"severe operating conditions" - service indicator at 7500km

[Getti]

Maybe Robbie will when he comes out of hiding???

I thought the information provided by Rob Burns (or "Robbie" as you referred) was useful and contributed to the discussion - that is what each member is here for afterall.

I emailed VW (rather than call) so I can simply cut and paste their response.

I asked VW the following "can you please advise if the warranty would be voided on the new VW should we choose to change the oil every 7,500kms rather than every 15,000kms".

VW's response did not refer to any voided warranty issues and was very breif. The response was the following ... "we do recommend that your first service be completed at 15 000km's or 12 months. Thereafter, should you prefer to change the oil every 7 500km's, this would be acceptable".

This seems to confirm posts that I have read by other members that VW put a special "running in" oil in the car for the first 15,000kms. Despite the alternative theory that it is best to change the oil after 1,000kms or very early on in the new car ownership, I think I will run with the advice of the worlds largest car manufacturer on the basis that they have spent a few dollars on research.

[barrenjoey owl]

I thought the information provided by Rob Burns (or "Robbie" as you referred) was useful and contributed to the discussion - that is what each member is here for afterall.

I emailed VW (rather than call) so I can simply cut and paste their response.

I asked VW the following "can you please advise if the warranty would be voided on the new VW should we choose to change the oil every 7,500kms rather than every 15,000kms".

VW's response did not refer to any voided warranty issues and was very breif. The response was the following ... "we do recommend that your first service be completed at 15 000km's or 12 months. Thereafter, should you prefer to change the oil every 7 500km's, this would be acceptable".

This seems to confirm posts that I have read by other members that VW put a special "running in" oil in the car for the first 15,000kms. Despite the alternative theory that it is best to change the oil after 1,000kms or very early on in the new car ownership, I think I will run with the advice of the worlds largest car manufacturer on the basis that they have spent a few dollars on research.

With due respect VWA haven't aswered your question as put by you, especially about voiding the warranty. may I suggest that you go back and ask them to answer it in more detail

Please advise the Technical specifications of this "special running in" oil. Posters repeating urban folk stories is hardly an authoritive source.

[Getti]

With due respect VWA haven't aswered your question as put by you, especially about voiding the warranty. may I suggest that you go back and ask them to answer it in more detail

Please advise the Technical specifications of this "special running in" oil. Posters repeating urban folk stories is hardly an authoritive source.

I agree that VWA did not answer the question, and to be honest I did not expect them to put in writing whether the warranty would be voided or not. I find no need to go back and ask them the question as my VW has now done 50,000kms and I have not changed the oil outside manufacturer recommendations.

However, I think the response included two important issues:
1) Acceptable to change the oil every 7,500 after the first service
2) VWA recommend that the first oil change is completed at 15,000kms

I won't pretend to know the technical specifications of the running in oil. The "urban folk story" that I have heard is that the first oil placed in the vehicle is a "mineral based break in oil" rather than a "synthentic oil". Someone here may be able to comment further that knows about oils ... but not me.

Barrenjoey Owl, the gist of my post was that ... if VWA recommend to me to (1) do the first oil change at 15,000kms and not sooner (2) change the oil every 7,500kms after that if I wish ... then I will be following their recommendation.

I don't think VWA will ever put in writing whether the warranty will be void or not, and I can understand why.

[WEDEL.1]

Rob you really have put yourself in a hole here.

Despite the fact many posters have disagreed with you, that evidence from a user manual recommending Oil Changes before 15,0000ks or 12months you try and deflect this by telling people they should check with VWA. May I suggest that YOU use the contact page or go to your Service Manager if you do indeed work at a VWA dealer(????) . If you are "VW trained" which at this stage is not completely apparent, your asertion that driving conditions in Australia don't meet ths criteria is clearly false and misleading. Any VW tech would know your statement is C**p.


We're all here to help each other, posting spurious information does no one any good especially you.

Regards

PS My posts have been polite and to the point.

That's downright hostile!

[Transporter]

Despite the alternative theory that it is best to change the oil after 1,000kms or very early on in the new car ownership, I think I will run with the advice of the worlds largest car manufacturer on the basis that they have spent a few dollars on research.

They also spent a lot of money on court settlements, repairing sludge damaged engines (of course only to those that were regularly serviced with recommended oils ) and not just once in the history. For some it is a history, despite the court settlement was just last 1/2 of 2010.

It is everyones choice, and I do understand why you trust the manufacturers recommendations and prefer to stick with 15,000km oil change intervals. After all most of new car buyers will sell their car within 5 years and should have no problems related to oil.

The VW504.00/507.00 oils despite the cost, are just made from HC group3 base oils, so I don't expect they would have high resistance to oxidation.

And I don't believe that VW use mineral running in oil from the factory, they may put (and maybe not) special additives in the first oil to protect the engine from harsh environment at the sea during long transport. Some cars are already 6 months old when first driven on the road. So, if you wait another year before you change the oil, I think it is plain wrong, since no oil will last that long under severe driving conditions, certainly not the running in mineral oil.

As I said earlier, I changed oil in our new Tiguan at 1000 km and I'm glad I did. Non of our VW vehicles is using any oil between oil changes and they all had very early first oil change. For these that are fussy about their car and run it in the old fashion way, remember that transmissions and the diffs should have oil change at 10,000-20,000km.

I see too many noisy diffs too early on the cars made 2005-on.

[hooba]

Go to any new car forum and you'll find a long thread hotly debating whether taking the manufacturer's advice on the first oil change should be heeded or not.

In the "pro" camp, the argument generally goes something like:
1. They've always charged for the oil as part of the 1000km service, so what does [INSERT MANUFACTURER NAME) have to gain by pushing it out? They only stand to lose as they are taking on more warranty risk, so they must be sure its ok.
2. Metallurgy technology has improved significantly since the old days, hence no need for 1000km oil change any more.
3. Oil technology has improved significantly since the old days, hence no need for 1000km oil change any more.
4. The engine is bench tested and "run in" the factory and the very first oil change has already been done for you.
5. You need the factory oil in it for enough time in order for the rings to seal properly.
6. etc, etc

In the "against" camp, the argument usually goes:
1. It's cheap insurance, why wouldn't you do it?
2. Evidence of the metal filings in the bottom of an oil pan after a 1000km change.
3. Evidence of recent warranty claims against [INSERT MANUFACTURER NAME], proof that they don't always get it right.
4. I've done it all my cars since the 70's, and I've never had an engine failure.
5. I'm going to keep my car for at least x years and x kms, so I want to make it will last until then.
6. etc, etc

You either belong to one camp or another, so be happy with your position because it is right for you.

[barrenjoey owl]

The orginal thread of this post was:

My tdi has had its service in xxxx km come up, which will be a 7500km interval. The manual says that it could be just an air filter change indicator. Apparently the dealer 'can tell' why the car thinks it needs its service so soon.... Is there a way to check this with vagcom?

It's funny how threads and the posts within them can get twisted out of context.

[Getti]

You either belong to one camp or another, so be happy with your position because it is right for you.

Very well said. And at the end of the day I guess that both of these camps comprise of car owners that care for their cars by either (1) following manufacturers recommendations or (2) doing something outside the manufacturers recommendation because they beleive it is better.

These two camps are better than the 3rd camp that fails to service their car on time

[Transporter]

The orginal thread of this post was:

My tdi has had its service in xxxx km come up, which will be a 7500km interval. The manual says that it could be just an air filter change indicator. Apparently the dealer 'can tell' why the car thinks it needs its service so soon.... Is there a way to check this with vagcom?

It's funny how threads and the posts within them can get twisted out of context.

Then it was set to variable servicing interval and computer decided that it was the time for the oil change.

[nutttr]

Then it was set to variable servicing interval and computer decided that it was the time for the oil change.

Turns out it wasnt! The dealer (god knows why) set it to 7,500km and 182 days. Silly dealer.

[Maverick]

It is everyones choice, and I do understand why you trust the manufacturers recommendations and prefer to stick with 15,000km oil change intervals. After all most of new car buyers will sell their car within 5 years and should have no problems related to oil.

The manufacturers recommendation in the owners manual also says for severe operation 7,500km services are advisable, if they didn't want you to change the oil before 15,000kms it would say this.

And I don't believe that VW use mineral running in oil from the factory, they may put (and maybe not) special additives in the first oil to protect the engine from harsh environment at the sea during long transport. Some cars are already 6 months old when first driven on the road. So, if you wait another year before you change the oil, I think it is plain wrong, since no oil will last that long under severe driving conditions, certainly not the running in mineral oil.

I've seen some oil tests performed on new cars out of the factory and the oil specs are similar to 504.00/507.00 oils, there is nothing from Volkswagen to say that they use special run in oils in any of the documentation I've seen and short of the occasional dealer saying it's a special run in oil there is nothing to back it up.

As I said earlier, I changed oil in our new Tiguan at 1000 km and I'm glad I did. Non of our VW vehicles is using any oil between oil changes and they all had very early first oil change. For these that are fussy about their car and run it in the old fashion way, remember that transmissions and the diffs should have oil change at 10,000-20,000km.

I waited until 6,000kms but I would not have any hesitations in doing it earlier, my dealer never advised against it and with zero evidence to back up the claims (warranty cancellation, special run in oil and magical pixy dust) and with some knowledge of oils, wear, engines along with the information in the owners manual the oil was changed.

IMO the whole oil should not be changed prior to 15,000kms is a myth that is self perpetuating, if this was a requirement what about people that only do 2,000kms in the the year, surely they would have to wait longer and strike a balance between kms and age if the oil is required to run the engine in properly? And why is there no mention of it in the manual?

[bazzle]

Aplol for going slightly off orig topic......

Its also says 15k or 12 months so distance isnt the issue. (may only drive 2k in one long trip and sit there for 10 months)
I had mine dealer changed early , no probs, approved oil used.
Remember auto companies have to state environmental policies to use less natural resources. MPG is only one measure, oil is another, etc.
Its all done on risk assessment. So the longer they can hold off the better they look

Bazzle

[Transporter]

Aplol for going slightly off orig topic......

It's OK mate, the OP knows his answer. So, anything on severe operating conditions and servicing is ON topic.