ECS Brake Kit Options - opinions wanted

[Rybky]

So I discovered yesterday that I am in desperate need of new rotors and pads all round on my Bora. Just having a look what ECS have to offer and would like some advice as I have no experience of rotor and pad brands/types!

I am not looking to do a major upgrade so looking at the OEM kits, considering ceramic pads as I hate brake dust on my wheels, so specifically:

Volkswagen Jetta IV VR6 24v > Braking > OEM > ES#257388 ECS Complete RPS Kit With Brembo Rotors And PBR Ceramic Pads - 1J0698023

Volkswagen Jetta IV VR6 24v > Braking > OEM > ES#2075206 ECS Complete RPS Kit With Brembo Rotors And Akebono Euro Ceramic Brake Pads - 1J0698082

Volkswagen Jetta IV VR6 24v > Braking > OEM > ES#2075207 ECS Complete RPS Kit With Meyle Rotors And Akebono Euro Ceramic Brake Pads - 1J0698083

Volkswagen Jetta IV VR6 24v > Braking > OEM > ES#257377 ECS Complete RPS Kit With Meyle Rotors And PBR Ceramic Pads - 1J0698018

Questions:

1. Any recommendations for Brembo vs Meyle rotors?
2. Any recommendations for APR vs Akebono pads?
3. Are ceramic pads a good choice? Other options there are standard or APR Metal Master. Looking for low noise and low dust.

Thanks!

Adam

[Dyldo]

most of the time I have no idea what i am talking about - and this is no exception

I can't offer any help on the first 2 questions but the 3rd is interesting. Firstly, ceramic in brake systems, to my understanding, is used for heat dissipation because of the adverse effect of heat on braking and stopping power. So i'm not really sensing a big benefit in ceramic pads other than bragging rights? Happy to be wrong, cause then i'd learn something.

Moreover, this whole pad dust thing; simply put, brakes work according to the (not) simple rules of physics and energy. As we know, energy is a closed loop and has to go somewhere. it can't just disappear. Broadly energy goes from potential to kinetic. In this sense of braking, the pad is compressed onto the rotor and the energy in the rotor is transferred to friction and therefore heat and sound energy thereby slowing the car down (by taking away its kinetic energy in motion). Thus, the pads are designed to wear down (convert themselves from pads to energy) and therefore the pad dust is a bi-product of this whole little shebang.

therefore, for efficient braking, we like dust. we want dust. right?

[Rybky]

Maybe the dust things comes down to how sticky the dust is? With ceramic it is probably not as fine and not sticky, so it comes off still but doesn't coat your wheels? Just guessing!

Adam

[Manaz]

Firstly - be aware that the US model cars and our cars have some differences in the brakes fitted - you'll need to confirm the size of the brakes on your car, and then confirm that you're getting the same sized rotors (and pads to suit). The V6 4Mo Boras here got 312mm front/256mm rears, I believe the Golf GTI here got 288mm fronts (not sure on rears, but smaller than 256mm), I'm not sure off the top of my head what the V5 Boras got though - you need to be sure before ordering.

On the rotors - the manufacturer of unslotted/drilled rotors won't make a big difference really - which is why Brembo don't charge a big premium for their rotors.

Ceramic is now used in brake pads as a friction material that doesn't leave as much sticky dark residue on wheels (it's also better when the pads get hotter, they won't lose friction as much).

[Manaz]

Moreover, this whole pad dust thing; simply put, brakes work according to the (not) simple rules of physics and energy. As we know, energy is a closed loop and has to go somewhere. it can't just disappear. Broadly energy goes from potential to kinetic. In this sense of braking, the pad is compressed onto the rotor and the energy in the rotor is transferred to friction and therefore heat and sound energy thereby slowing the car down (by taking away its kinetic energy in motion). Thus, the pads are designed to wear down (convert themselves from pads to energy) and therefore the pad dust is a bi-product of this whole little shebang.

therefore, for efficient braking, we like dust. we want dust. right?

Spot on about how brakes work - the friction itself provides very little of the stopping power, it's the conversion of kinetic energy into heat that does most of the work.

Australian/Japanese cars tend to run hard rotors and soft pads - but European cars tend to run much harder pads - it's not unusual to see a set of rotors on a Euro car thrown out when the pads are worn out, whereas on Aus/Japanese cars, that'd be considered horrible. But in the end, it's a compromise either way - something has to give

[Rybky]

Firstly - be aware that the US model cars and our cars have some differences in the brakes fitted - you'll need to confirm the size of the brakes on your car, and then confirm that you're getting the same sized rotors (and pads to suit). The V6 4Mo Boras here got 312mm front/256mm rears, I believe the Golf GTI here got 288mm fronts (not sure on rears, but smaller than 256mm), I'm not sure off the top of my head what the V5 Boras got though - you need to be sure before ordering.

On the rotors - the manufacturer of unslotted/drilled rotors won't make a big difference really - which is why Brembo don't charge a big premium for their rotors.

Ceramic is now used in brake pads as a friction material that doesn't leave as much sticky dark residue on wheels (it's also better when the pads get hotter, they won't lose friction as much).

Hmm, what's the best way of finding out what the V5 has? Does that website with the online parts catalogue cover the V5?

Thanks for the info on the rotors, if there is not much difference then I will go for the cheaper ones.

Adam

[Manaz]

Hmm, what's the best way of finding out what the V5 has? Does that website with the online parts catalogue cover the V5?

VAGCAT? Should do...

[Rybky]

VAGCAT? Should do...

That's the one!

Adam

[Rybky]

VAGCAT? Should do...

OK, not convinced it does cover my car ...

Bora/Variant/4Motion 2002

I guess the PR-??? refers to the code in the middle of the VIN? In which case mine is 1JZ which is not given as an option there.

Adam

[goodfella]

I thought it was confirmed that V5 has the same 312mm rotors that the V6 4mo has up front!

If so, refer to the Mk1 Audi TT 225hp as its the same setup as ours

[balkanac]

i got my front rotors and pads from ECS. I got genuine rotors and EBC redstuff and i thnk they are great. The dust is there, and like someone said, if you want your car to brake properly, the dust has to be there.
I had a set of some Mintex pads before and 2/3ds of the dust was gone compared to genuine pads (textar i think), but 2/3ds of the breaking power was gone too, which you really feel.

So im all for the dust. I need my car to brake, not look clean after a month of not washing it

[Rybky]

I thought it was confirmed that V5 has the same 312mm rotors that the V6 4mo has up front!

If so, refer to the Mk1 Audi TT 225hp as its the same setup as ours

And I thought this would be easy.

So what is the important measurement to look at, just the diameter?

Adam

[Rybky]

OK, I am getting closer I think, found this site that actually lists the parts for the 2002 Bora V5:

2002 VOLKSWAGEN BORA Rotor

However, there are options there for 280mm, 288mm and 312mm diameter front rotors, seems to be dependant on the "PR No", anyone know what that is? I assume it is the centre 3 characters of my VIN which for me is 1JZ but that is not an option on that page.

Adam

[Dyldo]

PR numbers explained bro

ATE Brakes -PR numbers on vehicles of VW Group

payment in beer

[Rybky]

PR numbers explained bro

ATE Brakes -PR numbers on vehicles of VW Group

payment in beer

Awesome! Thanks mate. You have beer credit with me!

Adam