coilover experience.

[Jarred]

oh yea I see what you mean man. I can't imagine that ride would be any good at all, without the helper springs and at the lowest setting. i might try it one day, to see how low it really goes, but I'd have to clearance the RHS chassi first probably.

[gtimk5]

I am still confused as to why you guys want to drop your cars so low?
For everyday road cars it doesnt make any sense to me at all, you must have perfect roads over there, tho I found the Hume hwy pretty bad with crowns in it heading towards Melbourne.
Handling wise you really need suspension travel.
I know I will probably get flamed for my opinion, but I spose I will have to accept that....

Cant wait to see how many have clearanced there RHS driveshaft at the DOVW, not interested in scraping sumps, leaking sumps on public roads yes...

[Jarred]

I am still confused as to why you guys want to drop your cars so low?
For everyday road cars it doesnt make any sense to me at all, you must have perfect roads over there, tho I found the Hume hwy pretty bad with crowns in it heading towards Melbourne.
Handling wise you really need suspension travel.
I know I will probably get flamed for my opinion, but I spose I will have to accept that....

Cant wait to see how many have clearanced there RHS driveshaft at the DOVW, not interested in scraping sumps, leaking sumps on public roads yes...

Only live once I guess? young and stupid? I donno. I just want to cause I think it looks good. This isn't a race car, not is it set up for great handling etc. Not trying to flame you Andrew, because you've said nothing wrong, it's just an explaination. (the purpose of this 'experiment' wasn't to be lower though)


I'll give you a turn behind the tiller if you want, then you can experience them first hand. I dont drive too far everyday, so it's not too bad, if I was doing lots more kms than I am, I'd have a different car all together!

[Tim]

I am still confused as to why you guys want to drop your cars so low?
For everyday road cars it doesnt make any sense to me at all, you must have perfect roads over there, tho I found the Hume hwy pretty bad with crowns in it heading towards Melbourne.
Handling wise you really need suspension travel.
I know I will probably get flamed for my opinion, but I spose I will have to accept that....

Cant wait to see how many have clearanced there RHS driveshaft at the DOVW, not interested in scraping sumps, leaking sumps on public roads yes...

Some people prefer show before go.. I think its as simple as that. Kinda like really heavy 19" wheels on my GTI. They detract from the performance but they sure to look awful purty

[evorobin]

This is pretty much exactly what i was going to say.

Basically, when there's a dip in the road, the helper spring extends the shock to follow the road. This makes the ride smoother. It's not very stiff, so it doesn't (or shouldn't) affect the rebound during cornering much at all, but helps over bumps in day to day running. Otherwise when you go over a dip, the wheel doesn't extend down far enough and becomes unweighted, followed by it coming "crashing" down to the road (with the full corner weight on top of it) and onto the fairly hard main spring. That's what makes the ride feel harsh. Well, one of the reasons anyway..

Just seen this and agree with Preeny the helper spring keeps the main spring sured. While people will do this I certainly wouldn't recommend it unless for a smooth race track.

[revnit]

[quote] Revnit: i don't see how you gained extra clearnace, as the helper spring and the main coil are the same outer diameter. unless you run your coils rather 'high' with lots of thread left for adjustment..?? [quote/]

i don't run my car as low as sum i also run 16s ( with the helpers in they rub on the springs ) the platforms sit a couple mm above the tyre still plenty of thread left you can see my sig picture how it sits, but my new rims i have coming run a different offset and also better tyres so i will be putting the helpers back in

[Preen59]

I am still confused as to why you guys want to drop your cars so low?
For everyday road cars it doesnt make any sense to me at all, you must have perfect roads over there, tho I found the Hume hwy pretty bad with crowns in it heading towards Melbourne.
Handling wise you really need suspension travel.
I know I will probably get flamed for my opinion, but I spose I will have to accept that....

Cant wait to see how many have clearanced there RHS driveshaft at the DOVW, not interested in scraping sumps, leaking sumps on public roads yes...

I kinda have to agree with Andrew..

I'm even contemplating winding the Caddy up 15 or so mm to give me a bit more shock travel and ground clearance. I have a reasonable amount as it is but i still scuff the subframe if i'm not careful on a really bumpy road, and that's just not good.

Low is cool for a show yes, but worth the hassle for day to day driving? Sorry i don't really think so.

[gtimk5]

I am not out to cause trouble, its up to each person with their own preference.
As far as enjoying your car though, I think ride and handling is far better.
Its great that we all dont think the same otherwise the roads would be an even more boring place than they are!
Cheers, Andrew

[Spyda]

I get where you guys are coming from but straight up who are we kidding a mk1 is a POS, why the hell not get some sparks flying and impress your mates? Its not like the ride is that much more comfortable at a normal hight.

[rayray086]

you guys are crazy.

the spring rate of the keeper spring is low, true, however it plays an important role. see, it might not be in use when the car is sitting on its wheels, flat (could be completely coil bound) but as you go over and bump and the suspension extends, it helps the suspension to extend as load is removed from that wheel, as the main spring, being so hard, cannot extend very far. furthermore, it will help control the load up of that strut again as weight goes back on, since the sppring will resist the loading a little.

maybe i'm just getting old (okay, i am, holy crap im nearly 24) but running too low just causes soooooo many problems.

Ah, I didn't think of that way...

So what about coilover systems that originally don't use a helper spring? E.g. the Koni don't use a helper spring but I suppose that's made up for with a progressively-wound spring instead (http://www.velocitymotorcars.com/ima...over_d-131.jpg). However there are other coilover systems that seem to use an "ordinary" (for want of a better word - non-progressive?) main spring with no helpers at all, like the Ksports - http://media.photobucket.com/image/k.../k-sports1.jpg. How would they combat the problem? The way I see it, they'll work exactly like the Hottunings without a helper spring, except spring rate may be different.

Andrew: yeah the low thing is just all for looks. Yes it can be uncomfortable, and unsafe re: suspension travel, but on the road I just see it as a matter of the driver's restraint... it still drives and handles OK on the road, just don't be a maniac behind the wheel (pretty much the mentality behind driving a fast car). I'm pretty sure I will get flamed for this but I have the same opinion as you but in regards to power - I don't see the use in having so much power in a road car, unless it's also being used for the track. My 2.0L 8V Mk3 is slow (can I get an award for Most Obvious Quote please?) but it's enough to do the daily commute while still have some fun on a spirited run... (or maybe this is just the jealousy talking ).

[Jarred]

Ray I reckon you're right about the progressive springs on the koni's, the lighter wound stuff would keep the spring in contact with both perches at all time (well, i reckon atleast)

and if you think your 2.0 is slow, and has no power, wait till you have a drive on my GLD! you wont know yourself then!

[gotrice]

who are we kidding a mk1 is a POS, why the hell not get some sparks flying

LOL such a good quote!

[gotrice]

Do I just got the raceland coilovers in and for the most part am happy. What I am not happy about is that MK3 steelies won't fit without rubbing!!!! Only at the front though but still. Lucky I have a spare set of rims with a slightly different offset or I would have had to pull the whole lot out.
They drive ok too. All in all mostly happy

[Preen59]

Ah, I didn't think of that way...

So what about coilover systems that originally don't use a helper spring? E.g. the Koni don't use a helper spring but I suppose that's made up for with a progressively-wound spring instead (http://www.velocitymotorcars.com/ima...over_d-131.jpg). However there are other coilover systems that seem to use an "ordinary" (for want of a better word - non-progressive?) main spring with no helpers at all, like the Ksports - http://media.photobucket.com/image/k.../k-sports1.jpg. How would they combat the problem? The way I see it, they'll work exactly like the Hottunings without a helper spring, except spring rate may be different.

Andrew: yeah the low thing is just all for looks. Yes it can be uncomfortable, and unsafe re: suspension travel, but on the road I just see it as a matter of the driver's restraint... it still drives and handles OK on the road, just don't be a maniac behind the wheel (pretty much the mentality behind driving a fast car). I'm pretty sure I will get flamed for this but I have the same opinion as you but in regards to power - I don't see the use in having so much power in a road car, unless it's also being used for the track. My 2.0L 8V Mk3 is slow (can I get an award for Most Obvious Quote please?) but it's enough to do the daily commute while still have some fun on a spirited run... (or maybe this is just the jealousy talking ).

It depends on the spring rate of the spring in that kit and the valving of the damper itself. I'm not going to go into it too deeply because i can't explain it all it one post as far as shock control and suspension balance etc goes, but...

In the case of the Hottunings, they have a very hard main spring, so the main spring has little sag (how much the spring compresses when from being static to when the vehicle is placed on the ground) compared to a regular run of the mill street car spring, hence what i said about the helper spring in my last post..

Now, if you have a softer spring it will sag more, which in turn means it can extend further on an uneven surface and can help follow the road better. Then you can have your shock control to suit more on the handling side..

Springs and suspension is very, very complicated. Not all springs are the same. There are many variables eg: Overall diameter, material diameter, number of coils, spring material, heat treatment etc. And then you have the dampers...