TD1 autodetection at the dealer, or the fact if they have need to find an OBD flash tune, they can. A Piggyback has the advantage of leaving no virtual trace, but yes, you need to remove the box, and use the dummy jumper plug ( so the car drives stock, chips don't trigger TD1 if in place ) or even take the loom off each service to be 100% secure.

Piggyback boxes accessing boost, fuel and cam timing top out at about 130kw/ 380nm on the 103. You can feel the torque is a bit down compared to a typical flash tune, but the 103 goes from being eaten by 6 packs at the lights to hurting them. It's no V8 killer on a piggyback, the turbo, and how hard you can push it, and the limitations in injection control, are the limiting factors there.

A flash tune on my 103 took me to 200hp, and it's as big a jump again. What I have noticed is a virtually dead normal DPF regen cycle. With a flash tune, if done properly - and I'm not here to sell tunes, it's just the simple facts that ANY of the top tunes, using PROPER software can get great resolution and results, and thus minimise extra soot loads on the DPF.

It's my estimation that BSR is using the same overseas developer as my provider, which wouldn't suprise me, they would sell to anyone. Where the difference comes in is what does the brand do with the tune once here, is it further modified and optimised for local conditions, and tweaked further, there's always more left in any supplied tune, even at that level. BSR do have a very cool handheld loan option, wish I could do that!

So if you are out oif warranty, go with the BSR tune. If you are in warranty, and or worried about your DSG, go with the piggyback, as they have a much more linear torque curve, and a lower torque result, so I'd rate the piggys as fine for a new car for the typical 3 year period, but a flash tune is the obvious choice outside warranty. Your DPF will be fine, and if it is the same as the tune I'm running, the dsg is fine too, well within maximum parameters of the 4x4 DSG we all have, as Dino points out. I'm hoping to take my Yeti towards that 600nm figure on the stock box, albeit with a bit of DSG wizzadry as well.

[Dingah]

The forum should be thankful for your patience in putting that post together which clarifies the difference between piggyback and an OBDI hosted flash tune in an insightful manner. It may well be the case in future iterations of ECU software that the levels of encryption on the ECUs may preclude access to the ECU altogether for the purposes of flash tuning and the far cruder, but oft effective piggyback may become the only way to adjust power outputs.

Tx

Dingah

[Greg Roles]

Everytime a OEM ECU comes out with better encryption, some aftermarket programmer starts work on cracking it. Interestingly one of the guys I have access to is actually paid by exotic manufacturers to write ECU software for them, and runs his tuning programming on the side. I guess when you write the OEM program, you also know the way back into it! Wouldn't surprise me if this is more widespread, company man by day and aftermarket hacker at night.

Thanks for the kind words, and alerting me to BSR's very cool handheld, I'm always looking for better options.

[Greg Roles]

The power gains on the diesel have never been enough to spend $1-$2k in my opinion.
This BSR one gives 47Hp, or about the difference between the standard Tiguan 103kW and the currently offered 130kW diesel.
I would like to know how VW gets this increase, as if it is through tune (not a larger turbo) then I would be expecting any chip tuner simply to copy this

Very different, including turbo and injectors, and a flash tune on either yields correspondingly different results because of this.

[Dingah]

Everytime a OEM ECU comes out with better encryption, some aftermarket programmer starts work on cracking it. Interestingly one of the guys I have access to is actually paid by exotic manufacturers to write ECU software for them, and runs his tuning programming on the side. I guess when you write the OEM program, you also know the way back into it! Wouldn't surprise me if this is more widespread, company man by day and aftermarket hacker at night.

Thanks for the kind words, and alerting me to BSR's very cool handheld, I'm always looking for better options.

LOL!
Maybe you can get him to try and access the Audi SQ5 encryption for the Oz model ECU - nothing around yet.

Dingah

[Greg Roles]

Yeah Piggyback only on that bad boy - like you need MORE power on my dream car!