Bora V5 suspension options

[Rybky]

Not getting much input on my thread in the wheels and suspension forum so putting it here as well!

I really want to do something to improve the ride of my Bora V5, it is all a bit loose and wallowy at the moment.

I am going to get the ECS Stage 2 refresh kit so hopefully that will help the numb steering feel.

With my previous car (Nissan X-Trail) I had Koni adjustable shocks and a whiteline rear swaybar fitted and the transformation of the handling was amazing even on stock springs. The ability to adjust the damping on an SUV was perfect and when firmed up it really reduced body roll and dive under braking.

Based on that previous experience I am thinking that with the Bora I will do something similar, adjustable shocks are overkill though as I won't need to change handling characteristics. Also I can't lower it as the front already just scrapes a little as I enter my underground parking, any lower and I would rip the front off.

So, if I am looking to just replace the shocks for something with more damping to firm up the ride a little, what would you recommend? The only experience I have is with Koni.

Regarding sway bars, my understanding is that if a car understeers adding a stiffer rear bar will correct that, if it oversteers adding a stiffer front bar will correct that. With the Bora I think it is inclined to understeer, hard to tell as the ESC cuts in! In which case a stiffer rear bar would help to sharpen the steering. Does this sound right?

Oh and new wheels & tyres will be on the cards at some point, will be looking to go 17/18" with around a 225 or 235 tyre, so that will help handling too but this is some way off.

Thanks,

Adam

[Manaz]

The Mk4 chassis is definitely an understeerer when stock - even the 4Mo cars (though they start to correct it once power starts heading rearwards).

A stiffer rear bar will make the rear end more lively, and to a degree help to dampen the understeering nature of the car - particularly on throttle lift. Stiffer shocks and springs all round (if you have the originals in it, you'll find they're quite soft by now) will help as well, as they'll stop the car from shifting to quickly/far onto the outside suspension under cornering, which enhances understeer behaviour.

If your suspension's as wallowy as my 4Mo suspension was when I got it, replacing it with a matched set of sport shocks and springs will make a world of difference. I'd leave swaybars alone until you sort out the struts and springs (as much as a swaybar may be intially cheaper, it won't fix the issue with your shocks/springs, and you may find that stiffer swaybars aren't needed for your driving style once the shocks/springs are sorted.

You may actually find that new springs raise the car slightly, as if you have the original springs, they've almost certainly sagged.

The Stage 2 refresh kit is definitely worth doing regardless. If you hold off on the installation and do springs/shocks at the same time, you'll save on labour/time off the road.

Rob

Not getting much input on my thread in the wheels and suspension forum so putting it here as well!

I really want to do something to improve the ride of my Bora V5, it is all a bit loose and wallowy at the moment.

I am going to get the ECS Stage 2 refresh kit so hopefully that will help the numb steering feel.

With my previous car (Nissan X-Trail) I had Koni adjustable shocks and a whiteline rear swaybar fitted and the transformation of the handling was amazing even on stock springs. The ability to adjust the damping on an SUV was perfect and when firmed up it really reduced body roll and dive under braking.

Based on that previous experience I am thinking that with the Bora I will do something similar, adjustable shocks are overkill though as I won't need to change handling characteristics. Also I can't lower it as the front already just scrapes a little as I enter my underground parking, any lower and I would rip the front off.

So, if I am looking to just replace the shocks for something with more damping to firm up the ride a little, what would you recommend? The only experience I have is with Koni.

Regarding sway bars, my understanding is that if a car understeers adding a stiffer rear bar will correct that, if it oversteers adding a stiffer front bar will correct that. With the Bora I think it is inclined to understeer, hard to tell as the ESC cuts in! In which case a stiffer rear bar would help to sharpen the steering. Does this sound right?

Oh and new wheels & tyres will be on the cards at some point, will be looking to go 17/18" with around a 225 or 235 tyre, so that will help handling too but this is some way off.

Thanks,

Adam

[Rybky]

Thanks Rob, very sound advice. Hadn't considered that the springs my have sagged by now and that I could replace them with some that don't reduce height.

Adam

[goodfella]

Can you get new springs made to eom specs - ie stiffer spring rates but retain the height? Give Allsprings @ Moorebank a call, i dealt with them years ago and I had nothing but great service.

[Manaz]

You'll probably find that the original shocks are gone too, and aren't giving anywhere near the control that they should be giving, so doing springs only may only fix half the issue. You'd also want to be careful that you chose springs that matched the shocks you're likely to buy later as well - whereas if you go for a matched set to start with (Bilstein B8 shocks for instance, with matched H&R springs), you know you're taking care of compression and rebound at the same time.

[Rybky]

I would definitely not change the springs without changing the shocks as well.

Adam

[Gravey]

Eibach + Bilstein B8's here and I am very happy. She feels a lot tighter and more predictable going into corners, and although the ride is a lot stiffer, it certainly isnt uncomfortable

I only got about 15mm drop with the Eibach Pro Kit and I very rarely scrape if I'm careful.

BEFORE


AFTER

[Rybky]

Gravey, from the pics it looks like the drop was mainly at the back, front looks about the same to me. Is that the case? Or did the front drop too?

Would like to lower it but really can't, the front lip just licks the concrete now as I enter the underground parking.

Adam

[dylan8]

Would like to lower it but really can't, the front lip just licks the concrete now as I enter the underground parking.

Wow, wonder if that ramp was made to AUS standard... 4mo lip youd rip it clean off.

Id be worried about the underside of your car behind the front wheels if theres a slope reversed to that as it sits alot lower then the front lip. (as in a lowered bora with 60mm clearance under the car, the front lip is still up at 90-100mm clear)

[Rybky]

Wow, wonder if that ramp was made to AUS standard... 4mo lip youd rip it clean off.

Id be worried about the underside of your car behind the front wheels if theres a slope reversed to that as it sits alot lower then the front lip. (as in a lowered bora with 60mm clearance under the car, the front lip is still up at 90-100mm clear)

I would question if any part of the block is built to any standards!!!

My understanding is that the V5 and 4mo actually sit at the same height, definitely lower than the 2.0, I remember reading a V5 review that specifically called this out.

I don't think there is anything lower than the lip behind it, the lip just touches as the wheels hit the change of angle, so from then on it lifts again as I move forward anyway.

Come to think of it, someone in my block has a Boxster that gets in ok, so maybe my springs have sagged a lot!!

Adam

[Manaz]

I assume you're entering and exiting on an angle to reduce the effective approach/departure angle issues?

[Rybky]

I assume you're entering and exiting on an angle to reduce the effective approach/departure angle issues?

Not much space to do that, the entrance is only about 1.5 car widths with a wall each side. If I take it really slowly then it usually does not touch, if it does it only grazes the lip anyway.

Adam

[Gravey]

Gravey, from the pics it looks like the drop was mainly at the back, front looks about the same to me. Is that the case? Or did the front drop too?

Would like to lower it but really can't, the front lip just licks the concrete now as I enter the underground parking.

Adam

yeah it really just evened the car up, though the front did drop a bit

[goodfella]

I found the same effect when I installed R32 springs in my Bora, the rear dropped noticably but the front stayed relatively the same, with very minor drop.

If this is the case, then it might actually help your cause as the approach angle is slightly increased as the rear drops

[dylan8]

I would question if any part of the block is built to any standards!!!

My understanding is that the V5 and 4mo actually sit at the same height, definitely lower than the 2.0, I remember reading a V5 review that specifically called this out.

I don't think there is anything lower than the lip behind it, the lip just touches as the wheels hit the change of angle, so from then on it lifts again as I move forward anyway.

Come to think of it, someone in my block has a Boxster that gets in ok, so maybe my springs have sagged a lot!!

Adam

measure your car and see how high it is, there is diagrams floating around showing what it should be from memory (had it as my background on my old PC) do to the front lip and find the lowest point on the car (im sure youll find its lower). someone else pointed out a while back that their golf was at 120mm or something clear BEFORE lowering due to sagging, so could be the case.
just because i can get the front lip over something doesnt mean i can get the rest of the car. only place i hit the front lip is a small ramp into my own carport, go over 5km/h in and you here it touch. like you there is no room to take it at a angle. I have to take work and our local maccas slow at 45o angle otherwise i hit the front lip and everything. then on the way out the front lip clears the speed bump but the rest of the car doesnt (no more maccas drive through for meeee)