Oil Consumption - 2.0 TDI

[ilovemytdi]

New time blogger so sorry if this has been raised before but..... I have MkV 2.0 TDI Golf, bought it new in February 2008. At about 8000kms (6 months) the oil lamp came on and when I called VW Service they said to bring it in and all they did was top it up.

I want to know if this is a common problem? They told me that the diesel engines may use more oil than normal when wearing in but nonetheless I found this somewhat odd after what I consider to be a relatively short time.

Has anyone else had this same problem?

[Russ59]

Hi and welcome to the Forums.

I only have 4,500 k's up on my TDI GT and so far it hasn't used any oil to my knowledge. I understand from what I have read on the forums that oil usage in the first 10,000 k's or so is not uncommon, so I wouldn't be too concerned. This issue is supposed to be mentioned in the user manual as well so it might pay you to have a bit of a read. In the meantime all you can do is keep an eye on it and when it needs topping up drop into VW and get it done. It is important however that the correct grade of oil is used so don't just use any old oil if it's need a top up, VW are apparently pretty fussy about that as well when it comes to warranty claims. If you have any other concerns or issues with your vehicle don't be afraid to ask, or do a search first, there is bound to be an answer to your query on here somewhere.

Russ

[Spoddy]

I want to know if this is a common problem? They told me that the diesel engines may use more oil than normal when wearing in but nonetheless I found this somewhat odd after what I consider to be a relatively short time.

Has anyone else had this same problem?

Pretty much exactly what happened with mine. Nepean Motor Group topped me up at about that distance and then again at about 14,000km. No charge either.

At the 15,000km they did the service and it has used almost none since. Now due for the 30,000km service.

[BeigeJet]

My Jetta used about 1/2 lt @ 6,000k before the 15k service. No light though!

None between 15k and 30k.

None between 30k and 45k.

Got paranoid while away recently and bought a litre while passing through Sydney and only topped up with 200ml during as 4,200k round trip. Now at 54k and no further use.

Cheers and happy motoring!

[gregozedobe]

You might find this thread relevant

http://www.vwwatercooled.org.au/newforum/upload/showthread.php?t=21499

[Pumpe-Düse]

Apparantley VW thinks its normal for engines to burn lots of oil, so you'll have to check the oil more regularly then usual. My 1.9 TDI Polo's manual advises engine is expected to use 1.0L/1000km; possibly more depending on driving style.

[Transporter]

It is not that hard to check engine oil once a week.

[ilovemytdi]

Thanks heaps everyone for your replies, and for the the previous thread - was a good read.

I *do not* check my oil regularly but I do make sure I know when it needs to be changed/checked. I'll definately keep an eye on it now though!

[Preen59]

try leaning on your engine harder for the first 5000 kms or so. The oil consumption is due to poor seal on the rings, and to help them bed in you will actually need to push your engine hard, rather than baby it.

Read this: http://vwwatercooled.org.au/newforum...hlight=running

[gregozedobe]

The oil consumption is due to poor seal on the rings, and to help them bed in you will actually need to push your engine hard, rather than baby it.

I've been wondering for a while if the reason some TDI engines use a lot of oil is related to poor oil seals in the turbo. I've seen lots of photos of TDI intake manifolds that are really clogged up, and I thought that might be due to a mixture of oil and soot from EGR. I've also read of lots of reports of intercoolers and associated pipework literally dripping with engine oil (on the inside).

AFAIK the only way oil can get into the intake internals is by leaking from turbos, and I know that if it gets really bad the engine will "run away" by burning the oil.

I have read about large numbers of 4 cyl VAG TDIs turbos self-destructing over the last few years (the 2.0 TDI in the Skoda Octavia seems particularly prone according to the BRISKODA site). These failures seem to be bearing and oil related (rather than sticking vanes).

What do others think of this theory ?

[Preen59]

AFAIK the only way oil can get into the intake internals is by leaking from turbos, and I know that if it gets really bad the engine will "run away" by burning the oil.

Thats wrong.

The oil in the inlet is more likely from the crank case breather, and the reason, again, that you get this is from poorly sealing rings and/or labouring the engine.

You get blow by which intern gives you high crank case pressure, which vents to the inlet. Oil vapor condenses in the inlet tract, settles in places like the bottom of the intercooler.

[gldgti]

discussion getting old

guys, i have to say, this is all getting a bit tired. i'd like to advise that participants in threads that degrade into taking pot shots at eachother or re-justifying OPINIONS be discontinued due to their content being of NO VALUE to the forum.

please, PLEASE refrain from adding volumes of worthless opinionated comments to the forum. its a waste of your time, and others.

furthermore, PLEASE DO engage in a healthy discussion of facts.

overall - this forum is here for us to share experience, and learn from one another. not to whine and complain about life, other people etc.

the diesel section is generally a useful section with good discussions and good information. lets all do our best to keep it that way.

rant over. thanks.

[gldgti]

I've been wondering for a while if the reason some TDI engines use a lot of oil is related to poor oil seals in the turbo. I've seen lots of photos of TDI intake manifolds that are really clogged up, and I thought that might be due to a mixture of oil and soot from EGR. I've also read of lots of reports of intercoolers and associated pipework literally dripping with engine oil (on the inside).

AFAIK the only way oil can get into the intake internals is by leaking from turbos, and I know that if it gets really bad the engine will "run away" by burning the oil.

I have read about large numbers of 4 cyl VAG TDIs turbos self-destructing over the last few years (the 2.0 TDI in the Skoda Octavia seems particularly prone according to the BRISKODA site). These failures seem to be bearing and oil related (rather than sticking vanes).

What do others think of this theory ?

as preeny stated, oil in the intake is most likely a consequence of crankcase ventilation gasses.

you are correct to assume that oil in the intake could be from leaking turbo seals, however this is incredibly unlikely with a diesel engine, since the intake tract between turbo and engine NEVER see's any vaccum (if it does, it is VERY small, like 1 in/hg.

one thing that is noteworthy, however, is that there is a complex relationship between different areas of the engine and the pressures they run at - specifically -

>under high load/boost, blowby gasses will pressurise the crankcase, and produce a heavily oil-laden air mixture into the intake

>also under high load/boost, the turbo oil drain is less effective, as the engine oil pressure feed through the turbo-bearings must then work AGAINST crankcase pressure. this makes the total pressure across the turbo intake and exhaust oil seals higher, and would result in more seal leakage, if it was occurring at all. however, this is unlikely to account for a large part of the intake tract oil

>an intercooled intake tract provides the perfect place for oil to separate from the intake air due to sudden pressure decrease/temperature decrease across the intercooler (dynamic scenario) and thus oil will accumulate here. i would go as far as to state that would be perfectly normal to find some oil in the intercooler of a turbocharged diesel engine.

having said all that, that amount of oil usage that is "normal" is a direct result of how well the piston rings have bedded in, and how the vehicle is driven. the Volkswagen TDI engine is not a "throw-away" engine - it is engineered for long service life with high mileage. because of this, components such as rings/pistons/cylinder bores are hard, expensive components, and take large service cycle time to wear in. an engine does not "run in" within 1000km.... or even 2000km. and it is normal, particularly in diesel engines, for characteristics such as oil usage and fuel consumption to take many tens of thousands of km to stabilise, depending heavily upon how the vehicle is used.

all of these points should be considered when assessing how much oil your engine is using.

[250 downunder]

I have a 2.0l TDI which I have only owned a short time, however during the 3,500 kms. covered since purchase it has used virtually no oil [current mileage is 21,500] so I can't chip in with any complaints about oil onsumption.
I would like to add a little about problems associated with crank case ventilation. I have an F250 with a 7.3l turbo charged, intercooled V8 and after some modifications it now runs up to 30 psi boost. At this boost level I encountered a problem with intercooler boots blowing off. I was horrified with the amount of oil that I found inside the tubes. Clamped silicon tubes and oil certainly don't mix. Initially I diverted the breather to the rear of the truck but found the foul smell and fuming unacceptable. Next move was to introduce the breather tube into the exhaust. I did this by welding a 3/4" tube into the exhaust [close to the rear] at an angle of 45 deg. with the end of the tube also cut at 45 deg. - looking for a venturi effect. I used a simple manometer to check for pressure at this point and found that I had a very slight vacuum over the entire rev range. The truck has since covered several thousand kilometers with no more blown intercooler boots and no doubt a more efficient intercooler.
Seems that a similar setup for the Golf could be a future project.

[gldgti]

I have a 2.0l TDI which I have only owned a short time, however during the 3,500 kms. covered since purchase it has used virtually no oil [current mileage is 21,500] so I can't chip in with any complaints about oil onsumption.
I would like to add a little about problems associated with crank case ventilation. I have an F250 with a 7.3l turbo charged, intercooled V8 and after some modifications it now runs up to 30 psi boost. At this boost level I encountered a problem with intercooler boots blowing off. I was horrified with the amount of oil that I found inside the tubes. Clamped silicon tubes and oil certainly don't mix. Initially I diverted the breather to the rear of the truck but found the foul smell and fuming unacceptable. Next move was to introduce the breather tube into the exhaust. I did this by welding a 3/4" tube into the exhaust [close to the rear] at an angle of 45 deg. with the end of the tube also cut at 45 deg. - looking for a venturi effect. I used a simple manometer to check for pressure at this point and found that I had a very slight vacuum over the entire rev range. The truck has since covered several thousand kilometers with no more blown intercooler boots and no doubt a more efficient intercooler.
Seems that a similar setup for the Golf could be a future project.

very interesting indeed - although i'd like to put it closer to the turbo (where its still nice and hot) to give it a chance to burn off.

i hear you on the intake pipes blowing off - i've only just managed to sort the piping in my mk3 to keep them from blowing off too - i've TIG'd big nobbly's around the ends of all the stainless pipes so that once the hose clamp is tight, it physically wont allow the silicone hose to slide off.