GTI owners, do you have traction in 1st gear?

[McDub]

Quick question for you gti owners that have had their car chipped/flashed/tuned

From a rolling start, if you floor it in first, do you loose traction completly? i.e. do your wheels spin? (without using the clutch obviously)

When answering, please also mention you other mods, including what wheels and what rubber you have.

copy and past this for your reply if you could

Do my wheels spin in first gear?:
Mods:
Wheels:
Tyres:


My answer is...

Do my wheels spin in first gear?:
No, my wheels don't spin if the road is dry. They may move just a tad quicker than the road speed on occasion, but pretty much it keeps traction.

Mods:
- Flash
- 2.5" full turbo back exhaust
- silicon t.i.p
- R1 D.V, N75J
- H&R sport springs, KYB shocks

Wheels: 18x8" rep aristos


Tyres: Kumho KU31 225/40 R18


Reason i ask is because i think there's somethign up with my car, surely it should be able to spin the wheels up in first? Not that this is my intention, but it's just some sort of indication of power.

I've had the car looked at thoroughly and logged to death and everything apparently appears to be fine. Though i'm not sure if it has been logged in 1st and 2nd gears. This is where i find the car doesn't feel as good. In higher gears, the car feels much much nicer. It's like the faster acceleration or higher revs in 1st and 2nd gears is too much for the transmission/ecu/igntion or something....

thanks for your help

[Lito]

Hey there,
Do my wheels spin in first gear?:
Yes, quite easily. I don't have to be near wot to spin the tires in 1st (in the dry), I am yet to brake traction going into 2nd but I think that's because I'm subconciously over-caring for my clutch and gearbox. Also, I could still brake traction on my stock clutch.
Mods:
- APR Flash
- 3" full turbo back exhaust
- Afe stage 1 intake
- ECS stage 1 clutch, G60 SMF
- ECS stage 2 re-fresh kit (don't know if that counts as a mod)
- R1 D.V
- Eibach Pro Kit springs and bilstein B8 shocks
Wheels: 18x8" rep aristos


Tyres: Kumho KU31 225/40 R18

[McDub]

thanks for the response. i've got pretty much the exact setup as you minus the intake kit (and i've also got the stage 1 ecs clutch, and stage 2 refresh kit...)

I just don't get it, my car must be cursed. No-one seems to have a clue.

anyone else?

[JustCruisn]

Mine will spin up if I try hard enough, eg 3k clutch dumping. But generally no spin even on hard launches.
I found the aftermarket wheels make it a lot harder to get spin on take off.
And the Kumhos have a lot more grip than I ever expected from a cheap tyre.

- APR Flash
- 2.5" full turbo back exhaust
- BMC intake
- Forge 007 DV
- New stock clutch and flywheel
- Eibach Pro Kit springs and stock shocks
- 90 durometer dogbone inserts

Wheels: 18x8" rep A8s
Tyres: Kumho KU31 225/40 R18

[graeme86]

No problem with R32

[McDub]

Mine will spin up if I try hard enough, eg 3k clutch dumping. But generally no spin even on hard launches.
I found the aftermarket wheels make it a lot harder to get spin on take off.
And the Kumhos have a lot more grip than I ever expected from a cheap tyre.

lol, any car can spin the wheels if you clutch dump
Interesting you've got almost identical mods to lito, including 18x8 reps (possibly the a8's are a touch heavier, not sure) and ku31's, but it seems you've got considerably less power (or more traction), than him...
i don't think he would be getting that much more power from a larger downpipe... so what's goin on there i wonder


need more responses!

[Lito]

Yeah I don't know what's going on guys, just to clarify I can get the wheels spinning from a rolling start anywhere above 2500 rpm. If I drop the clutch and plant the accelerator my car doesn't go anywhere just sit there spinning the wheels. U don't think it has anything to do with grip because I'm running the same Tyres as you guys. I actually thought my car was down on power after getting beaten (barely) by a ek9 civic. But I've also kept up with a stock mkv r32 and almost kept up with modded ones (btw I do not endorse or condone street racing...). If I were you id get some logging done In 1st and 2nd gear, maybe your wastegate is opening early?

[McDub]

yep just got a $20 ebay cable, arrived today. gotta try and get some software that will work with this cable... hopefully won't be too hard.

[McDub]

I couldn't get the ebay cable to work but i've been lent a genuine HEX+CAN ross-tech cable.

Car seems ok, nothing out of the ordinary that i can see.

The MAF reads a pretty consistant 150g/s @6000rpm.

What sort of readings is everyone else getting?

[mikinoz]

I don't think in gear wheel spin is a great performance indicator.

Have you ever put it on a dyno, you might find something out if you did - ie. AFR?

[McDub]

I don't think in gear wheel spin is a great performance indicator.

Have you ever put it on a dyno, you might find something out if you did - ie. AFR?

I know its not the best indication of power, it at least give you some idea though, particularly as all the people who answered have almost identical setups including rubber.

So then can people say what MAF reading they get? That's definetely a better indicator.

But yes, i've put it on the dyno maybe 4-5 times, and i'm sick of it costing me $100 each time i do it. It's just showing me what i can already feel, hear and see.
And yes my A/F is very rich, about 10.5:1
It has been like this with two different tunes.



First tune with stock exhaust, and stock wheels. Went great for a week, and spun wheels like crazy in first.
Then after a week it lost power (and could not spin the crappy stock rubber in first now matter how hard you tried) and so i eventually got it dynoed, and as you can see it made pretty much identical peak power to a stock gti:




Then i got a different tune. This time I had the full 2.5" turbo back, as well as aristo rep wheels and KU31's. It would spin the wheels up in first.
Felt good for the first week and i got it put on the dyno out of interest. Most runs were about 110kw, somehow the 7th run got this figure of 117kw (you would have thought heatsoak would have reduced not increased power..)





Then shortly afterwards, it seemed to loose power just like it did with the first tune, and it no longer would spin up in first.
Though it is certainly not as bad as it was with the first tune, though that is likely due to the exhaust.

Bit of a mystery to me and many others.

[mikinoz]

I know it might be obvious but have you tried a different diverter? And a boost leak check?

[noone]

The tyres should be fine, as long as your pressure is in the right range. I would expect your wheels are making sheepskin more difficult due to increased unsprung weight.

I have similar engine and mods in the Polo, i don't tend to have wheelspin, but i don't let it rev through.

I'd be looking at your spring, shocks and maybe an updated front sway (or LSD). Has helped me.

Looking again, there are some other possibilities... Stock dogbone, other bushes, if your bushes are shot, it I'd not difficult for a wheel to slip. Most likely just 1 wheel, bushes on 1 side could be badly worn. This would let the wheel move around in the wheel arch. Try putting in neutral with handbrake on and moving the front wheels. If they move forward & back, could be control arm bushes.

[McDub]

I know it might be obvious but have you tried a different diverter? And a boost leak check?

yep first thing i did was change my stock DV to an R1.
I have not permormed a boost leak check as it seems to be boosting fine. peaking at around 19-20psi, and as you can see from the above graph, tapers off to about 10psi at 6000rpm. seems about right for a k03.

The tyres should be fine, as long as your pressure is in the right range. I would expect your wheels are making sheepskin more difficult due to increased unsprung weight.

I have similar engine and mods in the Polo, i don't tend to have wheelspin, but i don't let it rev through.

I'd be looking at your spring, shocks and maybe an updated front sway (or LSD). Has helped me.

Looking again, there are some other possibilities... Stock dogbone, other bushes, if your bushes are shot, it I'd not difficult for a wheel to slip. Most likely just 1 wheel, bushes on 1 side could be badly worn. This would let the wheel move around in the wheel arch. Try putting in neutral with handbrake on and moving the front wheels. If they move forward & back, could be control arm bushes.

you could be on the money there, when i thought i noticed it lost power this second time, it was shortly after i had a the stage 2 suspension refresh kit installed as well as my shock and springs. and this was what i first put the stop in wheel spin down to, but the more i thought about it, the more i felt something was still up.

so yeah my car is probably OK, still running too rich IMO though, something funky seems to always happen at ~ 4000rpm.

[meh]

Check your motor and trans mounts aswell as suspension, when they move too much it affects initial power transfer to wheels