Conti SportContact 3 or SportContact 5 Contiseal?

[Mattlock]

Hi,

My front tyres are shot and up for replacement. The car is running SportContact2s and the suggestion was to go for the SportContact3 (especially as the SC2s on the rear still have some life in them). When I rang up my tyre dealer, he gave me a couple of alternatives that have got me thinking:

* SC3 or SC5 for the same price
* SC5 with Contiseal goop (supposedly 1/2way between a normal and a run-flat but puncture repairable)

These are going on a 1.4GT Sport rather than a stock Golf. I am interested in what everyone thinks about the goop's ability to provide a level of puncture resistance, road noise changes and whether the ride suffers as a result. Should I just stick with the SC3s as being as close as I can get to the original SC2s?

[brad]

I'd put the rears on the front & new tyres to the rear. It's the proper & safer way of dealing with these things.

A mate of mine that tunes BR86s only mentioned this morning that he did a tune on a CSC5 shod car & thought it a shocking tyre.

As for the goop as a halfway measure to being an RFT - do you really need it. Are punctures generally an issue for you? I'd assume it makes it a heavier tyre & I'd be asking what the repair process is if you do get a puncture.

Because I'm somewhat of a broken record, I'd recomend Michelin PS3 or Goodyear F1A2. There's no law or harm in running different brands of tyre at either end of the car - As I said put the remaining Contis on the front so they wear out quicker then get another 2 of whatever you chose & then you'll have all 4 matching.

My 2c

[Mattlock]

Hi Brad,

Thanks for that. I had intended to swap the rears and fronts as a part of doing this. I hadn't even heard of the goop in the SC5s until I rang up. They are $20 per corner more expensive than non-goop SC5s as well.

I don't really have an issue with punctures; I've had 2 in 10 years! The repair process apparently allows the raw rubber layer (goop) to be moved out of the way whilst the plug is put in and then repositioned before fitting and inflating.

The SC3s were recommended to me at the car's service on Friday and it seems to make logical sense to go with those. Out of interest what makes you go for the Michelin or the Goodyear? Typically, I've always replaced like-for-like so I've not really thought about alternatives before but I am interested in what other people use.

[gldgti]

I;ve had good experience with CSC3's. But all of those 'premium tyres' are good in their own way.

If I were you I would replace with the CSC3's as they are very similar to the CSC2's. I once had a bad experience with continentals on the fornt of my golf, and hankooks on the back

[idaho]

Are you sure you can get CSC3 tyres in the GT Sport size? My wife recently replaced the CSC2's on her GT Sport and CSC3's were not available in 225/45x17. She only had the choice of CSC5 or CMC5 in that size. She took the CMC5 and is not really happy with them as she says the steering is too light and has lost the firmer feel of the CSC2's. However the CSC5 doesn't look much different to CMC5 so I don't know it would be any better.

[Diesel_vert]

Hi,

My front tyres are shot and up for replacement. The car is running SportContact2s and the suggestion was to go for the SportContact3 (especially as the SC2s on the rear still have some life in them). When I rang up my tyre dealer, he gave me a couple of alternatives that have got me thinking:

* SC3 or SC5 for the same price
* SC5 with Contiseal goop (supposedly 1/2way between a normal and a run-flat but puncture repairable)

These are going on a 1.4GT Sport rather than a stock Golf. I am interested in what everyone thinks about the goop's ability to provide a level of puncture resistance, road noise changes and whether the ride suffers as a result. Should I just stick with the SC3s as being as close as I can get to the original SC2s?

This link explains what ContiSeal is and does: ContiSeal: The self-sealing standard production tire from Continental

You may wish to clarify with the tyre dealer, but as far as I can tell, Continental doesn't produce a ContiSeal tyre in size 225/45 R17, but is available in 235/45 R17.

If you wish to stick with the same brand, I would go with the SC5 if price is identical. Whether you opt for ContiSeal (if available) is up to you. I think it would be very useful if the vehicle has no spare tyre to speak of.

Otherwise, the Michelin Pilot Sport 3 and Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric 2 often receive favourable comments from drivers.

Are you sure you can get CSC3 tyres in the GT Sport size? My wife recently replaced the CSC2's on her GT Sport and CSC3's were not available in 225/45x17. She only had the choice of CSC5 or CMC5 in that size. She took the CMC5 and is not really happy with them as she says the steering is too light and has lost the firmer feel of the CSC2's. However the CSC5 doesn't look much different to CMC5 so I don't know it would be any better.

Continental is unlikely to have stopped production of the SportContact3 (SC3) in size 225/45 R17, but availability will obviously vary.

The SportContact5 (SC5) is the successor to the SC3, and I expect it to perform better that the SC3 in most respects.

The MaxContact5 (MC5) is from a different product line altogether and developed specifically for the Asia-Pacific region. That's not to say it's a poor tyre - that entirely depends on the sort of characteristics the purchaser wants from their product.



In regards to the characteristics of new tyres:

Tires are comprised of many layers of rubber, steel and fabric. Due to these different components, your new tires require a break-in period to ensure that they deliver their normal ride quality and maximum performance.

As tires are cured, a release lubricant is applied to prevent them from sticking in their mold. Some of the lubricant stays on the surface of your tires, reducing traction until it is worn away. Five hundred miles (800 km) of easy acceleration, cornering and braking will allow the mold release lubricant to wear off, allowing the other tire components to begin working together.

It is also important to note that your old tires probably had very little tread depth remaining when you felt it was time to replace them. As any autocrosser or racer who has tread rubber shaved off of his tires will tell you, low tread depth tires respond more quickly. Don't be surprised if your new tires are a little slower to respond (even if you use the exact same tire as before). Their new, full depth brings with it a little more tread squirm until they wear down.

NOTE: Be careful whenever you explore the capabilities of your new tires. Remember that every tire requires a break-in period of 500 miles (800 km) for optimum performance.

Source: Tire Rack - Breaking In Your Tires

[Mattlock]

Thanks for the comments everyone.

Firstly, I got my tyre size wrong. I confused the width with my other car. My GT does indeed only have 225/45 R17. My other car is 235/60 R18 (quite a different tyre). This is what comes of doing this from memory!

The MC5 was described to me as not a tyre worth fitting if you drive the car hard. They're also a lot cheaper than the SC3 or 5. I was quoted $169 fitted for the MC5 and $235 fitted for the SC3/5.

I think I will look at some reviews of the PilotSport and Goodyear tyres before making a decision. I don't think the Contiseal offers me anything except cost and possible extra weight. I have a 185 low speed spare in the car so I don't need a semi run-flat option to get me out of trouble.

[brad]

. Out of interest what makes you go for the Michelin or the Goodyear? .

Good things about Contis: They are generally lighter than other tyres. They grip OK.
bad things: lightness comes at a cost & the sidewalls are a bit fragile. They are noisy when they get <50% tread.
I had CSC2 as OEM on my car. They were OK but I wouldn't re-purchase.


Michelin: Depends on the tread but they are generally quiet until <25%. They always last a lot longer than you expect. They usually grip well. The build quality is consistent. PS3 keeps coming up as a great all-rounder - I'd have at least 8 of my mates / family running & loving them. I've just come off a set of Michelin Primacy HP - got 75,000km; grip was good for a touring tyre & they only got noisy-ish in the last 10,000km.

Goodyear: I used to work for Goodyear & am generally bias AGAINST their tyres but F1A2 keeps getting consistent, good reviews & I know a few people that have them & are happy.

If you are happy with the CSC2 then I can't see the CSC5 being any worse. You may as well go for it as you have to live with them for a couple of years.

[Martin]

I have similar views to Brad

Conti's provide a good level of cornering grip, turn in is a bit vague due to softish sidewall
They last well but they do thump through pot holes
Normally your get a good run from them (km traveled)

The Michelin's are great all rounders and often have above average performance in the wet (which I valued when living in NZ - Sydney in rush hour traffic is a less of a concern).
The PS3 is a wonderful tyre, not too noisy, nice turn in feel, high grip level
So far they are lasting very well and look good for 45k+

The PS3 have some sidewall protection (the Conti don't) - you can see it in this picture


As for Goodyear - normally I would not even bother to look at the Goodyear range
But these F1A2's really are a great tyre - but they are for the performance oriented driver as they are noisier than the PS3
These have great dry grip - better than PS3 and are not far behind in the wet either
Very stiff sidewall and crisp turn in
So far they are lasting well and look good for 45k+

Here is a picture of the Goodyear F1A2 sidewall against the rim


I did a track day on my Goodyear F1A2 (front) and Michelin PS3 (rear)
(This was an accident - I forgot the hub rings for my wheels with semi slicks)
They did not get brutalized at all (however I do have more negative camber than stock)

[Mattlock]

Thanks Brad. That's great feedback. I'm indifferent on the Contis. I do feel that they're a touch slow to change direction and they feel vague when you lean on them.

Thanks Martin. The F1s look good on your rims. I do like to push my car and I'm not too worried about the road noise (as long as I can still hear the supercharger!)

My reading around from tests in AUS, USA and UK suggests the F1 is consistently reliable. I think these are looking like the choice. The 45,000km is appealing too!

As a curveball a couple of friends threw Yokohama AD08s at me today as well. One drives an RX-7 and the other uses AD048s on his racing Gemini as it's the stock control tyre. They seem a bit too far towards the track tyre end of things and I worry about wet weather performance and the sticker rubber not lasting anywhere near as long. The AD08s only look like lasting about 20,000km!

[brad]

The Yokohame are a good high performance tyre but I'd question the wet weather performance once it got less than 50% because the channels don't go all the way to the edge so it has to spit the water back through the two radial grooves.

NB: I don't like directional tyres as i like to x-rotate my tyres every 7.5-10k. You can't x-rotate directionals but you can assymetrics.



The Goodyear have 4 radial grooves & continue out to the sides which may help with water dispersal a bit.


PS3 also have 3 radial grooves & channels going out to the edge


If you can find them PS2 is more performance oriented than PS3.

Michelin PSS is their real sporty tyre & wears reasonably well but IIRC only comes with 6mm of tread so you're immediately 20% worse off than a PS2/PS3.

[Diesel_vert]

The Pilot Super Sport currently sits on top of Michelin's range of performance road tyres, and like most road tyres, most sizes have an initial tread depth of between 7 to 8 mm (apart from a few OE fitments, e.g. Ferrari). Same goes for the Continental SC3, SC5, Goodyear F1A2, Michelin PS2, PS3, etc.

The Yokohama Advan Neova AD08R offers performance characteristics which lie in between the PSS and PSC. Expect it to offer higher tolerance of elevated operating temperatures and more dry grip at the cost of treadwear, more wet grip but a lower aquaplaning threshold, and better steering response and consistency due to its construction, but at the expense of a firmer ride and heavier tyre. Good fun. Also consider the Bridgestone Potenza RE-11A.

This is probably as far as you'd want to go for regular usage on public roads, unless you have a Porsche GT3 or something insane, otherwise read on...

The Pilot Sport Cup is Michelin's road-legal motorsport tyre, which indeed has a much reduced initial tread depth of between 4 to 5 mm, depending on size.

Likewise, the Advan A048 & A050 are Yokohama's road-legal motorsport tyre, but probably too compromised for regular usage on public roads for most drivers.

[Mattlock]

Thanks Diesel_vert,

Today I got the following prices:

P Zero - $207
PS3 - $209
F1 A2 - $230
Conti SC5 - $235

On price alone, the P Zero and PS3 are attractive.

[brad]

P Zero - do not want.

You'll love it for the first 30%.

[Mattlock]

P Zero - do not want.

You'll love it for the first 30%.

Haha! That's good feedback.

The tyre guy that gave me the prices above said I should go for the PS3. He said he really likes it and thought it would give better mileage than the P Zero. He discounted the F1 simply on price.