Goodyear F1 Asymmetric Vs. Michelin Pilot Super Sport

[csd1uk]

Hi All,

I have been reading the tyre threads on the forum but wondered if anyone had any experience of these tyres?

I know the Asymmetrics are being replaced, and the Pilot Super Sports are new.

Prices are similar on Tirerack.com

These are to fit on my R32

Cheers all

[Corey_R]

I've been in an R32 with PSP2's, but to be honest, I'm a little confused to how the PSS's fit in with the PSP3. Are they a replacment to a PSP3, or are they are "less wet weather friendly" version of the PSP3? They look [b]very[/b similar to each other... both having almost identical tread patterns except the PSP3's outside blocks having approximately twice the cuts in the blocks.

F1 Asy 2's win hands down according to round ups vs the PSP3. But they're not yet available from tirerack. As far as I'm concerned, get whichever is cheapest. These tyres are all so good you can't go wrong.

But for what it's worth, I'll be buying F1 Asy 2's for my R as soon as my stock bridgetones wear out

[Diesel_vert]

In my mind, the Pilot Sport 3 is more of a replacement for the Pilot Preceda/Pilot Exalto series, whereas the Pilot Super Sport is more of a replacement for the Pilot Sport 2.

The PS3 is not available in the North American market (except for a few OEM fitments). On the other hand, the PSS is not available in certain sizes 18" and under for the rest of the world ( e.g. 225/45 R17 and 225/40 R18 ).


The Michelin PSS is currently the best road tyre on the market in terms of dry grip/handling and wear. However, the Goodyear F1A and F1A2 strengths lie in their wet performance and aquaplaning resistance, which makes them a better all rounder for the general motorist.

Same goes for the Michelin PS3 - also a good all rounder, but with more emphasis on dry performance. It's a toss up between the PS3 and the F1A, but the F1A2 is better than both.


If buying from Tire Rack, go for the Michelin PSS (my preference). If buying local, go for the Goodyear F1A2.

[Corey_R]

The thing is, I don't know anyone who has put on the F1A2 yet cause of how new they are. The PSS is also very knew, although I do know 2 people to have put them on. But definitely I would ask questions to anyone who claims to know both tyres who didn't work for one of the tyre testing companies (or mags).

Thus far, there are almost no reviews of both the F1A2 and PSS together. F1A2 vs PS3 the Goodyear wins. F1A2, at least from "aggregate sites" such as Tyre reviews, tests and ratings | the online tyre guide, they're equal for dry grip, but the F1A2 wins overall...

[Diesel_vert]

This link shows that the F1A2 doesn't top the dry performance category, which is beaten by the Pirelli P Zero and Bridgestone S001 (amongst others). Or the wet category for that matter. But combined with its scores in rolling resistance and comfort, it shows that it's a good all rounder, so it was awarded 2nd place as a result.

Then this link shows that the Michelin PSS beat the Pirelli P Zero and Bridgestone S-04 (very similar to the S001) in the dry, though I don't think the Americans are as thorough as the Germans, but I digress...

You can therefore reasonably conclude that the PSS would be a better performer in the dry (yet to see a tyre in a test which beats it in this area so far) than the F1A2, which is not surprising given the emphasis on handling and performance, esp. on the circuit, in their media releases. But given that Michelin also say the PSS's aquaplaning resistance is at the same level of its predecessor (the PS2, which wasn't that good TBH) and Goodyear Eagle F1 series' track record in wet performance in past tyre tests, you can again reasonably conclude that the F1A2's wet performance would be superior to that of the PSS.

[Corey_R]

Nah - you really need to see them in the same test, and hopefully a few tests, as different tracks etc can offer different results for the same tyre (surface type, weather, previously laid down rubber etc). Additionally, different sized versions of the one tyre model can perform differently. And obviously, different test cars can also influence the bias to one tyre over another. So it's good to see the average results.

Also the Auto Zeitung results are "bias towards wet performance, and subjective feel of the tyres isn't judged." So whilst they said the Goodyear "offering precise feedback" it doesn't get any points for that. And whilst the Pirelli had the best wet lap and braking time, it was only average in aquaplanning, yet still wins the wet category because it's only based on the times, and not other handling characterists, feedback, or subjectiveness.

Yet in the Tirerack test, the Pirelli has equal worst wet scores, that being what won it the Auto Zeitung results.

So as I said, we can't reasonably conclude that test a tyre not present in one test which happens to beat it's winner in another test is the best overall..

[gareth_oau]

Its my view that for the top few tyres the performance is so good and relatively similar that for everyday driving, I'm not really going to be able to tell the difference.

These days, when picking a tyre, I narrow it down to the last 3 choices, based on performance, then choose the winner according to a combination of price, and how sexy the tread pattern looks.

Ive had 2 sets of GYF1A1 and been very happy with them, as well as their wear-rate, which most tests dont cover.

they also tend to be a bit cheaper than other brands (locally)

I'm leaning towards the GYF1A2, but wont need any until they are on tirerack.

Suggest you email tirerack and ask them when they will be selling them

[jazd]

and how sexy the tread pattern looks.

Best methodology IMO
My Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Specs look awesome!

Hadn't heard of the Asymmetric 2s until now, sounds like they might be my next tire.

[AP]

Michelin Super Sports....

[Diesel_vert]

Nah - you really need to see them in the same test, and hopefully a few tests, as different tracks etc can offer different results for the same tyre (surface type, weather, previously laid down rubber etc). Additionally, different sized versions of the one tyre model can perform differently. And obviously, different test cars can also influence the bias to one tyre over another. So it's good to see the average results.

When comparing something as subjective as tyres, it's best to look for trends. Not to say that details aren't important, but the sheer difficulty of providing (publicly) truly objective and comparable results can make things difficult.

For example (I suspect you're well aware of this) some tests concentrate on dry performance (enthusiast publications like Sport Auto) while some place a solid emphasis on wet performance, esp. aquaplaning resistance for safety reasons, and/or rolling resistance (consumer publications like ADAC, Auto Bild, Auto Zeitung, etc). Just another factor which can alter the final rankings.

Also the Auto Zeitung results are "bias towards wet performance, and subjective feel of the tyres isn't judged." So whilst they said the Goodyear "offering precise feedback" it doesn't get any points for that. And whilst the Pirelli had the best wet lap and braking time, it was only average in aquaplaning, yet still wins the wet category because it's only based on the times, and not other handling characterises, feedback, or subjectiveness.

That's true, though it must be said the Pirelli beat every tyre in the wet by some margin, with the Dunlop, Goodyear and Hankook being best of the rest.

Yet in the Tirerack test, the Pirelli has equal worst wet scores, that being what won it the Auto Zeitung results.

Also true, but that's only one test. At a glance, the P Zero has a pretty respectable trophy case in my view.

So as I said, we can't reasonably conclude that test a tyre not present in one test which happens to beat it's winner in another test is the best overall..

Correct, if you may say so yourself.

The tyre fitment used in the two tests I previously mentioned were at least identical (225/45 R17), but the Germans used an Audi A3 (i.e. VW Golf) whereas the Americans used a BMW 3-series.

To date, there are a total of three tests listed on tyrereviews.co.uk for the Michelin PSS (done in 17", 18" & 19" fitments) and has won each of the dry performance categories. Based on this information and the test I already mentioned, I'm fairly confident the Goodyear F1A2 won't better the PSS in dry.

So the general trend that I've observed is that the Michelin PSS is the best road tyre you can currently buy - in regards to dry performance - so I stand by my initial post.


Also, I've never advocated that the Michelin PSS is the best overall road tyre you can buy, I find it quite clear which audience Michelin are aiming this tyre at. Many other tyres have the PSS (let alone its predecessor, the PS2) beaten in aquaplaning resistance, and considering the F1A's past form, I can confidently predict the F1A2 will only widen that gap without the need for another tyre test.

And finally, note that the F1A2 has only one test to its name so far (ignoring that subjective test with little objective data), and though it didn't totally dominate the wet performance category, more tests are need to form a trend and really see what's what. But again, due to its past form, I still expect it to perform very well in regards to wet performance and in general (which it has TBH).

[Fixxxer]

Apparently the Assy2's are the ducks nuts, but Goodyear said they don't think any are in the country as yet.
I thought the PSS were made as a specialty tyre as standard fitment on OEM prestige HP cars, and from what I have read of testing, are more dry tyre focussed. PS3's are more a dry+wet compromise.
I'm looking to replace the Conti2's in a month or so, a quick ring around got me:
PS3's - $269
Adrenalin2's - $249
Yoko Advan v103 - $329, S-drive $269
Goodyear Assym2's - "Likely around $380"
Conti3's - $309
Pirelli Pzero Rosso - $289?
Think I'm gonna go with the PS3's for good price & dry/wet performance.
Fixxxer

[Corey_R]

Also, I've never advocated that the Michelin PSS is the best overall road tyre you can buy, I find it quite clear which audience Michelin are aiming this tyre at. Many other tyres have the PSS (let alone its predecessor, the PS2) beaten in aquaplaning resistance, and considering the F1A's past form, I can confidently predict the F1A2 will only widen that gap without the need for another tyre test.

But that's the thing, the PSS' are clearly not the best dry tyre. There are a bunch of semi-slicks which are better. So if you're looking at overall, F1A2 are it. If you're looking at dry only, then go get a good semi-slick

[Diesel_vert]

Not the best dry tyre, no.

As you point out, any tyre in the next performance category (i.e. track or track-orientated tyres) would be superior in terms of dry performace (see my list).

But the best road tyre in the dry? As it currently stands, yes.

That said, the PSS is said to do pretty well on the track (for a road tyre), but it ain't no Pilot Sport Cup, that's for sure.

[gareth_oau]

twice a year, Goodyear do a 'buy 3 get 4th free" sale

Last set of tyres I bought were $600 each, so this sale offered me a nice saving!

[Ideo]

Worth bearing in mind that different tyres react to different cars in different ways.

Toyo T1R are a great example. Abysmal on a large car, great on a small car. Pirelli P6000 are the reverse