Baby seat to suit MkV

[acdcfan]

Hi all
My wife and I are expecting our first child. She is 15 weeks pregnant I am looking for baby seat. I am over the moon
I really do not want to purchase it online because I believe that P&H will be quite high. So I though I post in here and see if anyone know where I can get the baby seat that will be suitable for MkV to make use of locking mechanism that is provided on then back seats.
I googled it but could not find much info.
So if anyone knows where I can go and get it, it would be very much appreciated

[TFSIBabyCarriage]

Hi all
So I though I post in here and see if anyone know where I can get the baby seat that will be suitable for MkV to make use of locking mechanism that is provided on then back seats.

The locking mechanism you are talking about is ISOFIX - it is a European standard for affixing group 0 and group 1 child seats.

UNFORTUNATELY there are no seats available that utilise the technology in Australia. The Australian standards don't allow them - this is basically because of two main reasons:
1) The child seat market is pretty much tied up by Safe 'n 'Sound (Britax in the rest of the world), and they don't make one that uses it
2) Because Holden and Ford don't make cars with ISOFX, the ADR's don't have provision for it.

The ADRs are written around what is available in the country, and the ADR states that the baby seat must have a top tether strap (to stop submarining in an accident). ISOFIX seats use a 'leg' at the front instead of the top teather. Because of this, they are illegal.

Having said that, I have an ISOFIX seat, and I love it. I have weighed up the risks intelligently, and in independent and EURO NCAP testing it is the only 5 star rated seat available. I am happy with the seat I have, and in comparison to all others I have come across locally it is the best fitted and most solidly mounted seat I have seen.

I would be fined if I got pinged. Having said that, health professionals and police have not batted an eyelid. People regularly comment on how good it looks.

I bought it from Germany, and it ended up costing under $500 landed. Not cheap, but I am absolutely happy that the money was well spent.

I trust Eurpoean safety standards and European technology.

[Maverick]

The locking mechanism you are talking about is ISOFIX - it is a European standard for affixing group 0 and group 1 child seats.

<snip>

I bought it from Germany, and it ended up costing under $500 landed. Not cheap, but I am absolutely happy that the money was well spent.

I trust Eurpoean safety standards and European technology.

I thought that isofix still allowed or required the use of the top tether???

But agree with the rest of your post, I fully intend on purchasing one of the matching leather seats from Europe and to hell with our backwards ADR's.

They claim that 75-80% of all child seats are fitted incorrectly, well here is a system that will enable people to fit it correctly without having to spend 30 minutes on it.

My guess is that the ADR's will not be updated for at least another 5 years to accommodate the growing number of cars that take isofix baby seats.

[livingthedream]

The locking mechanism you are talking about is ISOFIX - it is a European standard for affixing group 0 and group 1 child seats.

UNFORTUNATELY there are no seats available that utilise the technology in Australia. The Australian standards don't allow them - this is basically because of two main reasons:
1) The child seat market is pretty much tied up by Safe 'n 'Sound (Britax in the rest of the world), and they don't make one that uses it
2) Because Holden and Ford don't make cars with ISOFX, the ADR's don't have provision for it.

The ADRs are written around what is available in the country, and the ADR states that the baby seat must have a top tether strap (to stop submarining in an accident). ISOFIX seats use a 'leg' at the front instead of the top teather. Because of this, they are illegal.

Having said that, I have an ISOFIX seat, and I love it. I have weighed up the risks intelligently, and in independent and EURO NCAP testing it is the only 5 star rated seat available. I am happy with the seat I have, and in comparison to all others I have come across locally it is the best fitted and most solidly mounted seat I have seen.

I would be fined if I got pinged. Having said that, health professionals and police have not batted an eyelid. People regularly comment on how good it looks.

I bought it from Germany, and it ended up costing under $500 landed. Not cheap, but I am absolutely happy that the money was well spent.

I trust Eurpoean safety standards and European technology.

any pics of your seat and a link to the site that you bought from OS? We are due in Janauray also with our first and we got a SnS for the XTrail and ahvent purchased anyhting for the jetta yet.

This has me curious as i didnt even realise that you couldnt fit a standard Aust bought baby seat in the Jetta. How does it pass ADRs to begin with if it cant have n ADR approved babyseat fitted?

Anyhow...link and pics apprecaited as im more than keen to go down this path (and did some one mention leather baby seat...sweet)

[TFSIBabyCarriage]

I thought that isofix still allowed or required the use of the top tether???

The standard does still allow for it, however as most european car manufacturers don't add it as standard to the vehicle, the seat manufacturers have generally gone without it. I found it impossible to source one with a top tether. The front 'leg' does the same thing and to me at least seems outrageously secure.

This has me curious as i didnt even realise that you couldnt fit a standard Aust bought baby seat in the Jetta. How does it pass ADRs to begin with if it cant have n ADR approved babyseat fitted?

Anyhow...link and pics apprecaited as im more than keen to go down this path (and did some one mention leather baby seat...sweet)

You can fit an Australian baby seat in the Jetta, no problems there. Its just that you cannot get on that uses the ISOFIX mountings (Aussie seats use the seat belt + top tether strap).

I bought mine from www.fitkiz.de

The seat I bought is a 'maxi-cosi cabrio fix'. www.maxicosi.com (but you ned to get the seat AND the ISOFIX (they call it 'easyfix') base unit as well.

The seriously added bonus that my wife and all her mothers club friends adore is that the capsule lifts straight out of the base and straight into the pram (Quinny Buzz or Quinny Zap both work) - ie it is what is known as a 'travel system'. No need to wake our daughter when we take her out of the car!

[blutopless2]

This has me curious as i didnt even realise that you couldnt fit a standard Aust bought baby seat in the Jetta.

yes you can... we have one fitted in our jetta.
all they require is the seatbelt and the tether to the parcel shelf hook.

[livingthedream]

Aaahhh...Thanks Guys.

Will continue to look in Aus then. However anyone know where you can get leather baby seats, havent come accross any in our travels thus far. Would suit the Jetta.

[Manaz]

The locking mechanism you are talking about is ISOFIX - it is a European standard for affixing group 0 and group 1 child seats.

ISOFIX isn't European at all. It's an international standard (ISO 13216 to be precise). Subaru for instance have ISOFIX anchorages in their cars, and there is a US equivelent (it is technically the same, they just call it LATCH).

UNFORTUNATELY there are no seats available that utilise the technology in Australia. The Australian standards don't allow them - this is basically because of two main reasons:
1) The child seat market is pretty much tied up by Safe 'n 'Sound (Britax in the rest of the world), and they don't make one that uses it
2) Because Holden and Ford don't make cars with ISOFX, the ADR's don't have provision for it.

The ADRs are written around what is available in the country, and the ADR states that the baby seat must have a top tether strap (to stop submarining in an accident). ISOFIX seats use a 'leg' at the front instead of the top teather. Because of this, they are illegal.

The ADRs are not built around what Holden and Ford make, that is a ridiculous assertion. There are ADRs (and have been so for some time) for systems/features that aren't implemented on locally built cars.

Your comment that Britax don't make ISOFIX seats is also quite simply untrue - check out the Britax UK website (http://www.britax.co.uk/), and look for the great big ISOFIX logo down the bottom). Do you really think that Britax would rather make seats just for a small market (Australia) rather than offer one range world-wide?

You are right about the reason behind the requirement for a top tether in the ADRs, but ISOFIX's primary difference to the ADR method does not revolve around the tether, but rather the use of a seatbelt (ADRs) or anchorage bar (ISOFIX). Just because the ADRs choose to deal with this in a different way to ISOFIX doesn't invalidate them.

Yes, that's right - the tether isn't the difference. ISOFIX actually has three "modes" of operation:

* Universal - requires a top-tether
* Semi-Universal - requires a foot-prop (under the front of the restraint) rather than a top tether.
* Vehicle-Specific - no top tether, only applies to vehicles explicitely specified in the standard.

I would be fined if I got pinged. Having said that, health professionals and police have not batted an eyelid. People regularly comment on how good it looks.

To be honest, who cares how good it looks, really. Do you have a child restraint as a fashion accessory, or do you have it to provide safety to someone important to you (your child).

I bought it from Germany, and it ended up costing under $500 landed. Not cheap, but I am absolutely happy that the money was well spent.

I trust Eurpoean safety standards and European technology.

I bought my mid/high range Safe 'n' Sound AHR convertible restraint for around $300, and it is as safe as anything you've bought from overseas - it just doesn't have the wank factor. I could have spent more money, but really, my child doesn't yet need iPod connectivity in his car seat.

I don't believe the Australian standard method for affixing a car seat is any less safe than ISOFIX when implemented correctly, and while the ADRs haven't caught up with the new ISOFIX standard, there's nothing inherently wrong with the current standard - in fact, ISOFIX's biggest selling point is that it makes it quicker and easier to get right, not that it actually improves safety over a properly installed top-tether restraint. In fact, that's probably why the ADRs haven't caught up - there's no urgency in approving a new standard that doesn't offer significantly better features than the existing standard requires.

Having said that, I have an ISOFIX seat, and I love it. I have weighed up the risks intelligently, and in independent and EURO NCAP testing it is the only 5 star rated seat available. I am happy with the seat I have, and in comparison to all others I have come across locally it is the best fitted and most solidly mounted seat I have seen.

As long as you don't whinge if you DO get pinged and told to go spend another $300 on an approved restraint, good on you for making that decision (with a caveat - ISOFIX is only approved for use without a top tether or foot-prop on specific vehicles - is yours one of those specific cars?). But please, don't go spreading lies and half-truths about the rules the rest of us follow - doing so does no-one any favours, and there is no reason why anyone who buys and correctly installs a seat which meets the current standards should feel guilty or inadequate for doing what they've done within the law.

[JP-009]

Hi acdcfan,

Congrats on the coming of your bub - many happy days ahead for you

I currently use a 'Safe and Sound' baby seat. It is quire expensive at around the $550 mark, but it is a great bit of kit.

Benefits are:
- it will fit in the MkV facing both ways (front and rearwards)
- it uses the normal seatbelt and rear anchor point (on the back,behind the rear seat), and
- it has an extendable spine/back that will 'grow' with the child (which is a great feature which will save you from buying a bigger/taller seat later when the child gets taller). So in the long run, it is a cheaper buy.

I will be buying another one for our second child who is due any day now.

The seats are bigger than other seats, but the MkV comfortably fits both seats in with the middle arm rest in the down position (which is a great place to store toys and dummies and other stuff for the bub.

I can also vouch for it's safety as it has saved the bub from any injury when the missus got cleaned up at an intersection (which caused significant panel and suspension damage to the MkV).

Hope this helps.

Cheers, JP

[TFSIBabyCarriage]

The ADRs are not built around what Holden and Ford make, that is a ridiculous assertion. There are ADRs (and have been so for some time) for systems/features that aren't implemented on locally built cars.

From what I have read from a number of sources, there is ISOFIX approval ready to go in Australia and it is in fact the local car manufacturers that have held it up.

To be honest, who cares how good it looks, really. Do you have a child restraint as a fashion accessory, or do you have it to provide safety to someone important to you (your child).

I don't care how good it looks. I should have said "how safe and secure it looks". I stand by the assertion that it is more securely fitted than anything I have seen in other people's cars to date. Maybe it is just a problem with their fitting, but I am happy.

The fact remains it is the best designed capsule I have seen for a number of reasons, and yes, I have checked out the Australian ones.

I bought my mid/high range Safe 'n' Sound AHR convertible restraint for around $300, and it is as safe as anything you've bought from overseas - it just doesn't have the wank factor. I could have spent more money, but really, my child doesn't yet need iPod connectivity in his car seat.

Capsules are different to convertible seats, as I am sure you are also aware.

I have read the overseas consumer tests, and I am happy that the safety of the seat I have chosen actually exceeds all other available seats.

I have done my research, as I am sure you have done yours. I am happy, you are happy. There is no need to get abusive about it.

[OilBurna]

we are going to taiwan with my 2.5 yr old son for 6 weeks so have bought a maxi cosi seat to put in the mother in laws Volvo (ie IsoFix) so will let you know how it goes.

[acdcfan]

Hi acdcfan,

Congrats on the coming of your bub - many happy days ahead for you

Thanks JP.
We don't want to know the sex until it is born. I feel it si much better this way...

I currently use a 'Safe and Sound' baby seat. It is quire expensive at around the $550 mark, but it is a great bit of kit.

Benefits are:
- it will fit in the MkV facing both ways (front and rearwards)
- it uses the normal seatbelt and rear anchor point (on the back,behind the rear seat), and
- it has an extendable spine/back that will 'grow' with the child (which is a great feature which will save you from buying a bigger/taller seat later when the child gets taller). So in the long run, it is a cheaper buy.

I will look into it....
Is it available in the shops or online only? Does it have any particular name?

I will be buying another one for our second child who is due any day now.

The seats are bigger than other seats, but the MkV comfortably fits both seats in with the middle arm rest in the down position (which is a great place to store toys and dummies and other stuff for the bub.

I can also vouch for it's safety as it has saved the bub from any injury when the missus got cleaned up at an intersection (which caused significant panel and suspension damage to the MkV).

Hope this helps.

Cheers, JP

Off I go now to look for it

[JP-009]

Hi acdcfan,

We left the surprise for the birth of our first (like you), but for our second, we found out what it was – just for a different experience.

The baby seat we are using (and will buy again for the next bub) is a “Safe ‘n’ Sound Platinum AHR”

As mentioned before, the significant feature with this baby seat is that the back rest and head protection is extendable (to grow as the bub grows from an infant through to a 4 or 5 year old gnome of 18 kg).

Other features that we have found very useful are:
- speakers in the head rest that can plug into a portable DVD player, which is a great distraction for the bub on long trips (and means that us folk in the front can still listen to music (with the rear speakers turned all the way down) – just be careful not to turn up the baby seat speakers up too loud),
- the whole seat cover and cushions comes off within 10 minutes and can be thrown into the washing machine for those ‘accidents’,
- the seat-belts are easily removed for washing as well,
- once all the covers, cushions and belts are off, the plastic chair is easy to wash and dry,
- the top tether strap is anchored to opposing corners at the top of the baby seat (and not from the middle / centre-line) which offers better lateral stability,
- the release button for the tension adjustment is very easy to use, unlike some other ‘lift action’ release tabs found on other seats,
- and some other stuff that I like that I can’t remember at the moment.

I have 3 other cheaper seats that I consider to be a complete waste of money considering:
- the limited use I got from them, and
- how much harder they are to use .
(They have been cycled through the Mk1.)

Anyway, enough of my gibbering (and no, I do not work for the company – I just think that if you can afford it, spend the extra and gain a bucket load in quality and ease of use. The same reason that I bought the 2TDI Golf.)

I have not seen the “Safe ‘n’ Sound - Platinum AHR” available in regular department stores (such as Target, Big W, K-Mart, etc). We got ours from a dedicated baby shop, and I doubt very strongly that you will have to shop on-line for this product.

Just my opinions based on my experiences.

Good luck

JP

[acdcfan]

Hi acdcfan,

We left the surprise for the birth of our first (like you), but for our second, we found out what it was – just for a different experience.

I think it is much better that way

The baby seat we are using (and will buy again for the next bub) is a “Safe ‘n’ Sound Platinum AHR”

As mentioned before, the significant feature with this baby seat is that the back rest and head protection is extendable (to grow as the bub grows from an infant through to a 4 or 5 year old gnome of 18 kg).

Found a shop in WA that has them it is called "Baby in a budget", and it is close to where I live

Other features that we have found very useful are:
- speakers in the head rest that can plug into a portable DVD player, which is a great distraction for the bub on long trips (and means that us folk in the front can still listen to music (with the rear speakers turned all the way down) – just be careful not to turn up the baby seat speakers up too loud),
- the whole seat cover and cushions comes off within 10 minutes and can be thrown into the washing machine for those ‘accidents’,
- the seat-belts are easily removed for washing as well,
- once all the covers, cushions and belts are off, the plastic chair is easy to wash and dry,
- the top tether strap is anchored to opposing corners at the top of the baby seat (and not from the middle / centre-line) which offers better lateral stability,
- the release button for the tension adjustment is very easy to use, unlike some other ‘lift action’ release tabs found on other seats,
- and some other stuff that I like that I can’t remember at the moment.

Anyway, enough of my gibbering (and no, I do not work for the company – I just think that if you can afford it, spend the extra and gain a bucket load in quality and ease of use. The same reason that I bought the 2TDI Golf.)

I have not seen the “Safe ‘n’ Sound - Platinum AHR” available in regular department stores (such as Target, Big W, K-Mart, etc). We got ours from a dedicated baby shop, and I doubt very strongly that you will have to shop on-line for this product.

Just my opinions based on my experiences.

Good luck

JP

Thanks JP

[Maverick]

I don't believe the Australian standard method for affixing a car seat is any less safe than ISOFIX when implemented correctly, and while the ADRs haven't caught up with the new ISOFIX standard, there's nothing inherently wrong with the current standard - in fact, ISOFIX's biggest selling point is that it makes it quicker and easier to get right, not that it actually improves safety over a properly installed top-tether restraint. In fact, that's probably why the ADRs haven't caught up - there's no urgency in approving a new standard that doesn't offer significantly better features than the existing standard requires.

The statistics show otherwise.

Around 75% of baby seats are not fitted correctly.

Isofix removes the problems of fitting a baby seat as it has two latches.

Which is the better system? Why aren't the ADR's being updated? Why do we even need an ADR for baby/child seats when we could adopt the European standards?

"Incorrectly fitted seat belts and child restraints is a major cause of injury and death to NSW children aged 0 to 4 years."

"Between 2003 and 2005, badly fitted belts and restraints contributed to 33 per cent of child deaths and 37 per cent of injuries, where the child was a passenger in a vehicle."

source: http://www.walk.com.au/pedestriancou...sp?PageID=2284

"Recently, in Germany. Langweider et al (2003) reported on a study of correctness of installation using ISOFIX type devices. These authors reported that they found 97% of ISOFIX forward facing child restraints, and 100% of ISOFIX rearward facing child restraints were installed correctly. This
was a vast improvement from earlier studies conducted by this group, which had shown that almost two thirds of all installations using conventional anchorage systems in Germany were found to be incorrect."

"A limited amount of laboratory testing of prototype rigid (and semi rigid) anchorage systems has been conducted both in Australia and elsewhere in the world over the past ten years. The main benefit of rigid lower anchors over the current Australian method of anchorage, in terms of crash
protection, is their ability to reduce sideways lateral displacement and rotation of child restraints in side impact crashes (Kelly, Brown, Griffiths 1995, Brown et al 1997)."

"Henderson (1994) highlighted the role of misuse involved in casualty crashes included in his sample of children using forward facing child restraints in Australia. Henderson (1994) reported that of the 38 children using forward-facing restraints, five were using their restraints incorrectly at the time of the crash. Four out of the five were associated with injury or death. " (If 75% of the current baby seats are fitted incorrectly and by incorrect fitment you have a 80% chance of death why keep using this old standard that obviously has SERIOUS flaws).

source: http://www.racv.com.au/wps/wcm/resou...t%20Report.pdf

"Research by RACV indicates that child restraint systems provide better
protection for children than adult seat belts provide for adults. Children
travelling in correctly installed restraints are 70% less likely to be killed or
seriously injured in the event of a crash.
Although Australia has a high restraint usage rate, with over 95% of Australian children being placed in a child restraint, studies show that many child restraints are incorrectly fitted, which reduces the effectiveness of the restraint system. Studies of child restraint use show that more than 70 per cent of children were not correctly restrained and that almost one in three installations had significant safety related problems. "

source: http://www.pc.gov.au/__data/assets/p...245/sub038.pdf

As long as you don't whinge if you DO get pinged and told to go spend another $300 on an approved restraint, good on you for making that decision (with a caveat - ISOFIX is only approved for use without a top tether or foot-prop on specific vehicles - is yours one of those specific cars?). But please, don't go spreading lies and half-truths about the rules the rest of us follow - doing so does no-one any favours, and there is no reason why anyone who buys and correctly installs a seat which meets the current standards should feel guilty or inadequate for doing what they've done within the law.

Latch isn't the equivilant of ISOFIX, Latch has the two lower mounting points plus a top tether (which most cars that have ISOFIX have) but the Latch standard has four methods of fixing to the lower mounts including webbing. So much for being easier to use.

ISOFIX and Latch using the rigid connector are FAR superior to the current backwards 1960's thinking of the Australian ADR's. All the evidence you need is out there, all you have to do is remove your blinkers and take a look.

Personally I will buy an ISOFIX unit for my car because I would rather get the best protection that I can, if it costs $200 more so what? If I can get it in easy clean leather that matches my car that's even better, so what if it costs me a little more because this is my choice but at the end of the day why would I purchase a system that I KNOW is inferior and does not and cannot offer the same protection as ISOFIX.