125kw TDI Golf MkV BMN - Engine Speed Sensor (G28) and P3138 Intake Manifold Dev Errs

[Pete N]

So the coil light started flashing today on my Golf Mk5 2.0 TDI (125kw) 2008 with BMN engine.

I got the following from VCDS:

2 Faults Found:
000801 - Engine Speed Sensor (G2 <--- This has been happening for a while with no coil light
P0321 - 006 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 00000001
Fault Priority: 5
Fault Frequency: 7
Reset counter: 37
Mileage: 148272 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 07:05:53

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 160 /min
Torque: 0.0 Nm
Speed: 0.0 km/h
Time: 0.01 s
Angle: 0.0 °
Bin. Bits: 00000000
Bin. Bits: 00000001

012600 - Intake Manifold Runner Control <--- This is new...
P3138 - 006 - Regulation Deviation
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 11000001
Fault Priority: 5
Fault Frequency: 2
Reset counter: 40
Mileage: 148332 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 08:51:41

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 2560 /min
Torque: 0.0 Nm
Speed: 73.0 km/h
Mass Air / Rev.: 468.7 mg/str
Mass Air / Rev.: 588.6 mg/str
Lambda: -20.3 %
Text: Kein Messwert verfuegbar

I have looked up the Intake Manifold Runner Control issue and it looks like a replace of the manifold might be in order, Unless a clean will fix it. Maybe a sticky valve ?

Can anyone suggest what I should look for to help diagnose this issue - My EGR needs a good clean, and the car goes pretty well most of the time, although often when in idle, it can get real lumpy for no reason - intermittently..

I had a lot of problems with DPF and have them under control now. Cost me a couple of grand to get there though. Wish I had bought VCDS before getting into a limp mode situation !

Thanks!

[benough]

012600 - Intake Manifold Runner Control <--- This is new...
P3138 - 006 - Regulation Deviation
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 11000001
Fault Priority: 5
Fault Frequency: 2
Reset counter: 40
Mileage: 148332 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2000.00.00
Time: 08:51:41

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 2560 /min
Torque: 0.0 Nm
Speed: 73.0 km/h
Mass Air / Rev.: 468.7 mg/str
Mass Air / Rev.: 588.6 mg/str
Lambda: -20.3 %
Text: Kein Messwert verfuegbar

I have looked up the Intake Manifold Runner Control issue and it looks like a replace of the manifold might be in order, Unless a clean will fix it. Maybe a sticky valve ?

Can anyone suggest what I should look for to help diagnose this issue - My EGR needs a good clean, and the car goes pretty well most of the time, although often when in idle, it can get real lumpy for no reason - intermittently..

I have the identical car/engine, and his issue. The solenoid that pulls the flaps was filthy so I cleaned it. Unfortunately I forgot to put on bolt back in so it doesn't always move properly.

What I suggest is, if you are going to remove the EGR body and the shutdown flap, you should have enough access to clean the arm/rod that moves in and out to pivot/control the runner.

Do easy things first, as this rabbit hole can be hard to climb out of.

[Pete N]

Thanks Ben - thats interesting, and confirms a couple of things for me..

Spent a few hours trawling forums last night and it seems that the factory fitted BMN inlet manifold arm operates flaps in the vents, that at low speeds tumble the air to get better air/fuel mixing.

The flaps wear over time, due to a plastic seal not being protected from the heat (design flaw) and then oil starts to leak in/out the now floppy flaps.

The car smells of EGR type fumes when it starts (a strong smell, not normal diesel) and I have smatterings of oil coming from the O ring seal above the EGR, along with a fair bit of soot up in the chamber (I got a snappy with my phone by taking off the bottom pipe and shining a torch up there)

Its possible my EGR issues add to the DPF soot build up (my DPF gets to 40% every 4 days with very short journeys)

Anyhow, what I discovered is interesting.

It turns out that quite a few BMN engine owners (audi, skoda, golf and so on) have dumped the BMN plastic inlet and retrofitted a complete new alloy BKD inlet. This removes the flaps that cause the leakage issues, and gives the car a new lease on life, and runs smoother with no power difference.

I am mainly doing this because its 100 quid from the uk (plus 46 postage) instead of 425 quid for a factory plastic one, and is easy to fit.

Darkside in the UK even have a kit for it, being its a common issue.

https://www.darksidedevelopments.co.uk/products/ppd170-used-bkd-aluminium-inlet-manifold-conversion-kit.html

I chatted with them and its only a 2 hour simple job, they provide all the gaskets and some shorter/longer screws as the alloy manifold is slightly different.

This will negate the need for that arm, flaps, and generally make it more robust. The only issue is the low air pressure turbulence will not be present, however people who have done this say it runs fine at low revs, and this is probably due to the inside of the alloy manifold being a rougher surface and pre turbulating (?) the air..

I was quoted 6-8 hours to fit the new manifold by a well known VW shop, and the cost of the manifold is about $1k so for $100 quid + postage I am going to be well happy.

Are you having issues with your DPF too? I have that pretty much worked out if you are.. I bought the VCDS and cable and chack it every few days and make sure I burn down he freeway in top gear 2k revs fro 10 minutes, and all good. DPF light hardly comes on any more.

The G28 sensor is also reportedly triggered by soot build up somehow so hopefully that will be fixed too!

This car is a pain in the a$$ mechanically, non common-rail and DPF are not very compatible, but I love driving it.. so its worth trying to get more life out of it.

[benough]

Hey Pete.

My GT Sport TDI is 10 years old, has 268,000km on it and the DPF is apples. Never missed a beat, so I am going to let sleeping dogs lie. ONLY use BP fuel though.

I cleaned out my EGR/Control flap once, as well as my intake, was a bit of a waste of time. I have one of those Darkside straight through pipes, but the EGR has to go somewhere. I understood it that you need to have the EGR switched off via a ECU flash.

What I did do though, is put a blocking plate with a pea sized hole in it, on the EGR pipe, to let less crap in. It's a Skoda part. Car moaned a bit but got used to it after a while.

My philosophy is, once the oil is up to temp, mat it. Best thing you can do for these is drive them hard.

At least we are at a point in time now, where you can have a DPF cleaned inside the car for fairly cheap. That said I would love to delete it, and the EGR, and make it flow as God intended but the EPA are quite strict on this.

[Pete N]

Hi Ben,

Interesting - I only use Caltex...

I am going to do that to the EGR as well - maybe a slightly bigger hole.. How quickly does your DPF fill up before an auto regen? Do you monitor it with VCDS ?

I bought VCDS to save money - I had my DPF removed, cleaned and put back and it cost almost 2 grand. Wont make that mistake again - that was after limp mode and I was ignorant and the mechanic was expensive.

The clean was good though - DPFregen at milperra - $500 and it came back like new (less than 1% ash - not soot which burns off, ash doesn't) - much cheaper than a new DPF.

Went into limp mode more recently and got another mechanic to force regen ($700) and then realised I could do it myself with a $300 VCDS rosstech cable.

Now I just monitor it and take it up the freeway when needed. However I am trying to slow down the DPF build up because every 4 days is ridiculous.

I'll post back with how I go - I ordered the BKD manifold kit last night from darkside last night.

Cheers

[benough]

Over what time period did all this happen?

Yeah my regen happens every couple of days I guess?

I have a Polar FIS+ and I monitor what the DPF is doing with that. You can see it do a regen and the EGR's etc.

It really sounds like when you drive it, your trips are too short. Sounds like you're better off deleting the bloody thing.

Someone showed me the law on this, and there is a comment about exceptions, where if it's causing you economic pain or something, you can **** can it.

[Pete N]

Over what time period did all this happen?

About the last year..

I have a Polar FIS+ and I monitor what the DPF is doing with that. You can see it do a regen and the EGR's etc.

That looks neat! - Didn't know such a thing existed.. was planning to fit a small touch screen windows computer into the dash..

It really sounds like when you drive it, your trips are too short. Sounds like you're better off deleting the bloody thing.

Someone showed me the law on this, and there is a comment about exceptions, where if it's causing you economic pain or something, you can **** can it.

Interesting - I'll check that out.. not having a DPF would make my life much easier. The GTD models from 2009 on are Common Rail and work much better with the DPF and regens apparently..

[benough]

Or you could just get a delete of the DPF, but keep the canister and have a joining pipe welding into it, and a custom tune so it doesn't blow smoke.

But you didn't hear it from me...

[Pete N]

Hear what ?

Interestingly, since I deleted the Manifold error, it hasn't come back on...

In the meantime, is this the Polar FIS+ you bought ? I am trying to find it as well priced as poss..

http://www.all-stars-motorsport.com/en/water-temperature/5855-polar-fis-advanced-audi-seat-skoda-volkswagen-pf04.html#anchor-product-compatibility

Its 278EUR fromm the manufacturer - although not advanced it seems..
PolarFIS category - AutoPolar

Cheers

[Pete N]

Duplicate (how do I delete this?)

[benough]

That's it.

It's for readouts only. I use it to see what my DPF is doing, and other temps, but that's it.

I got it mainly for a speed readout from the ABS sensor, so it's accurate as possible, rather than the needle which is way off.

Here's a regen happening

[Pete N]

Thats awesome - definately getting one - found one in germany for about $350.

About to put the replacement Darkside Alloy inlet conversion kit in today.. replacing the plastic version. My son is helping - wish us luck lol..

I'll post how it goes, in case anybody else is interested.

[ak77]

Just like to add to this , as owner of GTd BMN Mk5 I had lots of experience with G28 sensor and other mentioned components.

Quickly just on price of VCDs cable is not 300 but in $600US

G28 sensor error on BMN engine will always throw a bad code in any bad cranking attempt ...

Bad injector will reflect bad crank and throw G28 error

Bad starter motor will not register on VCDs but will throw the same G28 error on cranking

EGR will he associated with same attempts resulting in starving the engine and Computer reading same G28 error. However the VCDs will log EGR sensor readings.





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Pete N]

Just like to add to this , as owner of GTd BMN Mk5 I had lots of experience with G28 sensor and other mentioned components.

Quickly just on price of VCDs cable is not 300 but in $600US

Thanks for the info - its a problem child this car.. but fun when it isn't doing a regen (every 3 days)

My VCDS cable is the 3 car edition USB and cost 199-299USD

HEX-V2 Enthusiast | Ross-Tech

I did change the manifold to the alloy one, works beautifully, but make it impossible to take out the oil filter properly, you have to pop the lid of the filter and then remove them seperately! - the alloy has a large overhang..

I still cannot beleive that teh DPF gets to 40% in 3 days of slow driving to work (about 15-30 mins in traffic each way)

[Pete N]

G28 Sensor replacement - TDI 2.0 BMN

Just like to add to this , as owner of GTd BMN Mk5 I had lots of experience with G28 sensor and other mentioned components.


G28 sensor error on BMN engine will always throw a bad code in any bad cranking attempt ...

Bad injector will reflect bad crank and throw G28 error

Bad starter motor will not register on VCDs but will throw the same G28 error on cranking

EGR will he associated with same attempts resulting in starving the engine and Computer reading same G28 error. However the VCDs will log EGR sensor readings.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

SO I just got this error again after having the sensor replaced 6 months ago, and I think you are right. Cranking issues throwing a g28 error don't necessarily mean its a G28 sensor error...

I am cranking on cold and hot starts, maybe 3 to 4 3 second attempts before firing. Some longer.

Been though a few diagnostic videos, fuel pump, filter, VVT (not sure I have this though) - not sure what to do yet.