BMW 120d vs Golf GT Sport Tdi

[craigy]

Definitely the BMW. I would trade my GTi back for my 330CI at the blink of an eye if I could. Everything about the BMW is so much more refined....after all you are getting a BMW.
If the RWD drive is concerning you now it will concern you even more when you don't have it. The BMW was much more exciting to drive that's for sure.

After moving from a 330CI to the GTSport TDI I'm very impressed with the VW, sure it misses out on some refinement but it was also $60K cheaper. Remember that the 330CI is the top of the BMW 3 range, the cars below it miss a lot of it's features and from my experience aren't nearly as nice.
There is a lot of difference between a 120D and a 330CI. Personally I much prefer the GT over the 120D but if it were the new 135I that would be entirely different.

[DionM]

Everyone is saying the BMW is a better brand.

Which it might be, but the 1-series is the entry level BMW.

It's like driving around advertising you don't quite make enough money to buy a 3-series

It's a good car, no doubt ... but that ugly ugly styling (B-pillar backwards) and virtually useless interior would spoil it for me. When I was shopping round I looked at the 3, didn't even consider the 1 series.

RWD/FWD ... unless you're driving at the limits day in day out you wouldn't notice - especially if you leave the traction control (TC) on in both vehicles anyway. If it's a commuter car the argument is moot, especially with the TC. Yes I find the FWD in my Jetta a little infuriating at times, but seriously, however are you doing traffic light grand prix or pushing it through the mountains? I'm happy to pocket the 25k difference between my Jetta and a 3 series and put it twaords something else ...

[docjames]

I'd go the golf. We actually looked at the one series when we bought the golf, and it just isnt worth the extra money. RWD is nice, but on the road really doesnt make enough of a difference to make the extra cost worthwhile. The boot space is rubbish, and the rear seats are useless, and the ride on the runflats is average. I like the one series, but couldnt justify spending the extra $$.

My $0.02.

[DSGMAn]

Why not just fork out for an R32 - accoring to Top Gear in UK - it ****s all over the BMW 130i

http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9rFQPg0kbk

These guys have driven alot of Euro variants, so for the Volksi to come out on top is really saying something.

[gerhard]

Why not just fork out for an R32 - accoring to Top Gear in UK - it ****s all over the BMW 130i

http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9rFQPg0kbk

These guys have driven alot of Euro variants, so for the Volksi to come out on top is really saying something.

Quite an interesting video.

The BMW showed bags of understeer transforming into oversteer - the kind of handling on offer from XC Falcons. The only difference is the BMW has a lot more grip, so will potentially be a lot more savage when it lets go on a twisty mountain road. Very typical, really, of a RWD car.

The VW has the advantage of AWD, which gives it far more primary safety - sufficient understeer to scrub off speed when being insane, but no snap into oversteer. Now one could argue that the AWD advantage is unfair, but that would only be a reasonable argument if the price of the VW was higher by the cost of the AWD system. But it's not dearer, it's cheaper.

The VW has the bonus of much larger rear space and luggage space is also better.

I'm not in the market for either of these cars, but if I were the VW would be my pick.

[Purgi]

Quite an interesting video.

The BMW showed bags of understeer transforming into oversteer - the kind of handling on offer from XC Falcons. The only difference is the BMW has a lot more grip, so will potentially be a lot more savage when it lets go on a twisty mountain road. Very typical, really, of a RWD car.

The VW has the advantage of AWD, which gives it far more primary safety - sufficient understeer to scrub off speed when being insane, but no snap into oversteer. Now one could argue that the AWD advantage is unfair, but that would only be a reasonable argument if the price of the VW was higher by the cost of the AWD system. But it's not dearer, it's cheaper.

The VW has the bonus of much larger rear space and luggage space is also better.

I'm not in the market for either of these cars, but if I were the VW would be my pick.

While I love Jeremy's critique of both cars considering I own an R32, lets not get carried away on the luggage space. If the 130i is significantly less then there's clearly no space at all. Can't speak for the rear passenger space, I think it's reasonably ample in the R32 for what it is, I've only had short women in the back of mine who didn't complain, but coming from an XR8, it's tough to judge.

AWD vs RWD. On a windy mountain road, I'd have thought the RWD would have been more predictable (having spent countless years traversing them in RWD cars). I've yet to push my R32 to any sort of limit but my impression is grip grip grip oops and the oops comes unexpectedly. RWD loss of grip is predictable and catchable, I think in the review he hammed it up a little as he was having gobs of fun losing the back end initially.

What I was quite impressed with is that the R32 vs the equivalent year STi was about 0.3 secs slower around the Top Gear test track. I didn't buy the R32 for raw speed, I bought it because I was looking for something fun that was more economical than an 8 that wasn't FWD and cruised comfortably, the R32 absolutely delivers that, it cruises as effortlessly as the XR8 it replaced.

From the moment I rolled out of the dealer, I haven't regretted getting it. It's quite likely that the GTI would have suited my needs but I just have a thing about FWD and a thing about turbos.

[Greg Roles]

..... but I just have a thing about FWD and a thing about turbos.

Me too mate, me too.

I want a bigger one!

[Suff]

Well.. I am taking the plunge.. I have jsut made an offer on a second hand GT Sport TDI.. whilst I would have preferred new, I couldnt ignore the price of the second hand car, and it has the options that I wanted anyway!

Here's Hoping..

Now.. Chips! what have people got, what did they pay and what are they getting? I have used DP Chip before on a landcruiser and was very happy with it.. Open to ideas as this will be going in straight away!

Cheers

Chris

[AJD]

For what it is worth, I have done over 30,000K's in my bog standard TDI Comfortline, and about 3,000K's in a 120d.

In my opinion, there is no way in this world a 120d is going to stand up to the VW as a daily drive. Personally, I found the beemer to be a little too tinny (slam a door a couple of times and you will see what I mean. As for the "back seat", who are they trying to kid? That thing will not take a double amputee midget in comfort...I suspect it was designed as a luxury space for your groceries because they certainly won't fit in the boot.
It really comes down to what you want in a car. If you don't mind everything aft of the front seats being ballast, the beemer is the the only choice (not that I know anything about either car other than my preference).

[orsegtsport]

Now.. Chips! what have people got, what did they pay and what are they getting?
Cheers

Chris

Running ChippedUK ST3 Fast Road map and very happy with it. $600 bucks buys you (well it did, but I suspect that offer has finished now) smooth and impressive power delivery, and slightly better economy than stock. I believe Logzy (forum member) is the man to speak to now about the ST3 as he has recently become the Australian distributor.

[Suff]

Running ChippedUK ST3 Fast Road map and very happy with it. $600 bucks buys you (well it did, but I suspect that offer has finished now) smooth and impressive power delivery, and slightly better economy than stock. I believe Logzy (forum member) is the man to speak to now about the ST3 as he has recently become the Australian distributor.

Hi orsegtsport.. any figures on the expected gains for your St3?

[orsegtsport]

I haven't seen any dyno graphs or actual claimed gains for the ST3, but I'm guessing power is around the 140 kW mark and torque probably just over 400 Nm (although the control module in the DSG limits torque to about 380 Nm I believe). I'm not too bothered about the power figures anyway, because at the end of the day, it feels fantastic to drive and was far and away the cheapest ECU remap available. It pulls like a V8 and I'm getting 900 km per tank (50L).... what's not to like?

[WEDEL.1]

the Golf has a nicer interior too.. but Im not such a fan of the exterior

I have just ordered a Golf Edition, and like you, am not a great fan of the exterior, but love the interior.

However, I am a great VW fan and I was clearly able to overlook the exterior for the benefits of the brand, driving enjoyment, quality and fuel ecomony.

I know that in time (possibly short) I will learn to admire the exterior.

"Volkswagen, man weise, was man hat."

Maris

[jayjay]

i dont mean to open a dead thread, but the 120d now has 130kw...

[Logzy]

I haven't seen any dyno graphs or actual claimed gains for the ST3, but I'm guessing power is around the 140 kW mark and torque probably just over 400 Nm (although the control module in the DSG limits torque to about 380 Nm I believe). I'm not too bothered about the power figures anyway, because at the end of the day, it feels fantastic to drive and was far and away the cheapest ECU remap available. It pulls like a V8 and I'm getting 900 km per tank (50L).... what's not to like?

The ST3 gives about 147kw and 410nm but if you have a DSG then yes the torque is limited by the DGS's brain.
Nice smooth power delivery and it sure does pull like a V8.
Ive come from a VXII Clubsport with a tuned 5.7l V8 in it and really dont miss it at all.
My TDI has heaps of go and i couldnt be happier.